Gas bottle warning...

[tim_n]

Quite a few enterprising chaps have converted gas bottles into different things. I was a bit suprised when watching Kevin McClouds hot tub in the woods that no mention was made of the heating aspect.

Turns out it was because of this

http://www.hvpmag.co.uk/Calor-warns-customers-not-to-replicate-gas-cylinder-blunder/1722

Most worryingly:

Advice on how to create wood burning stoves is already widespread on the internet. This is not only dangerous, but unlawful. Subsequently, Calor will consider pursuing legal action against these websites and anyone who is found to be unlawfully tampering with cylinders.”

I assume only against their own cylinders. Plenty of other cylinders though. I don't have any calor gas bottles, neither do I have any contracts with any of these companies.

Perhaps we should be turning these over to the police as lost property when we find them.

 

[Keith_Beef]

Tampering with LPG cylinders or attempting to change their use is an unlawful offence and could lead to a claim for damages or criminal prosecution.

Unless the statute making the act unlawful is clearly stated, I take such statements with a large pinch of salt.

It is not the role of Calor or any other commercial enterprise to begin criminal proceeding against a member of the public for committing the offence of "changing the use of a gas cylinder". That is the role of the Crown Prosecution Service.

On the other hand, if the cylinder still belongs to Calor, then that is a different matter. If the gas cylinder remains the inalienable property of Calor, and I effectively buy the gas inside it for $10 and put a $30 deposit on the cylinder but it still belongs to Calor, then I am contractually obliged to return it to Calor in good condition. If I start cutting it up, I have effectively stolen or vandalized Calor's property. Now it might be a breach of contract, or it might be theft or criminal damage (I don't know which, and IANALNATLP).

Still, sloppy germalizm (I won't grace that piece with the term "journalism") just gets my back up and makes me want to go cutting up all the gas cylinders I can find, to make bells and forges and stoves!!!11!1!

 

[resnikov]

The hard bit is getting your deposit back, I got 2 patio gas bottles at home which although I paid a deposit on to get, I cannot return them to get my deposit. Been told I can only get the filled again! ***!!

 

[knifefan]

The reason that there are so many lying around is that the gas suppliers no longer pay the deposit back!!! I think that when you buy a bottle you do pay a deposit plus the gas costs!!! BUT you only get the value of the deposit back if you buy another bottle and do an exchange!! You can't even weigh 'em in as the scrappies won't accept them !!!

 

[cave_dweller]

The hard bit is getting your deposit back, I got 2 patio gas bottles at home which although I paid a deposit on to get, I cannot return them to get my deposit. Been told I can only get the filled again! ***!!

Ain't that the truth! I 'inherited' five 47kg propane bottles when I bought my house. Two were empty, three had some gas in them.

I've used most of the gas now, having got fittings for the gas bbq that work fine. Trouble is, all five bottles belong to gas companies that either don't exist any longer or refuse to come to fetch their bottles. I dialled the number on one bottle and got through to Countrywide (not the name on the bottle) who basically told me I'd have to pay the council to take the bottle away as they weren't interested. They would be quite happy to 'rent' me another full bottle though...

 

[FGYT]

ye its PITA i have calor gaz bottles that are old but unless you have a recipt and the agreement from the company you got the bottle from you cant return it and get the deposit

Ive a friend who sells Calor gas and he wont take them off me as Calor wont pay him for bottles extra to what hes had with no paperwork



I buy Flo gas no deposit and its cheaper gas and free delivery and they are not bothered if they take the old bottle back either (bottle does say propety of Flo gas )

 

[Keith_Beef]

The hard bit is getting your deposit back, I got 2 patio gas bottles at home which although I paid a deposit on to get, I cannot return them to get my deposit. Been told I can only get the filled again! ***!!

I hope you have a copy of the contract, or can get a copy of the text...

If it is a deposit, then it is refundable on return of the empty cylinder. Go to the Citizen's Advice Bureau for an opinion and err... advice.

The distributor might try to wriggle out of accepting the empties without giving you full cylinders. He might also try refusing on the grounds that if you can't show the paperwork you got when you took the full ones, then there's no proof that the contract was with you. Therefore no obligation to refund the deposit to you.

If you paid with a debit or credit card, or by cheque, then you'll have another record of a transaction with the distributor, which would support your claim to get back the deposit.

