Fun for Lazy kids

[mick91]

I have let them both have a go with saw and the older one with the hatchet, but i could not get him to understand the importance of not having his leg in range of his axe swing if he misses, i had to pull him on it well over a dozen times in about half an hour. I too carried a pen knife from an early age and was hoping to buy them both one at some point as their Dad is not around and i still remember getting my first knife fondly. But neither of them have shown me that they can be trusted enough to have any kind of edged tool. The older one just wanted to swing my hatchet above his head like they do in skyrim when chopping wood, when my wife tried to show him how to use it properly and safely he just lost interes straight away,

I have to admit I'm a great advocate of a few knife nicks do no harm, I carry many scars to this day and each one is a little lesson! Axes not so much however they don't give many second chances. I think it's something that has to be taught understood that an edged tool can wound very easily and worse. Maybe look into the opinel safety knives if you're worried about injury? I too remeber my first knife. My dad got it from the CLA gamefair (when I was arguably TOO young) a little non locker and still have it to this day sharpened down to little more than a stub. Maybe start with something like splitting wedges and a hammer and move on to axes? If nothing using a splitting wedge is a valuable skill and dangers are minimal

 

[Macaroon]

Reading through this fills me with a dreadful feeling of despair...........what's happening to people? But as has been said above I admire you for trying so hard and not giving up with these kids; I only hope they come to
appreciate it sometime in the future. Best of luck to you in your endeavors

 

[mick91]

One even brought a tin of deodorant and spare underpants in his man bag. They all had Skinny jeans on and some even wore pointy shoes, unlaced of course.

I came back from collecting wood to find them using the Deodorant can as a flame thrower. Lord help them.

I'm not even sure how to react to that I'm guessing said man bag was not a long back or bergan either? Practical is the way to go, leave fashion at the treeline. Or ideally further back

 

[Stevie777]

My heart sank a little when i met up with them. Then I laughed to myself when i thought of all the fun i was about to have at there expense. No, the Man Bag was just your average Metro-sexual number, he might even have had a matching Iphone cover to boot, i never noticed, i stopped noticing things after the underpant/deodorant debacle, but it wouldn't have been a surprise if he did...



Disco gear in the sticks.. Funny watching them try to keep the moss and bark from touching there Mackenzie and Stone Island clothing.. finger and thumb stuff.

 

[dwardo]

I started taking my nephew to the woods at about 14. At first it was hard work when you have to setup and pack away two sets of kit, constantly have an eye out for their safety.
I found it best to give your self the odd trip away with just your peers but at the same time keep up the trips out with him. More and more he learned how to look after him self and after a couple of seasons he was not only self sufficient but an asset to the group.

I am now proud to call him a friend over a nephew and one of the first people I could call to come away on a trip, be that the local woods or a longer trip to Scotland.

He lost his father and my friend at 14 so had to grow up quickly so probably had more incentive than most as did I but he too was of the xbox generation. Now he has a foot in both worlds and enjoys them both. He is now 18 and can hold his own in conversation with a group of adults twice his age, funny, whitey and an excellent soul.

Early on it is hard work but persistence is the key as is making things all a bit naughty/dangerous (apparently so anyway )

We shot air rifles, shotguns, hunted, the odd snaffle of something strong, trapped,, all the sorts of things that might be a little taboo but added some excitement. Birthdays and Christmas I bought him little bits of kit and bought him his first small knife. From there his first bow, proper knife, better tarp etc etc. These little bits kept him interested enough to carry on and then enjoy the woods for what it is.

He is now 18 and can out shoot, out woods, out bow, out rib and out drink the rest of us now. A top bloke..

You should carry on. Its not going to be quick and remember to take the odd trip out for your self.

On the axe side of things go for a longer axe if possible and have them kneel whilst using it. They can get more swing and only contact the floor. Look at shorter knives and something with less of a tip. Let them wear them on a belt with the proviso they only use it when in your company. Go looking for Gandalph sticks rather than boring old firewood. Make bows and arrows and get making some spring traps. Neither of these need to be used in anger but its half the fun.

atb and remember its a good thing that you are doing.

 

[GGTBod]

they are not called fashion victims for nowt

 

[mick91]

My heart sank a little when i met up with them. Then I laughed to myself when i thought of all the fun i was about to have at there expense. No, the Man Bag was just your average Metro-sexual number, he might even have had a matching Iphone cover to boot, i never noticed, i stopped noticing things after the underpant/deodorant debacle, but it wouldn't have been a surprise if he did...



Disco gear in the sticks.. Funny watching them try to keep the moss and bark from touching there Mackenzie and Stone Island clothing.. finger and thumb stuff.

I might only be in my 20s but I've no time for all that carry on mind you. Get muddy, grow your beard and enjoy yourself without worrying about applying hair gel! Always think you can tell an outdoor person in the rain, if they ignore it and don't break a stare in a force 9 Gale with driving rain they're a real outdoor bod. If they squint up like a rabbit in drizzle they're more your city types!
But I feel it may be a case of the same problem again, nobody to show them otherwise. Anything getting people outdoors is a great thing. No matter if it's standing knee deep in marsh mud at 2am or going for a woodland walk now and again in the sun. Either way it's better than sitting on an xbox

 

[GGTBod]

I know kids in my family who try to stay indoors when it rains in their video games

 

[Robson Valley]

Not kids. 40-somethings. One single set of fire starting kit. Mag. block, spark rod and a single knife.
Who can start a fire? How fast? Wonderful experiment.

