Nooby 4x4 advice needed
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TurboGirl
Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Are these guidelines BCUK or litigation based? I've been commenting on threads ref 4x4 as we trade in them but had no idea we shouldn't alert others to major problems :S so any negatives I feel important are [EDITED]
So if we're only commenting positively, the diesel freelanders might fit your bill- we've traded some lovely Rav4s as previously recommended (the autos can be rarer tho) and in the larger 4x4 markets, Shoguns and Troopers are good although getting replacement injectors can be [EDITED] on the latter. TD5 gearboxes can be [EDITED] and as far as Range Rovers go- petrol or diesel- well thats [EDITED] too!
Someone mentioned Nissan Xtrails- VERY popular lifestyle vehicles round here with their huuuuuge rubberized boot space although they're mostly higher models with the auto. Fuel delivery on the petrols can be... guess what.... [EDIT]
Turbogirl, no doubt what you've put above is in jest, but I was a moderator on a forum for a very long time, and it's easy to get a website into trouble if you start naming and shaming. Very easy in fact. So, what I choose to put, or not, is my business. Thanks for the understanding, and continued good luck in your business.
What I will say to the above though, is tell me you're not recommending the X trail diesel!? That engine has a naughty habit of eating itself. As for the freelander, well there is a reason so many of them are advertised as having the 'economy mod' done. In reality it's because the transfer box is made out of Edam, so they get cheapy configured for two wheel drive only.
As you may have guessed, I also have familial links to the garage trade.
What I will say to the above though, is tell me you're not recommending the X trail diesel!? That engine has a naughty habit of eating itself. As for the freelander, well there is a reason so many of them are advertised as having the 'economy mod' done. In reality it's because the transfer box is made out of Edam, so they get cheapy configured for two wheel drive only.
As you may have guessed, I also have familial links to the garage trade.
TurboGirl
Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Phewwww its a bloody minefield isn't it.... we've not encountered the xtrail problem (yet!) so I wasn't aware of it- obviously know about the navara 3rd conrod situation (2003-06) tho, I'll look out for the xtrails having a similar fault although they're a different block, aren't they? I believe the 2.0l earlier model use renault and the 2.2 being a nissan powerplant as opposed to the 2.5 navara D22 engine?
As far as the 2WD version and economy-modding freelanders to 2WD, apart from the clearance, it makes you wonder what the point is in buying a 4WD.... we've accidentally bought a modded one in the past and it was as practical as a rubber knife! So the lesson is to look underneath before buying anything, folks, cos they're not all as the manufacturers intended them to be....
I appreciate your words of caution, Billy, I'm a noob to the forum and am used to much more.... uhhhhh.... 'contentious' groups so although yes, I was trying to be 'tongue in cheek', your advice is definately a big help. Still makes me mad that you can't be open and help goodly folk avoid expensive pitfalls :S
As far as the 2WD version and economy-modding freelanders to 2WD, apart from the clearance, it makes you wonder what the point is in buying a 4WD.... we've accidentally bought a modded one in the past and it was as practical as a rubber knife! So the lesson is to look underneath before buying anything, folks, cos they're not all as the manufacturers intended them to be....
I appreciate your words of caution, Billy, I'm a noob to the forum and am used to much more.... uhhhhh.... 'contentious' groups so although yes, I was trying to be 'tongue in cheek', your advice is definately a big help. Still makes me mad that you can't be open and help goodly folk avoid expensive pitfalls :S
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Aye, it's not the rods that are the problem on the X-Trails Turbogirl, it's the intercooler, turbo and fuel pump in that order.
Intercoolers split all the time on them, I've seen with my own eyes as low as 22k miles, although others report even worse, in the teens. Also, they like to let go on the turbo oil seals which can lead to engine runaway at worst, and new turbo at best. Last but not least the diesel pumps on them are not without failure issues either, although personally I think this is a lot to do with misfuelling and then they fail. Tolerances in them are measured down to 2 microns, and they really don't last long without the lubricity of diesel fuel. Lifespan can be measured in seconds if its a heavy enough misfuel.
Also, I've heard - but not seen, so take on it as you will - of brake failures on them, with the system going single circuit without warning.
Regards the Freelanders and the 2.5 engine, yes belts are expensive to change but they are so over-specc'd on that engine they can literally do twice the design life that Rover stated, and indeed Powertrain cleared them to 120,000, it was Rover who wnet ultra conservative on that engine. Inlet manifolds do fail on the vis motors, but thats an easy fix for a true garage, and not just a parts replacer, if you see what I mean.
Biggest Freelander common issue is that bloody transfer box. It's fragile, and it breaks. Often. Hence, as you found, the cop out is to do the economy mod on them. At least Landy owned up to the front diff being chocolate in the LR322, and issued a recall which they still honour. Sadly that never happened with the Freelander.
