Yep, and when looking through the scope it's like the spin cycle of a washing machine.
My 80 was manageable and great for snap shooting. My HW77 is much heavier but better for "considered" shots when watching a warren.
air rifles; .177 or .22?
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Yep, and when looking through the scope it's like the spin cycle of a washing machine.
My 80 was manageable and great for snap shooting. My HW77 is much heavier but better for "considered" shots when watching a warren.
The argument over .177,.20,.22 blah blah is a pretty pointless one. Its a moot point. All these calibres are MORE than enough for anything from a rabbit down to a woodie. MORE than enough.
I personally always opt for .177, and though i own a PCP (AirArms S410), i've just purchased a AA TX200 mkIII , again in .177 as i wanted the pure self sufficiency a springer brings with it. The .177, in the right hands will kill just as quickly and as cleanly as any .22 out there. A recent study in Airgun World was conducted where pellets of varying calibres and weights were fired into firm, flesh consistency terracotta wax at 25-35 yards and the resulting channels filled with liquid plaster. Once the plaster had set the resulting cores were taken out for inspection. The .177 , lighter pellets produced much wider channels than the .22 pellets and also these plaster cores weighed upto double that of the cores produced by .22 pellets. This, according to the studies, indicated that the .177 rounds decelerated more on impact and also while travelling through the quarry dumping more energy as a result.
The same can be said of bullets. Heavier bullets designed for an animal such as a cape buffallo would be heavy so as to ensure they would keep driving through the animals heart and lungs even if they strike the bones of these large heavy animals. Rounds designed for killing foxes however are lighter as a fox only has thin bones, a heavy round would pass through taking much of its energy with it, the lighter round carrys less peetration WEIGHT and so deccelarates alot quicker than a comparitive .22 pellet so therefore the .177 is dumping a lot more energy as a result.
Thus far, i've never had a runner while using .177, over 15 years of shooting rabbit, woodies and corvids with it. .177 also suffers less from wind deflection and has better Ballistic Coefficiency/accuracy according to that study.
As this little youtube video shows, the only movement from this .177 shot rabbit is simply it rolling down the slope created by this tree's roots, it is still, however, stone dead thanks to the .177 pellet hitting it in the skull. Enjoy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KbKHxgdD3ow
I personally always opt for .177, and though i own a PCP (AirArms S410), i've just purchased a AA TX200 mkIII , again in .177 as i wanted the pure self sufficiency a springer brings with it. The .177, in the right hands will kill just as quickly and as cleanly as any .22 out there. A recent study in Airgun World was conducted where pellets of varying calibres and weights were fired into firm, flesh consistency terracotta wax at 25-35 yards and the resulting channels filled with liquid plaster. Once the plaster had set the resulting cores were taken out for inspection. The .177 , lighter pellets produced much wider channels than the .22 pellets and also these plaster cores weighed upto double that of the cores produced by .22 pellets. This, according to the studies, indicated that the .177 rounds decelerated more on impact and also while travelling through the quarry dumping more energy as a result.
The same can be said of bullets. Heavier bullets designed for an animal such as a cape buffallo would be heavy so as to ensure they would keep driving through the animals heart and lungs even if they strike the bones of these large heavy animals. Rounds designed for killing foxes however are lighter as a fox only has thin bones, a heavy round would pass through taking much of its energy with it, the lighter round carrys less peetration WEIGHT and so deccelarates alot quicker than a comparitive .22 pellet so therefore the .177 is dumping a lot more energy as a result.
Thus far, i've never had a runner while using .177, over 15 years of shooting rabbit, woodies and corvids with it. .177 also suffers less from wind deflection and has better Ballistic Coefficiency/accuracy according to that study.
As this little youtube video shows, the only movement from this .177 shot rabbit is simply it rolling down the slope created by this tree's roots, it is still, however, stone dead thanks to the .177 pellet hitting it in the skull. Enjoy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KbKHxgdD3ow
hey folks just an update, I got my self a bsa meteor .177 s/h with a lovely stock, fitted out with a nikko stirling 3-9x32 mountmaster and rws superdome pellets (im told these are the best pellets for this rifle) so thanks for all the help. Although I have been eyeing up the bsa ultra pcp .22, if only I had the money!
great gun and set up, i really regret selling my wee meteor, it was a cracking little gun, why did i sell it :-(
I've got my eyes set on a weihrauch springer when my aim is better with this gun. Either a HW99s break barrel or HW77k/97k underlever with a nikko 4-12x50 IR scope! that would be nice 
Sorry to rehash an old thread, but I'm thinking about getting an air rifle and am going to have an initial look at the gunshop with a pal who knows a lot more than me- probably will go for .22 but what rifle should I hope for for £150- £200? Happy to have 2nd hand
Cheers, joab
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Cheers, joab
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You should get a good one for £200 second hand, and there are a LOT of good second hand rifles from all stables...Both German and British Names...
http://www.bushcraftuk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=114294
Aye its a nice little rifle. I have too many now though
http://www.bushcraftuk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=54694&highlight=rifle+Andy
A thread I posted some time ago.