Now with kids. Top grade kit as you would have for yourself. Why make them suffer with crappy gear????
When the time comes, the day comes (or night) and you NEED a fire, practice makes perfect.

Change the tinder, change the game. Versatility trumps.

 

[rik_uk3]

Lets not presume that everyone will enjoy camping, some people don't and thats fine, don't push our love of the outdoors on anyone. Seems to me they don't want to be there in the first place so don't take them.

 

[boatman]

Archery, air pistol, knife-throwing then develop from these.

 

[Zingmo]

It's a tricky one this. My first inclination was, like Rik, to just leave in front of their computer games. But I also know that I owe all my love of the outdoors to other people who put up with me when I was a teenager. So I asked my girls what they would suggest.

The younger one said to take them into the middle of the forest then run away and leave them there!
The eldest said make them sleep down by the river where they get eaten alive by the midges. Then they will not be able to sit still as they will be too itchy!


This got me thinking. Many young people feel that they are entitled to an easy life and with these two it would seem they are happy to be carried by any adult nearby. Maybe you shouldn't be making the woods easy or entertaining for them. Maybe you should be aiming to scare the pants off them. Once really hungry they will appreciate food all the more. Once really cold they will value warm dry clothes, and they won't value a map until they get really lost.

I would stop being their safety net so they are forced to rely on themselves. Perhaps have an old back injury play up so you can't lift or chop wood. Maybe lose or forget some vital kit (Tent? Or food and water maybe?) so they have to work to be comfortable. Confess you are completely lost and can't find the car. Provide nothing to eat except a dead bunny...

I would also stop telling them how great the outdoors is (like a teacher) and start telling them stories from the "fear of the dark" thread (like an uncle). Do weird stuff like asking the trolls for permission to walk through their forest. Find possible big cat sign near your campsite in the morning. Let their imagination fill in the gaps between the trees.

With kids of those ages I would also consider trying to take them one at a time. If the youngest comes home full of stories, the older one will be jealous.

Don't give up on them. The sofa bound are not happy, and have a bleak future.

Z

 

[Hammock_man]

When I did anything like this with mine I would "not set you up to fail". I would make sure they had the materials to finish the first job. i.e. provide tinder fuel pot and food. ( first time) Then each time remove a componant but ensure it was available nearby. Finally it would be "its now all down to you, feed me!!". Build on success not failure.

 

[rickyamos]

I suspect that you are discouraging rather than encouraging them.
It's not your fault, it's just the reality of a total culture clash. It's greatly to your credit that you are making such an effort to engage them.

Instead of taking them for a weekend, take them out somewhere for the day. Make it fun, not a chore. Buy them a hammock and rig it up in the garden. Show them how to put a tarp up, have a night around a brazier and then do some stargazing. Let them decide if they want to sleep in or out.
Have 'natural' foods on the brazier, do the whole cook it on a stick, inside half an orange, cook it in a paper bag, wrap it in grass and clay and bake it in hot embers, type stuff.
Play with the whole firelighting range, from flint and steel to firebow.

The brambles are ripening, we'll still be picking them into late September here. They're sour to tastebuds ruined by too much sugar and fizz, but take them and gather the fruits, make jam, jelly, peach and bramble cobbler. Food for free if you know what you're doing

Try orienteering taster days, or the hidden geocaches.

You have to make the natural world appealling not work. Swamping them with immersion in it's not working, so just gently enrich life with it's awareness. Let them get used to the seasons, not just the Christmas, Easter, Summer holidays type thing.

Just my tuppence halfpenny worth

cheers,
Toddy…..Mum to two computer/electronics able sons, but who are both capable outside too

Toddy, you be a scout leader, that's what I think.

Sent from my KFSOWI using Tapatalk

 

[Tengu]

Zingmo; Your girls are horrible monsters and I love them.

 

[Druss]

It's not really my place to say, but what if perhaps there would be a greater change in the kids' actions and personalities by actually speaking to their parents and getting them to limit time spent on PC and junk food consumption, Druss? Perhaps even just raise the concern subtly.

We have tried and tried with their mother but it feels like she doesn't care. She promises to do this and that and never delivers, this is why we take them out whenever we can and take them comping too. We have them stay over at ours as often as we can. When they are at home they eat nothing but takeaways and sweets and never... and i mean never get any excercise at all. If i'm honest I find it hard to imagine their place in the world. The oldest one is 15 now and by his age I was on my 3rd or fourth part time job after school and weekend and within a year i would have started my apprenticeship and moved into my own flat. I know it sounds harsh but I can't even imagine him managing a job like pushing the trolleys round Asda car park. I feel for the kid as he has not made himself this way, i dare say if i was allowed to play computer games all day and eat as many sweets as i like then i would have been just the same. But we never wanted to be in the house. The summer holidays we were out dawn till dusk. But these kids don't have any friends or anything. It's awful to see.

