This is a video from the Survival Russia channel on YouTube. He is talking about how after the Soviet collapse many people stayed fed with their shotguns. A shotgun is the most common privately owned firearm in Russia, both in Soviet days and today. In Russia, both then and now, before you can own any other type of firearm, you have to own a shotgun for 5 years.
The Ultimate Survival Meal-Maker
- Thread starter mrostov
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Hey Guest, Early bird pricing on the Summer Moot (29th July - 10th August) available until April 6th, we'd love you to come. PLEASE CLICK HERE to early bird price and get more information.
Hopefully the image linked.
This is my current bushcraft and general hunting gun built on an H&R Handi-Rifle (SB2) receiver. H&R/NEF made two receivers, dimensionally identical. One was shotgun only (SB1 - cast iron) and the other was a rifle receiver (SB2 - steel).
This single shot break open firearm is simple and super reliable. It has a strong enough ejection that it will shoot an empty plastic hull back over your shoulder.
The top barrel is a 29.5" 12ga vent rib smoothbore with removable chokes.
The 24" barrel on the gun is a fully rifled 12ga barrel. It will drop a T-Rex, quickly, but you had better be in a manly mood when you shoot it, lest you shed a whimper and possibly some tears from the recoil. Being quite manly, I shall describe the recoil as 'brisk and refreshing'. Others, obviously not as manly as I, have described it in various terms such as 'brutal', 'inhumanly savage', and 'I now need a chiropractor'.
The fully rifled barrel gives a very good level of accuracy to .50cal sabots, 1oz pumpkin balls, and some other slugs like the 1oz and 7/8oz Lee 'keyed' wad slugs.
I have a 3rd barrel that is identical to the 24" fully rifled barrel, including similar adjustable sights, but it is smoothbore. Though intended to be a slug gun for deer hunting, I have had it tapped and threaded for removable chokes to increase it's versatility. The chokes on both smoothbore barrels are Winchester/Mossberg/Browning Invector compatible.
The black tubes are chokes, including a rifled choke for the smoothbore barrels. The smoothbore barrels already each wear a choke all of the time.
The silver tubes are sub-caliber adapters. The long one is a 7" (5" rifled) .22LR adapter. Below that are a 3" 20ga smoothbore, 3" .410/.45 Long Colt smoothbore, 3" .40S&W (rifled), 3" .38 Special (rifled), and 3" a .22LR (rifled). The fully rifled barrel can only use the shorter 3" adapters due to the rifling not allowing clearance.
The rifled adapters are legal here in Texas, but maybe not across the pond.
For things like shooting squirrels out of trees I can use a .22cal lead airgun pellet and a .22cal rimfire nail gun blank. You use a wood dowel ramrod to shove the pellet into the adapter's breach to where it contacts the rifling on the adapter. Insert the blank and you are good to go. This keeps me from launching a .22LR bullet onto a ballistic trajectory in case I miss (which might happen, occasionally , maybe, on every other full moon). This also works if there is a .22LR ammo shortage.
This is my current bushcraft and general hunting gun built on an H&R Handi-Rifle (SB2) receiver. H&R/NEF made two receivers, dimensionally identical. One was shotgun only (SB1 - cast iron) and the other was a rifle receiver (SB2 - steel).
This single shot break open firearm is simple and super reliable. It has a strong enough ejection that it will shoot an empty plastic hull back over your shoulder.
The top barrel is a 29.5" 12ga vent rib smoothbore with removable chokes.
The 24" barrel on the gun is a fully rifled 12ga barrel. It will drop a T-Rex, quickly, but you had better be in a manly mood when you shoot it, lest you shed a whimper and possibly some tears from the recoil. Being quite manly, I shall describe the recoil as 'brisk and refreshing'. Others, obviously not as manly as I, have described it in various terms such as 'brutal', 'inhumanly savage', and 'I now need a chiropractor'.
The fully rifled barrel gives a very good level of accuracy to .50cal sabots, 1oz pumpkin balls, and some other slugs like the 1oz and 7/8oz Lee 'keyed' wad slugs.
