bivi-bags

[Pete E]

Wllie,

I have used basha's and bivvie bags a lot in the past. here is my take on the situation...A standard breathable bivvie bag on its own is a great bit of kit in an emergency situation. You can get in there and be quite secure from the elements. Depending on the weather, your sleeping bag and a couple of other things, you could still end up feeling a bit damp/clammy; they are far, far better than the plastic bivvy bags though.

Now if you add a basha, you start to get "living room" and things become far more comfortable. In all but the worst weather, you no longer have to seal up the bivvy bag...half the time I would sleep with the top third of sleep bag out of the bivvy bag and relied on the basha to ward off the odd shower. In summer you probably don't need to use the bivvy at all, but its nice to have at hand...

So I would say one compliments the other to make a very flexible shelter system....

regards,

Pete

 

[arctic hobo]

The way I see it is that a basha will keep you dry from rain from the sky, but not wet ground unless you have a mat or something. They can be cheap as dirt and made from PVC if you like. A bag however is quite different, as you're inside there's a huge amount of condensation by morning if it's just plastic. This means it must be "breathable" which in my experience means it leaks. However if it doesn't leak for you, it is better - but getting a true breathable bag is very hard indeed - according to Trail magazine, the bivi bag that is actually truly breathable, will keep you perfectly dry while cocooned inside means you're looking at £200. And that to me is crazy... which is why I'll always just stick to a basha.

 

[bushblade]

would u recomend using the army bivi's without a basha ?

No. Possibly my outdoor designs one could cope on its own, but I have not tried this yet.
Bivi bags on their own are fine.... until it rains.

 

[willie]

ok thank you guys very much for ur information and advice




cheers

 

[Mikey P]

Thanks Gary. I knew they must be breathable because the 'arctic' ones are alot cheaper and not much good as they sweat alot.

I think that this is because they are designed as 'vapour barriers' as it keeps more heat in when you're in extremely cold conditions and, frankly, when it's abso-******-lutely freezing, breathable membranes don't work that well anyway.

For my tuppence worth, an ex-army bivi-bag would see you right for a low price. If you really want a hooped bivi, go the whole hog and get a one man tent.

 

[Wink]

Given the problems with clamminess even with British Army bags, especially in the cold, what do people think of Ventile as a bivvy bag fabric? Seems to me that it could be much more breathable, seams wouldn't have to be taped, fire-proof etc. Assuming that most would sleep on a mat, with a basha over the top, you would be talking about keeping off dew, blown rain etc. I know that Rab make a pertex bivvy, which presumably works on the same principle?

 

[greg2935]

I've been thinking about bivis for a while now, but have a few hassles with them. I do not know how and breathable material including ventile would perform on wet soil. I have been told that "breathable" materials all work by 2 methods

1) coating the fibres with a water repellent coating (i.e. teflon).

2) ensuring the fibre weave is too fine for water to pass through, (I am not quite sure how this works because the H2O molecule obviously is smaller than the spaces between the weave, but I guess because water has a strong surface tension (i.e. it will form hydrogen bonds with anything it comes into contact with), it would prefer to bond with itself rather than "squeeze" between the weave).

So if you lay on a piece of ventile (or any other material), I would think you would have two effects, you would stretch the fabric you lie on and this must decrease the water repellency, and secondly, although the coatings they lace these materials with are elastic, they are usually also soft which means it is easy to rub them off. Incidently I think this is why ventile is so highly prized as a breathable material, it only relies on the weave, and the weave does not change the area of the holes when the fabric is stretched and so always remains almost 100% waterproof!

And finally at the point where your weight forces the ground to compact, water would be squeezed out of the soil and sit as a permanent pool in close contact with the material which I think is just asking for trouble.

Therefore I would suggest ventile would be an excellent material for the top of a bivi, but you need something completely waterproof for underneath. If I had the money, I would make the following: a ventile top with teflon coated "ground mat", not sure how to combine the two yet!

As far as bought bivis go, I think you are better off with a one man tent for the hooped varieties cost the earth and do not give the protection/room a tent can give. I use an ex british army bivi.