 

[Druss]

I have to admit I'm a great advocate of a few knife nicks do no harm, I carry many scars to this day and each one is a little lesson! Axes not so much however they don't give many second chances. I think it's something that has to be taught understood that an edged tool can wound very easily and worse. Maybe look into the opinel safety knives if you're worried about injury? I too remeber my first knife. My dad got it from the CLA gamefair (when I was arguably TOO young) a little non locker and still have it to this day sharpened down to little more than a stub. Maybe start with something like splitting wedges and a hammer and move on to axes? If nothing using a splitting wedge is a valuable skill and dangers are minimal

I wish I still had my first knife I have no idea what happened to it. It was a non locker and was shaped like a fish. Would love to have kept it.

 

[Druss]

When I did anything like this with mine I would "not set you up to fail". I would make sure they had the materials to finish the first job. i.e. provide tinder fuel pot and food. ( first time) Then each time remove a componant but ensure it was available nearby. Finally it would be "its now all down to you, feed me!!". Build on success not failure.

I think i am going to try that next time, make sure i have plenty of stuff with me to get things going. It's hard to switch thinking as me and my wife pack everything in our bags that we need so tend to keep it light and challenge ourselves to find what we need (and failing to do so more than we'd like). Mick91 has been kind enough to make them a couple of little EDC fire kits in spent shotgun cartridges which I think they are going to love(thanks again mate). I'm going to do some char cloth in the garden to take but also do some in camp to show them how it is done.

 

[Toddy]

No offence intended whatsoever…..but no child exists in isolation, not in mainstream schooling. They might not have many 'friends' as you define them, but maybe (and yes, I do know many folks who genuinely do not want to be 'involved', who have an utter horror of having random bods associated with them as 'friends' on a constant basis ) they really are contented as they are…..and your viewpoint, is just that.
How obese are they ? really, on the scale of normal health and not the scale of the ultra fit and active lean who push everything to the limit ? How does a single parent manage to afford takeaways for every meal ? Lots of working couples couldn't manage that expense.

Nature not nurture is often overlooked when outsiders consider families who do not conform to their perception of how things ought to be.
I worked with a tremendous variety of children and young adults over the years.

Even those who totally immersed themselves in the computer world manage to thrive very well as adults. They relate well to those they work with, choose to associate with, but they're still computer geeks/nerds/gamers.

One neighbour complained to me a handful of years ago that he didn't know what he was going to do with his son. He spent all his time in his room on his computer. He didnae go out, he didnae have friends around, he didnae go after the girls, he just spent all his time on his own. His son went to Uni, graduated with a 2:1 Hons and in his second year of work earns three times what his father ever earned in a year.

It's all relative, is what I'm trying to say.
This community is very outdoors focused, very certain that that's the way children should be.
The reality is that modern life makes that outdoors largely unneccesary for most people.
Forcing them, or relentlessly telling them that they need to be out, they need to change, they need to have more friends, they need to be active, they need to change their diet, they need to be more like you……I wonder, how do they see you ?

M

 

[Druss]

It's a tricky one this. My first inclination was, like Rik, to just leave in front of their computer games. But I also know that I owe all my love of the outdoors to other people who put up with me when I was a teenager. So I asked my girls what they would suggest.

The younger one said to take them into the middle of the forest then run away and leave them there!
The eldest said make them sleep down by the river where they get eaten alive by the midges. Then they will not be able to sit still as they will be too itchy!


This got me thinking. Many young people feel that they are entitled to an easy life and with these two it would seem they are happy to be carried by any adult nearby. Maybe you shouldn't be making the woods easy or entertaining for them. Maybe you should be aiming to scare the pants off them. Once really hungry they will appreciate food all the more. Once really cold they will value warm dry clothes, and they won't value a map until they get really lost.

I would stop being their safety net so they are forced to rely on themselves. Perhaps have an old back injury play up so you can't lift or chop wood. Maybe lose or forget some vital kit (Tent? Or food and water maybe?) so they have to work to be comfortable. Confess you are completely lost and can't find the car. Provide nothing to eat except a dead bunny...

I would also stop telling them how great the outdoors is (like a teacher) and start telling them stories from the "fear of the dark" thread (like an uncle). Do weird stuff like asking the trolls for permission to walk through their forest. Find possible big cat sign near your campsite in the morning. Let their imagination fill in the gaps between the trees.

With kids of those ages I would also consider trying to take them one at a time. If the youngest comes home full of stories, the older one will be jealous.

Don't give up on them. The sofa bound are not happy, and have a bleak future.

Z

You're bang right with them expecting to be carried by an adult all the time. they have always been spoilt and have had every game or toy they wanted. My first Christmas with the family i nearly passed out with the money that was spent by their nanna and aunties. Neither has any understanding of the value of money. I think that growning up always having what they want like this, real life is going to hit them like a ton of bricks.