Or you could just take it up directly with Calor (or whoever it is)... distributors like that damage the brand image.

 

[Keith_Beef]

ye its PITA i have calor gaz bottles that are old but unless you have a recipt and the agreement from the company you got the bottle from you cant return it and get the deposit

Ive a friend who sells Calor gas and he wont take them off me as Calor wont pay him for bottles extra to what hes had with no paperwork



I buy Flo gas no deposit and its cheaper gas and free delivery and they are not bothered if they take the old bottle back either (bottle does say propety of Flo gas )

Looks like we were typing simultaneously...

On the other hand, if you offer to return the cylinders to Calor, and they are refused, they might become your own property to dispose of as you please.

You might be able to treat them as "unsolicited goods". If you offer Calor the possibility of accepting them and Calor refuses, I think that after six months they will become yours.

 

[Teepee]

If the gas bottle company doesn't exist anymore, its impossible to return them and assuming the rights to the empty bottles weren't sold on, surely there is no offence or breach of contract being committed?

Edit; yes, and un-solicited goods too.

 

[bigroomboy]

Oh stuff like this gets me riled up! Firstly I will do what the hell I want without some stupid association telling me what I can and can't do, why do these busy bodies have to stick there nose into everything which is none of their business. Why try to stop perfectly valid attempts at recycling with crap like that. If Calor gas and others are so keen on stating ownership then they have an obligation to keep records of where these bottles are and ensure they are properly disposed of, their bottles their obligation therefore they should be fines for every bottle that has been dumped some where littering because they own them!

Why is it seemingly no longer possible for people to make their own minds up about what they want to do. If somebody sees something like this on TV and just goes out an randomly attacks the gas bottle on their patio with an angle grinder without dong any research and they die then thats their stupid fault and only aids in cleaning up the gene pool!

 

[sasquatch]

Like most things in life common sense applies when using empty bottles. Every time they're mentioned on here people mention the dangers that go with it and it's not hard to do before cutting them open.

 

[tim_n]

When I signed up for a contract to rent one for my BBQ, the deposit is gone by year 5. I have no idea why, when I swap it, surely I get a different canister so it's not depreciation and I'm fairly sure I pay enough for the gas!

Anyway, not cutting up that one, just the ones I find.

 

[hobson]

Really, how are they going to find out? i'm not condoning cutting up a new, usable calor bottle, but there are plenty of old bottles dumped around the country that are of no use as they're out of test, rather than stick them in a landfill, surely it's better to use them?

Regarding safety, of course it has to be paramount, but the main ways to be safe are:

open the valve to let out any pressure, making sure you're outdoors.
Take the valve off, using spanners, stilsons, scaffold bars etc, NOT hammers or a grinder.
turn the bottle upside down for a day or two to let any gas sat at the bottom to come out
fill the bottle with water, all the way up, this will displace any other gas or residue.

Only when these have been done should a cylinder be cut into, and even then, i leave it with some water in, to extinguish sparks.

Also, calor are never, EVER going to condone cutting up or tampering with cylinders, for any reason. if they did, the first time someone blew themselves up, they'd be in big trouble.

 

[demographic]

Meh, Good luck to Calor finding a bloke called demographic.
Plus any I've used have been from now defunct companies or already damaged bottles.

 

[torc]

Courtesy of the freak show that is LiveLeak.
Not quite a gas cylinder but it shows the danger of cutting into a container not purged of fumes or residues beforehand.
[video]http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=b68_1354189290[/video]
Happy trails...torc.

 

[tim_n]

What can I use as a flue pipe? Other than expensive flue pipe? Suggestions from others seem to be that it's got to be 4-5" diameter. Saw the PC stove build and that also had a baffle.

 

[v8mule]

What can I use as a flue pipe? Other than expensive flue pipe? Suggestions from others seem to be that it's got to be 4-5" diameter. Saw the PC stove build and that also had a baffle.

I use 3" exhaust pipe from the local suplyer

 

[tim_n]

Try find a scrappy with a bus exhaust? Or is normal car one ok?

 

[shamal]

I used some old lamp posts tubing I had gave to me perfect flue clears well no smoke feedback

 

[shamal]

I also use washing up liquid as find the bubbles make sure all gas is forced out and helps to clean any from sides