Greg

 

[hootchi]

Just thought i'd add this quick question on the end of a thread to save starting a new one.

How much does a standard army breathable bivvy bay weigh? Like the ones I may get from Gary or Ebay.

Cheers

Hootch

 

[hootchi]

Just thought i'd add this quick question on the end of a thread to save starting a new one.

How much does a standard army breathable bivvy bag weigh? Like the ones I may get from Gary or Ebay.

Cheers

Hootch

Anyone? :roll:

 

[Doc]

Good question re weight:

The Argos one man tent (was £19.95 and got good reports) weighs 2kg. Less if you bin the pegs and improvise.

The Hilleberg Akto one man tent is 1.5kg (and very expensive.)

If a basha is say, 800g, and a bivvi bag another 800g (someone please give me accurate figures) the weight saving is pretty minimal. And you can use the tent on high ground where there are no trees.

Just a thought.

 

[bambodoggy]

If I think on I'll try and weight mine this evening.....

Doc...difference is the bivvi/basha combo can be used on a hill side (bivvi can be used on it's own if required or lightweight poles can be used for the basha) but with a basha/bivvi combo you can leave one or the other behind in the summer if you like, you can use the basha sheet to collect rain water, you can use it to make a stretcher, you can add it to others to make bigger shelters, wrap them around your bergan for river crossing and even make a improvised coricle and so on....

I'd guess that the basha/bivvi combo is also alot more hardwearing then a cheap argos tent.

Weight saving my be minimal but you get closer to nature and the variety of uses is only limited by your imagination....... "lets go fly a kite, up to......" lol ):

hope that helps.... ):

 

[rhp]

The one I ordered from Bearclaw just arrived (thanks Gary!) so I put it on the kitchen scales. It weighs 1lb 15oz.

- Dic k (poxy software censoring my name )

 

[hootchi]

Thanks Dic k. :biggthump I was just wondering how much my hootchi and bivvy bag arrangement will weigh.
Cheers ):

 

[Andy]

Thanks for the info Dick

 

[Walkabout]

If youre looking for a relly good bivvi bag then get the snugpak pertex one. You can squeeze it into a PLCE ammo pouch its that small and ive slept out in light rain with one, no basha and i stayed dry. It only costs 55quid and it weighs nothing. I think you can get them from SASS Kit.

 

[zambezi]

Good question re weight:

The Argos one man tent (was £19.95 and got good reports) weighs 2kg. Less if you bin the pegs and improvise.

The Hilleberg Akto one man tent is 1.5kg (and very expensive.)

If a basha is say, 800g, and a bivvi bag another 800g (someone please give me accurate figures) the weight saving is pretty minimal. And you can use the tent on high ground where there are no trees.

Just a thought.

BRAVISSIMO!!!!!

And if the tent weighs less than one kilo then why take two [bits of kit] into a shower?

 

[jakunen]

Pretty impressive...

 

[bambodoggy]

BRAVISSIMO!!!!!

And if the tent weighs less than one kilo then why take two [bits of kit] into a shower?

That's a top looking tent Zamo....but with a top price to go with!!!! £175.00 I could buy a basha/bivvi bag and still have change to pay for my flight up to Scotland to use them!!! lol ):

On the other hand....if the weather is bad next weekend while I'm under my basha and you're in your tent.... I may be able to leave my rations at home as I'll be eating my words!!! lol
I know we'd both survive but I'm sure you'd be more comfortable than me!

 

[jakunen]

On the other hand....if the weather is bad next weekend while I'm under my basha and you're in your tent.... I may be able to leave my rations at home as I'll be eating my words!!! lol
I know we'd both survive but I'm sure you'd be more comfortable than me!

Isn't that what we're all striving to achieve? Being as comfortable as we can? With the kit we prefer to use?

 

[steve a]

Off topic I know but as lightweight tents go I can reccomend one of these
http://www.golite.co.uk/scstore/scstore/product_categories/products/hex3.html
I'll be bringing mine next weekend so if anyone wants a look, just ask.