I have a 3rd barrel that is identical to the 24" fully rifled barrel, including similar adjustable sights, but it is smoothbore. Though intended to be a slug gun for deer hunting, I have had it tapped and threaded for removable chokes to increase it's versatility. The chokes on both smoothbore barrels are Winchester/Mossberg/Browning Invector compatible.
The black tubes are chokes, including a rifled choke for the smoothbore barrels. The smoothbore barrels already each wear a choke all of the time.
The silver tubes are sub-caliber adapters. The long one is a 7" (5" rifled) .22LR adapter. Below that are a 3" 20ga smoothbore, 3" .410/.45 Long Colt smoothbore, 3" .40S&W (rifled), 3" .38 Special (rifled), and 3" a .22LR (rifled). The fully rifled barrel can only use the shorter 3" adapters due to the rifling not allowing clearance.
The rifled adapters are legal here in Texas, but maybe not across the pond.
For things like shooting squirrels out of trees I can use a .22cal lead airgun pellet and a .22cal rimfire nail gun blank. You use a wood dowel ramrod to shove the pellet into the adapter's breach to where it contacts the rifling on the adapter. Insert the blank and you are good to go. This keeps me from launching a .22LR bullet onto a ballistic trajectory in case I miss (which might happen, occasionally , maybe, on every other full moon). This also works if there is a .22LR ammo shortage.
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That’s a sweet set up there Mrostov, l’d like the 22 adapter, my favourite gun at the moment has to be my Biakal 12gauge over .223. From deer to squirrels, ideal walk around rough shooting gun, the .22 would make it really versatile then I wouldn’t need the .22 so often then.
Baikals are neat guns. Unfortunately our government and the Russians are always playing games with each other so the importation of Russian made guns is spotty at best, and a Baikal combination gun here brings a premium, when you can find one. Another option is the now out of production Savage 24, and these also command a premium when you find one for sale.
For your Baikal you have two options to fire .22LR. You can get a drop in adapter for the 12ga barrel or you can get a handful of sub-caliber insert cartridges for the .223 barrel.
The the sub-caliber adapter cartridges, are dimensionally the same as a .223 case but they hold inside of them a .22LR round and you fire the .22LR directly down the .223 barrel. The .22LR uses a .223" bullet and the .223 uses a .224" bullet but that slight bore diameter difference doesn't matter as much to accuracy as the difference in twist rate does.
The native twist of a .22LR is 1:16 and the twist on commercial .223 barrels in sporting guns tends to be either 1:12 or 1:9. Many European made sporting rifles chambered in .223 are still rifled with a 1:12 twist and most until fairly recently were rifled that way.
However, though the twist rates are different, my experience with AR-15 and M-16 5.56mm/.223 barrels with drop in semi-auto .22LR adapters says that you would probably still get decent rabbit hunting accuracy out of them, especially if it is a 1:12 twist barrel (the native twist of an M-16A1). I had an AR-15 with a 1:12 twist M-16A1 Vietnam War surplus barrel and the accuracy with .22LR was good. Most modern AR-15 rifles have a 1:9 twist barrel and I got rabbit hunting accuracy out of them with a .22LR drop in kit at 75 yards with Federal 36gr copper plated high velocity hollowpoint ammo. Some .22LR loads work better than others with a non-native twist rate.
The drop in adapters are a native 1:16" twist and the longer ones, like the Short Lane 8 inch adapter have a good reputation for accuracy.
Drop in adapters for the 12ga barrel:
https://www.gunadapters.com/
http://www.mcace.com/shotguninserts.htm
For a .22LR adapter, Short Lane and MCA do it differently. Short Lane uses and offset bore and your native firing pin hits the rimfire cartridge's rim. The MCA adapter uses a centerline bore and a centerfire to rimfire plug. For a rimfire round, the Short Lane is easier to use, faster to reload, and there is no plug to misplace.
