Horse Chestnut trees - other options to felling

[Bigfoot]

I was having a wander around Pollok Park and its estates in Glasgow, it's a great little piece of woodland in the heart of the city.

I spotted some notices warning that some of their horse chestnuts (lining a vehicular & pedestrian route) are to be felled due to "extreme age" and fear of dead limbs falling. Whilst these trees may be over 100 years old (I'm guessing) they just seem to be old, not dead. The suspicious side of me thinks this is just a ruse to combat health & safety issues and minimise costs, although I understand that new hardwood trees will be planted in their place albeit taking many years to mature.

Isn't it worthwhile trimming and lopping limbs rather than cutting down the tree? Is pollarding viable with horse chestnut and at such an age?

As far as I am aware the horse chestnut contagion that is slowly spreading up from England has a long way to go yet before it arrives here. I'm not aware of any other disease issues.

Am I just being paranoid or should I go and rattle someone's cage at the local Council? Any comments from the professional tree folk on here would be welcome.

 

[JonathanD]

There have been three HC trees felled recently on the edge of my local woodland to the side of a public footpath, and one just off the village High Street too. We thought the council was removing it due to H&S issues as well.

 

[Harvestman]

Has there ever been an actual case of someone being injured by a tree branch spontaneously falling off and landing on them, or is this just one of those things that Health and Safety people dream up to justify their time?

We lost a perfectly healthy ash tree from the back of our house because of a residents petition 'in case a branch fell on a child while it was playing', despite the fact that most of the locals don't even have children, and those that do don't let them play in the street anyway.

Personally, I value the tree rather more than I value the idiots who worry about stuff like this.

 

[tomongoose]

A lot of them suffer from canker and rot as they get older and do drop limbs

 

[JonathanD]

I think there has been a couple of cases of accidents from missiles falling out of trees due to kids hurling stick and stuff up to get the conkers. Amazing this has gone on for possibly centuries without any hubbub until this year. Soon it will be compulsary to wear hard hats in the woods, or else you will have to sign a disclaimer.

 

[locum76]

In well funded places such as Pollock park tree surgeons use ultrasound technology to assess the stress inside big old trees. I'm sure they would have taken these measures in this case and an educated and informed decision made on the integrity of the tree.

 

[Harvestman]

In well funded places such as Pollock park tree surgeons use ultrasound technology to assess the stress inside big old trees. I'm sure they would have taken these measures in this case and an educated and informed decision made on the integrity of the tree.

Good. I've absolutely no problem with people making a sensible informed decision about an unhealthy tree. It is people who take the 'well it might happen, so just in case..." approach to trees that annoy me. People don't seem to understand risk any more.

 

[sxmolloy]

There are a few trees in my area that have been sculpted. One large branch is a crocodile, the other a butterfly. On another tree is just a "twisty design" but looks really good. There are no small branches on the said trees now so there's nothing to fall off and injure someone.

I think the trees were dead or dying so this was the measure taken. Whilst I appreciate the HC trees in question are still living this may be an avenue to explore. I will take a few snaps next time I'm down that way, it's really impressive.

 

[robin wood]

Has there ever been an actual case of someone being injured by a tree branch spontaneously falling off and landing on them, or is this just one of those things that Health and Safety people dream up to justify their time?

A sound question and one I asked myself when working for the National Trust 20 years ago. That was when tree health surveys were just coming in. Apparently damage due to falling limbs was the second highest case of insurance claims against the Trust at that time (after folk tripping over stuff). Falling on people is not common, falling on cars in car parks and roads is. Horse chestnut is particularly prone to throwing limbs without warning from an apparently healthy tree particularly on still warm summer days.

We had a training day on "dangerous tree surveying" as it was called back then at Chartwell. one of the trees on the exercise which we all passed as healthy was a large copper beech in the car park, two days later a huge limb fell and crushed a car.

Since then tree surveying has become big business and it is always easier to remove a tree than to leave it. No one will sue if you remove it but if you pass it as healthy and it drops on someone you are in big trouble.

 

[iamasmith]

Yep, I've always heard that Beech can drop it's branches unpredictably.

As a matter of fact, I was driving my Uncle home to his farm years ago and a Beech branch came down and cracked the windscreen. There were moderate winds that night and luckily it just clipped the windscreen at the top and went straight over the roof but it meant a new windscreen.

 

[TallMikeM]

what robin said. I recall (when vollying for the NT) getting a earful from a MOP about an HC we were felling for just those reasons. What made me nervous was the MOP insisted in giving me the earful right underneathe the tree in question (which was clearly an unwell tree, even to the untrained observer).

 

[SOAR]

I agree with locum76 these guys and girls should really know their job, and if the trees are coming down a very good reason will be involved.
Hourse Chestnuts can be dodgy and if they are as old as you say, it could be a H&S issue, sadly trees are taken down all the time, its just life, if like you say a replanting scheme is in place after they are gone then thats a bonus for the future generations, after reading their web site they are very focused on their woodland conservation and park improvments, this also is a good sign as to their knowlege.
If you do feel that you need a reason to the trees fate, why not Email them, it can't hurt.

 

[Bigfoot]

Thanks for the replies chaps, I think I will dig a bit further. As suggested, I would think that the Council would have had professionals give sound advice but sadly the political stirrings at Pollok of the last year or so has been despicably underhand. I'll report back.

 

[Peter_t]

i have worked an some big horse chestnuts, yes they do rot easily and have problems such as cankers but the wood is also VERY brittle. while cutting off some bigish branches i was using step cuts (a controled way to cut branches without them splitting) and they just sheared off with no warning befor the cut is completed:yikes:

removal and replacement is far better than lopping branches off. a small tree can be kept small but a big tree cannot be made small and healthy/safe.


pete

 

[SOAR]

i have worked an some big horse chestnuts, yes they do rot easily and have problems such as cankers but the wood is also VERY brittle. while cutting off some bigish branches i was using step cuts (a controled way to cut branches without them splitting) and they just sheared off with no warning befor the cut is completed:yikes:

removal and replacement is far better than lopping branches off. a small tree can be kept small but a big tree cannot be made small and healthy/safe.


pete

Under and ontop, or side step cuts? some trees dont like step cuts like Ash especialy if you leave the weight on the branch.

 

[dwardo]

I was told that horsechesnut trees tend to only live just over a 100 years before they start to become problematic.

 

[robin wood]

the wood is also VERY brittle.
pete

Yep the term "carroty" could have been invented for horse chestnut, where ash is the celery of the tree world.

 

[Toddy]

Well, if it's of any interest, I contacted the Galgael Trust about this. Pollok Park holds a special place in our memories. They're going to see if they can have the timber to use in the workshops.
http://www.galgael.org

cheers,
Mary

 

[Bigfoot]

That's a damn fine idea, assuming the timber is sound enough

 

[Toddy]

It's the Galgael they make everything from Birlinns to chairs and tables
One of my inkle looms that was made in the workshop has eleven different woods used in it's construction

Even though it has a propensity to 'shake' Chestnut makes lovely furniture. I have a spinning wheel and a matching carved chair made from Chestnut, and they are beautiful

cheers,
Toddy