Bow Fishing ? ? ? ? Can I? ? ?

[garethw]

I used to live on a river (on a boat). There were otters there and plenty of anglers, plenty of fish. The idea that otters will totally eat out all fish is frankly ********, they are a natural predator in the UK and will achieve a balance with the fish stocks.

Well I'll try not to be rude as well, but now you've got me started.... otters are an alpha predator in the UK, they need large amounts of fish to survive... this is fine if we don't want to angle for pleasure.
But the massive reintroduction of the species has whiped out numerous rivers (especially the small ones), where there were simply not enough natural fish to support them. If you think they don't kill for fun or in an organised way I'd suggest you do some research. They are intelligent creatures and a dog otter can weigh in excess of 30lb. A couple of such creatures have no problem taking a 25lb plus carp...or on the Ouse some of the country's largest barbel... they mostly only eat the high protein parts, liver, heart etc and leave most of the carcasse on the bank!!

Otters did virtually die out in many areas... but their reintroduction has been a disaster from a fish point of view in the UK... this is a fact!!! As most people can't see fish.. they don't count (right).. and a cute furry creature will always win the votes!!!
Otters have had a similar effect in the UK on fish stocks as bears and wolves have had in the French mountains, on live stock... fine unless you want to raise sheep and goats!!

If we didn't fish for pleasure and stock large amounts of fish into lakes and rivers, the otters would find their own natural population... but we want to fish so we stock lakes and rivers for our leisure (at huge expense to the lake owners and clubs). Many commercial lakes have installed otter fences as the WOULD be wiped out otherwise.
It is a fact that if otter populations continue to rise, rivers and lakes in the UK will be in derparate straits in the coming years. Many angling bodies are very worried. https://www.facebook.com/pages/The-Predation-Action-Group/161728690609128?sk=timeline

Certain aspects of the wild don't mix with man's activities... If anglers in your area don't have a problem with otters I'd say it's because they are not very numerous... I don't have a problem in France as they are not widespread.
I'm not saying either otters don't have a right to be there... but they weren't there anymore in such large numbers, until someone decided to put them back.. except the world has moved on... and man has the most popular participant sport, that is now getting trashed by their reintroduction...

cheers
Gareth
PS: Sorry I hijacked the post.. I'll get off my soap box and let the thread get back to its original point

 

[nic a char]

It's the way things are now, man has interfered so much, everything is out of balance. Much more to be said but I'll restrict it to:
- human activities resulting in loss of eels, sea-trout, and salmon, not to mention salt-water species = otters' prime food supplies diminished
- artificially-stocked fish/angling ponds - what do they expect? Just like ospreys - they go where it's easiest to feed.
- pike and other fishes introduced to new environments by anglers = changes to ecosystems that even ecologists cannot predict accurately...
So IF we start culling otters now, where will THAT lead?
Too much importing/culling action without considering consequences, then denials re disasters - just like "our" politicians.

 

[garethw]

So IF we start culling otters now, where will THAT lead?

Not a question of culling.. but for the reasons you mentioned their reintroduction could not be sustained naturally... its nothing really to do with the animals who go where the food is to survive.
BUT it is not compatibile with fishing as a recreation. A fishery owner who spends 300 grand on fish only to see them eaten by a predator that was not there 5 years ago (before the large scale reintroductions) and thus has his business & livelihood destroyed!! Hard to accept!!
When the fish are gone they will naturally eat more birds.. wonder if the RSPB will get off the fence then!!

 

[Toddy]

Otters belong here, mink don't, but there are millions of those blighters around. Now if your rant had been agin the mink then you'd get a lot more folks on your side.

I wonder how much of the issue you have with otters is actually because of mink predation.
Mink are not native to the UK, not even the European variety.

M

 

[Sherpa]

Just to get you back on thread, you can not bow hunt in the UK. £2500 and up to five years at Her Majesty's as an incentive not to.

 

[Johnnyboy1971]

I know for a fact that my local fishery lost over £8.000 worth of carp that we stocked a few years ago. 10% of this was natural causes the rest was down to otter predation. To walk around a water and find a new fish dead every day is sickening.