As for 1.8 petrol head gaskets, well, I can do one now, and do it right, in an easy gong days work, I've done that many of them for friends over the years. They are pretty much a service item if you dont use the MLS gasket, but fit and forget if you do.
With the litigation issue, well, honestly, be careful. Anything you say on a forum, be rock solid on it, as companies can take issue. I was a mod on a car site, and we had one guy come on and state about problems he had with a certain outfit. You would not believe how quickly that went legal, and how quickly he found himself in the ****. Sadly, we had to cover ourselves as well, which cost us money we could, as a group, ill afford to part with from group funds.
Intercoolers split all the time on them, I've seen with my own eyes as low as 22k miles, although others report even worse, in the teens. Also, they like to let go on the turbo oil seals which can lead to engine runaway at worst, and new turbo at best. Last but not least the diesel pumps on them are not without failure issues either, although personally I think this is a lot to do with misfuelling and then they fail. Tolerances in them are measured down to 2 microns, and they really don't last long without the lubricity of diesel fuel. Lifespan can be measured in seconds if its a heavy enough misfuel.
Also, I've heard - but not seen, so take on it as you will - of brake failures on them, with the system going single circuit without warning.
Regards the Freelanders and the 2.5 engine, yes belts are expensive to change but they are so over-specc'd on that engine they can literally do twice the design life that Rover stated, and indeed Powertrain cleared them to 120,000, it was Rover who wnet ultra conservative on that engine. Inlet manifolds do fail on the vis motors, but thats an easy fix for a true garage, and not just a parts replacer, if you see what I mean.
Biggest Freelander common issue is that bloody transfer box. It's fragile, and it breaks. Often. Hence, as you found, the cop out is to do the economy mod on them. At least Landy owned up to the front diff being chocolate in the LR322, and issued a recall which they still honour. Sadly that never happened with the Freelander.
As for 1.8 petrol head gaskets, well, I can do one now, and do it right, in an easy gong days work, I've done that many of them for friends over the years. They are pretty much a service item if you dont use the MLS gasket, but fit and forget if you do.
With the litigation issue, well, honestly, be careful. Anything you say on a forum, be rock solid on it, as companies can take issue. I was a mod on a car site, and we had one guy come on and state about problems he had with a certain outfit. You would not believe how quickly that went legal, and how quickly he found himself in the ****. Sadly, we had to cover ourselves as well, which cost us money we could, as a group, ill afford to part with from group funds.
Even being rock solid there's still a danger. You might win a issue in court but do you really want to go to the expense and bother of a lengthy trial.
TurboGirl
Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
I'm really saddened by the fact that threat of litigation should stop genuine advice being given to folk, because of the need to protect the platform it is given over.
I'm sad also that theres little I can offer back to people that have made me so welcome as a bungling noob-in-the-woods, apart from our experience and knowledge of the 4x4 trade... I don't advertise or promote it because of forum rules but at least we could have helped others avoid pitfalls.
One day I'll meet you round a campfire and we can slag 'em off to our hearts content (manufacturers, not the forum!!!)
I'm sad also that theres little I can offer back to people that have made me so welcome as a bungling noob-in-the-woods, apart from our experience and knowledge of the 4x4 trade... I don't advertise or promote it because of forum rules but at least we could have helped others avoid pitfalls.
One day I'll meet you round a campfire and we can slag 'em off to our hearts content
(manufacturers, not the forum!!!)
I agree TurboGirl, it is sad that people must protect themselves and the forum - I'm just grateful for the advice I've been given. That's why we all come here; to share and ask for knowledge, it's just a shame that in these times we gotta be careful not to get ourselves taken to court in the process!
For what it's worth, I think it's looking like a Hyandai Santa Fe I'll be heading towrards; does anyone know of any known issues I should be aware of? Oh, and please feel free to inbox me
Thanks to all of you.
Kim
For what it's worth, I think it's looking like a Hyandai Santa Fe I'll be heading towrards; does anyone know of any known issues I should be aware of? Oh, and please feel free to inbox me
Thanks to all of you.
Kim
I've never heard of any trending issues with then Kim. If you can get a later one with cruise control etc, it's a very capable long distance car as well. I know of someone who reguarly takes his family to the alps in one.
Watch the flywheel and the clutch, a colleagues one has just been in for 3 yes, THREE grands worth of work when the clutch disintegrated, taking the flywheel and the bellhousings with it. (It was covered by the warranty, but wouldn't have been if it had gone a fortnight later...)
This is a diesel Rav4 problem too. Mine went at 80,000 miles and Toyota admit liability and will replace the parts at anything below 50,000. Cost me £1300.
A sincere thank to everyone who helped; I've bought a lovely 04 plate Santa Fe with 70k on the clock. Had it checked out by an ex audi mechanic who said it was in remarkably good nick.
Initial impressions are that it's just what I wanted! Time will be the real test I guess.
Thanks again.
Initial impressions are that it's just what I wanted! Time will be the real test I guess.
Thanks again.