That 7" adapter and the .40S&W I have are both stainless steel and were made by GaugeMate, which seems to have gone out of business. The stainless .38 Special rifled adapter was made by a machinist who sells adapters on eBay and he works with stainless steel and carbon fiber. His eBay seller name is 'chaszel'. As you can see, my adapters which are not stainless show the effects of my living in a coastal, semi-tropical environment.
Sub-Caliber adapter cartridges:
http://www.mcace.com/adapters.htm
Here is an accuracy test of the .22LR Short Lane 8 inch drop in adapter for the 12ga barrel vs a .22LR caliber rifle:
For your Baikal you have two options to fire .22LR. You can get a drop in adapter for the 12ga barrel or you can get a handful of sub-caliber insert cartridges for the .223 barrel.
The the sub-caliber adapter cartridges, are dimensionally the same as a .223 case but they hold inside of them a .22LR round and you fire the .22LR directly down the .223 barrel. The .22LR uses a .223" bullet and the .223 uses a .224" bullet but that slight bore diameter difference doesn't matter as much to accuracy as the difference in twist rate does.
The native twist of a .22LR is 1:16 and the twist on commercial .223 barrels in sporting guns tends to be either 1:12 or 1:9. Many European made sporting rifles chambered in .223 are still rifled with a 1:12 twist and most until fairly recently were rifled that way.
However, though the twist rates are different, my experience with AR-15 and M-16 5.56mm/.223 barrels with drop in semi-auto .22LR adapters says that you would probably still get decent rabbit hunting accuracy out of them, especially if it is a 1:12 twist barrel (the native twist of an M-16A1). I had an AR-15 with a 1:12 twist M-16A1 Vietnam War surplus barrel and the accuracy with .22LR was good. Most modern AR-15 rifles have a 1:9 twist barrel and I got rabbit hunting accuracy out of them with a .22LR drop in kit at 75 yards with Federal 36gr copper plated high velocity hollowpoint ammo. Some .22LR loads work better than others with a non-native twist rate.
The drop in adapters are a native 1:16" twist and the longer ones, like the Short Lane 8 inch adapter have a good reputation for accuracy.
Drop in adapters for the 12ga barrel:
https://www.gunadapters.com/
http://www.mcace.com/shotguninserts.htm
For a .22LR adapter, Short Lane and MCA do it differently. Short Lane uses and offset bore and your native firing pin hits the rimfire cartridge's rim. The MCA adapter uses a centerline bore and a centerfire to rimfire plug. For a rimfire round, the Short Lane is easier to use, faster to reload, and there is no plug to misplace.
That 7" adapter and the .40S&W I have are both stainless steel and were made by GaugeMate, which seems to have gone out of business. The stainless .38 Special rifled adapter was made by a machinist who sells adapters on eBay and he works with stainless steel and carbon fiber. His eBay seller name is 'chaszel'. As you can see, my adapters which are not stainless show the effects of my living in a coastal, semi-tropical environment.
Sub-Caliber adapter cartridges:
http://www.mcace.com/adapters.htm
Here is an accuracy test of the .22LR Short Lane 8 inch drop in adapter for the 12ga barrel vs a .22LR caliber rifle:
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A note on the smaller shotgun gauge inserts fired in a large gauge gun.
The patterning of a shotgun is always better with a shorter, proportionally wide shot column than a long, proportionally skinny shot column. One of the key things a proportionally wider shot column does is that it reduces pellet collision in the barrel.
By shot column, I mean the length vs width of the shot load coming out of the shell when fired.
For example, in the mid 1980's Mossberg accurately saw ahead of time American laws eventually changing when it came to using lead shot in wetlands (the lead shot ban for wetlands came in the early 1990's). You need more steel shot to match what a lead shot load can do. So, anticipating this, in the 1980's they lead the development of the 3-1/2" 12ga shell. This allows a 12ga to throw a steel shot load into the air equal to a 10ga.
The problem with the 3-1/2" shell is that when fired out of a 12ga bore it has a proportionally long, skinny shot column which did not make for optimal patterning. So, when they developed the Mossberg 835 specifically for the 3-1/2" load they did a technique called 'over-boring' of the barrel. Basically, the 12ga barrel widens out internally to 10ga, and hence widens out the shot column for better patterning.