 

[harmfulvermin]

Quite disheartened with the direction of this thread.

It reminds me of the gamekeepers "controlling" birds of prey numbers just for the posh folk to shoot grouse ect. I would much rather see otters on the waterways than fisherman.

 

[Toddy]

Carp……

"An introduced species, the common carp is economically important and popular with anglers. However, its habit of searching for food amongst the sediment at the bottom of waterbodies, making the water cloudy and uprooting vegetation in the process, has caused problems for native wildlife."

another non-native that causes problems.
Hardly surprising that something's having a go at it when it's so prolifically stocked.

M

 

[swotty]

I would much rather see otters on the waterways than fisherman.

You and me both! Still, I'm glad they've let the beavers stay in Devon!

 

[Buckshot]

Not sure it makes much difference if the species is native or not - it's here and that's that regardless of 'right'
I agree that Otter population will make a difference to fish population of course, just not convinced it will make as much difference as you claim.
however you are right that bottom lines will be hit by feeding Otters rather than fishermen

Lets try and keep this civil can we and on topic

 

[Toddy]

Well, yes and no.

Mink are a real problem, and if we can remove hedgehogs that were predating ground nesting birds from islands where they weren't native, or bank destroying coypu, there's no reason we can't eradicate (or make strenuous efforts towards it) a major predator that is as damaging to stocks as the native otters. But then, I'm not a fisherman out for sport and blaming the native species that is finally recovering from pesticides and persecution by 'sportsmen'.
http://www.scottishmink.org.uk/american-mink/

While we're on the topic (kind of) the introduction of the American signal crayfish that are also destroying indigenous wildlife, was another supposedly good idea for food production

Bow fishing ? in the UK ? It's illegal.

M

 

[mrcharly]

There is a forum member who looks after fish ponds (among other things). I'm pretty sure they've said that while otters take some fish now and then, it is mink that will strip the ponds.

 

[santaman2000]

Your otter eat fish" Interesting. Back when I was a kid we still had a decent otter population in Mississippi but their favorite food was the mussels (dozens of different freahwater mussel species, if not over a hundred) Sadly the mussel population has likewise shrunk.

 

[boatman]

Just to restate the obvious, bow-fishing on the sea, inshore and estuaries is legal, eradicating rival species for the benefit of "sporting" shooters and fishermen is wrong. Stock a lake with fish, lose them to native species, that is your problem not that of those who wish to see our native fauna flourish. Incidentally the near eradication of our indigenous coracle fishermen in favour of the high paying fishermen is equally wrong.

 

[Corso]

So IF we start culling otters now, where will THAT lead?

anglers? I have no issue with catching to eat but the idea that you'd catch a fish to throw it back is beyond me...

 

[nic a char]

I agree with Toddy. (Ye can pick up hedgehogs, but (sadly) ye canny pick up mink lol!)

 

[andybysea]

The chances of seeing a fish in open water(out at sea) close enough to the surface on a calm enough day would be extremely rare, as for rivers, lakes,lochs etc i would definately say it was illegal.

 

[boatman]

Mullet seen frequently inshore in estuaries, for example. Several kayak fishermen carry a speargun for the odd fish visible from the surface.

 

[Stevie777]

I long for the day we can all enjoy the Sport of Bow Hunting here in Scotland. With over half a million Deer (4 Species) here alone, not to mention the Wild boar it's the perfect opportunity for this Country.

Bow Hunting Brings in Billions of $ in the US and Canada. Dont know the facts and figures for the European countries who allow it but i'm pretty sure they do well out of it.

If we Legalised Bow hunting Scotland could really corner the Market for Big Game Hunting in Europe. I know a good few Guys in the US who would Literally Kill for a Crack at the Monarch of the Glen...Trophy hunting is big business and if managed correctly the tourist industry would boom big time. just think of the Possibilities..I would certainly be into this sector at some level.

 

[Toddy]

……have a look for bows and Glasgow cemeteries. Given the right to hunt do you really think those eejits would stop at the deer ?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-tayside-central-31418649

M