Some info may be out of date now.
I've a little .22 Webley Exocet, lovely wee gun. Have a look round and see what feels right. Try and stick to British or German makers.
Andy
A thread I posted some time ago.
Some info may be out of date now.
I've a little .22 Webley Exocet, lovely wee gun. Have a look round and see what feels right. Try and stick to British or German makers.
Andy
http://www.bushcraftuk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=114294
Aye its a nice little rifle. I have too many now though
If I didn't have more than enough I'd be interested in that too. Good gun (and in a good caliber for a springer) and great scope, good price.
Thanks for the link Mac and for the info guys- I'm going to try a few out to see how they feel and will hopefully have a better idea what'll suit then...might be in touch mark!
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Hi all
Regarding the calibre debate, must say I much prefer .177 but i'm not fussy, if a gun comes up that I like i'm not that bothered if it's any of the other calibres
I have a few Weihrauch rifles too..
HW35s..
Left HW35k
Right HW35export but simply marked 'EUSTA'
HW35 Hofmann Premier..
HW35K from 1979 in .177
Another HW35 Export
Another HW35 in .177cal that i've been doing up!
HW77 from 1983..
HW80..
Another 80 but in a Venom stock (.177cal)..
HW90 Gasram..
HW95 in a custom stock..
I had this HW98 for one day, a very good friend that had done me loads of favours wanted one so I let him have it, .177cal too!!
I do like German guns but I can't shake my preference for old British guns
I've acquired a few more Airsporters since I took the above pic, think i'v three or four more now
Cheers, john
Regarding the calibre debate, must say I much prefer .177 but i'm not fussy, if a gun comes up that I like i'm not that bothered if it's any of the other calibres
I have a few Weihrauch rifles too..
HW35s..
Left HW35k
Right HW35export but simply marked 'EUSTA'
HW35 Hofmann Premier..
HW35K from 1979 in .177
Another HW35 Export
Another HW35 in .177cal that i've been doing up!
HW77 from 1983..
HW80..
Another 80 but in a Venom stock (.177cal)..
HW90 Gasram..
HW95 in a custom stock..
I had this HW98 for one day, a very good friend that had done me loads of favours wanted one so I let him have it, .177cal too!!
I do like German guns but I can't shake my preference for old British guns
I've acquired a few more Airsporters since I took the above pic, think i'v three or four more now
Cheers, john
Wow John!
That's a pretty serious collection with some very tasty rifles in there! I remember back in the late 70's I thought the HW35 was sooo heavy, I handled one again a few weeks ago and it actually seems rather dinky now! I suppose that's what comes of shooting an HW80 and a TX200! The only thing you seem to have missing from you line up is a Feinwerkbau Sport.
Thanks for sharing the pictures.
Dave
That's a pretty serious collection with some very tasty rifles in there! I remember back in the late 70's I thought the HW35 was sooo heavy, I handled one again a few weeks ago and it actually seems rather dinky now! I suppose that's what comes of shooting an HW80 and a TX200! The only thing you seem to have missing from you line up is a Feinwerkbau Sport.
Thanks for sharing the pictures.
Dave
The HW77 takes me back , I currently have a webly eclipse 2.2 ive had since I was 16
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Hi Dave
I've a load more guns, very close to 100 in fact but as you say, no FWB Sport
There was one that was like new at a local bootsale this year, the bloke wanted £180 (He had loads of airguns!) but I only had around a hundred quid so had to walk away
I have a nice TX200 though in .177 cal..
John
Hi Dave
I've a load more guns, very close to 100 in fact but as you say, no FWB Sport
There was one that was like new at a local bootsale this year, the bloke wanted £180 (He had loads of airguns!) but I only had around a hundred quid so had to walk away
I have a nice TX200 though in .177 cal..
John
I was going to say that's a fraction of your collection isn't it. Are there pics of the whole lot anywhere. I vaguely remember you've a presence over on airhunbbs, but I'm rarely on there these days.
Do the older guns still shoot well John?
I haven't taken my rifles out in far too long.
Andy
Hi Andy
Yes, most of the older guns shoot quite well, The old BSA Standard shoots exceptionally well for a 1936 gun!!
Here's a pic that apparently, not many people can do, a fully etched Webley mk1, Webley mk2 Service rifle and a mk3. there's only two known Mk1s that are still fully etched, I have one of them
John