The .410 shotshell typically has a long, skinny shot column, and it's patterning often suffers from it.
What you will find with a 12ga->.410 chamber adapter, and the 12ga->20ga as well, is that the 12ga barrel acts as over-boring and you actually get very good patterns at ranges you would normally hunt game like grouse and rabbits at.
The patterning of a shotgun is always better with a shorter, proportionally wide shot column than a long, proportionally skinny shot column. One of the key things a proportionally wider shot column does is that it reduces pellet collision in the barrel.
By shot column, I mean the length vs width of the shot load coming out of the shell when fired.
For example, in the mid 1980's Mossberg accurately saw ahead of time American laws eventually changing when it came to using lead shot in wetlands (the lead shot ban for wetlands came in the early 1990's). You need more steel shot to match what a lead shot load can do. So, anticipating this, in the 1980's they lead the development of the 3-1/2" 12ga shell. This allows a 12ga to throw a steel shot load into the air equal to a 10ga.
The problem with the 3-1/2" shell is that when fired out of a 12ga bore it has a proportionally long, skinny shot column which did not make for optimal patterning. So, when they developed the Mossberg 835 specifically for the 3-1/2" load they did a technique called 'over-boring' of the barrel. Basically, the 12ga barrel widens out internally to 10ga, and hence widens out the shot column for better patterning.
The .410 shotshell typically has a long, skinny shot column, and it's patterning often suffers from it.
What you will find with a 12ga->.410 chamber adapter, and the 12ga->20ga as well, is that the 12ga barrel acts as over-boring and you actually get very good patterns at ranges you would normally hunt game like grouse and rabbits at.
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I peaked at 12 field-grade shotguns. Beretta, Benelli, Arietta, Ruger, Remington and Bioto, I had a whole bunch of them.
Mostly 12, a few 20. The s/s Arietta 20 was cross-eyed! But the buyer didn't care.
The only 12 ga that I really regret selling was the Bioto (Brazil) s/s coach gun.
That put more good food on my table than all the others put together.
I've kept just 2. Remington was bringing in Baikal as "Spartan" and I have the o/u 12 ga. Heavy pig but fits me.
The only 20 with all the features I like is the Baikal s/s 20 ga. Everybody in the family wants to shoot that one.
Both needed more than cosmetic smithing and top after-market choke tubes.
The 20 needed the LOP added 3/4", 1/4" more drop on the comb and 3/16" cast off carved away.
The key thing for you all to remember is that if you're the "Dad," you have to have lots of ammo for others to shoot.
Generic shotgun stocks fit about 15% of shooters. Cheap wood stocks and you can make the gun fit you.
Mostly 12, a few 20. The s/s Arietta 20 was cross-eyed! But the buyer didn't care.
The only 12 ga that I really regret selling was the Bioto (Brazil) s/s coach gun.
That put more good food on my table than all the others put together.
I've kept just 2. Remington was bringing in Baikal as "Spartan" and I have the o/u 12 ga. Heavy pig but fits me.
The only 20 with all the features I like is the Baikal s/s 20 ga. Everybody in the family wants to shoot that one.
Both needed more than cosmetic smithing and top after-market choke tubes.
The 20 needed the LOP added 3/4", 1/4" more drop on the comb and 3/16" cast off carved away.
The key thing for you all to remember is that if you're the "Dad," you have to have lots of ammo for others to shoot.
Generic shotgun stocks fit about 15% of shooters. Cheap wood stocks and you can make the gun fit you.
Thanks for the info, because of UK firearms laws, these inserts are very expensive due to the lack of demand, I shoot a beretta silver pidgeon, be It a lovely gun, I still shoot my very first 12 gauge, baikal 430ne s/s so much better which I had from new 40 years ago!
If I have a serious deer shooting session it has to be the 243 howa, Japanese made, based on a Weatherby frame.
If I have a serious deer shooting session it has to be the 243 howa, Japanese made, based on a Weatherby frame.
