Question about tarp size for 5 persons

[ndh611]

Hello everyone,

I'm a new member and this is the first time I post on this forum.

I'm about to have a 2-day-trip with my friends and it's rainy season here (in South East Asia) so we definitely need to build some sort of shelter.

I'm thinking about tarp because it's cheap, lightweight and only requires cords to set up. I'm wondering how big should the tarp be? So that 5 persons can fit nicely inside. We will not sleep under the tarp, we bring our own tent, but we need a place to sit down, process wood, drink coffee etc...

Your opinions are much appreciated.

Thanks.

[ndh611]

Little help here anyone?
Thanks

[MJM1]

At the weekend we used a roughly 5m x 5m tarp in very heavy rain. It was easily big enough for more than five people to sit under and cook over the center fire pit and stay dry.

[Seoras]

Are you trecking out on foot or in vehicles?

One large one if in a vehicle or if on foot you may need to think about using a couple of smaller ones.

George

[ged]

Hello everyone,

I'm a new member and this is the first time I post on this forum.

to BCUK.

I'm about to have a 2-day-trip with my friends and it's rainy season here (in South East Asia) so we definitely need to build some sort of shelter.

I'm thinking about tarp because it's cheap, lightweight and only requires cords to set up.

Well, you'll need a few trees/buildings/poles/vehicles or something too. And a few tent pegs will be handy but you can make them.

I'm wondering how big should the tarp be? So that 5 persons can fit nicely inside. We will not sleep under the tarp, we bring our own tent, but we need a place to sit down, process wood, drink coffee etc...

I'd say something in the range of four by four metres to five by five metres or the equivalent area would be enough for five people but a bit bigger would be more comfortable. Of course if there's a lot of wind a bigger tarp is more difficult to manage. If you can, pitch the tents so that the tarp shelters their openings too. You might want to take more than one tarp.

[ndh611]

Guys, I appreciate your comments.

Now we are down to 4 so I think that 4m x 4m would be good. We will be on our feet. Well basically we will drive to the camping site, and then park our car and start walking.

Do you have any suggestion on how should I set it up? Is an A frame a good idea? There will be no storms, but light-medium rain is expected. I think we can only bring cords, and tent pegs can be easily made from tree branches (a lot of hard woods here).

Thanks :-)

[santaman2000]

Standard for a 5 or 6 person Boy Scout patrol is a 12' X 12' (about 4 meters X 4 Meters) dining fly. Usually pitched in an A frame with a 6 or 7 foot ridge height. In fact the patrol usually practices just what you're suggeting; a central dining fly with tents for indiviual (or paired) campers. Usually the tents are pitched in a semi-circle with the fly pitched at the mouth of said semi-circle.

[ged]

... Do you have any suggestion on how should I set it up? Is an A frame a good idea? ...

I wouldn't bother using any kind of frame for a short stop of a couple of days because it takes a bit of time to set up a frame properly, and if you don't it knocks the stuffing out of the tarp when the wind blows it about. If the tarp is a good product the fastening of the cords to the tarp will be taken care of but on cheap tarps you can generally improvise better fixing points with e.g. small rocks or coins.

Here's a 3m x 3m tarp over my tent in Staffordshire earlier this year:

http://www.jubileegroup.co.uk/JOS/misc/dscf3819.jpg

The tarp is mostly hanging from cords tied around trees, it's pegged down along one edge. You can see one of the cords around the tree to the right of the tent. The tent is set up on a groundsheet in that picture, and as it will stand up on its own with no pegs if I want a bit more room I can just pull the tent out from under the tarp - taking care not to snag the tent's own groundsheet.

But there are lots of ways of using a tarp, search e.g. for 'tarpology' on this forum and elsewhere.

[santaman2000]

I wouldn't bother using any kind of frame for a short stop of a couple of days because it takes a bit of time to set up a frame properly, and if you don't it knocks the stuffing out of the tarp when the wind blows it about. If the tarp is a good product the fastening of the cords to the tarp will be taken care of but on cheap tarps you can generally improvise better fixing points with e.g. small rocks or coins...

I don't think he means using an actual frame. I think he means the configuration (shape) of the pitched tarp; an A shaped roof is usually referred to as an "A frame" tarp.

[ndh611]

I think he means the configuration (shape) of the pitched tarp; an A shaped roof is usually referred to as an "A frame" tarp.

Yes santaman was right. NOt using frame but the shape is /\ (no side cover).

Sorry English is not my mother tounge so sometimes it may not be clear.

@56santaman2000: Thanks for the information. You sound like you really got a lot to talk about bushcraft

Just another question: Do we need a ridge line, or we just tie the center of the tarps directly to 2 trees, and then the corner to the pegs on the ground?

(I have always used tent, so I'm a completely newbie when it comes to tarp)

@Ged: I can't load your picture. Is something wrong with the picture or my Internet connection sucks?

[ged]

Yes santaman was right. NOt using frame but the shape is /\ (no side cover).

Sorry English is not my mother tounge so sometimes it may not be clear.

No, the fault was mine for making the wrong assumptions. Your English is very good.

Just another question: Do we need a ridge line, or we just tie the center of the tarps directly to 2 trees, and then the corner to the pegs on the ground?

In heavy rain it's important to prevent water running along the ridge line and dripping into the sheltered space. There are several ways to do that, some tarps have loops on the top so that the ridge line is above the tarp and not below it. If your tarp has fixing points only at the edges you can do some rope tricks to make the water drip off the cord before it reaches you. The simplest thing to do is to tie a short piece of cord to the ridge line, near to where it fastens to the tarp, so that it just hangs down and water runs down it and drips off.

@Ged: I can't load your picture. Is something wrong with the picture or my Internet connection sucks?

It's because you are in Asia. I'm very sorry, but our servers see a huge amount of malicious traffic from Asia so most of it is firewalled for security reasons.

Try using a proxy, for example

http://anonymouse.org/cgi-bin/anon-w...c/dscf3819.jpg

[MJM1]

Just another question: Do we need a ridge line, or we just tie the center of the tarps directly to 2 trees, and then the corner to the pegs on the ground?

Some people simply tie to the centre fixings on opposite edges of the tarp but I always use a continuous ridge line as a support. That way I can tension it as much as I want without fear of ripping the tarp. You can then use a couple of prusiks (search for it on here) to keep the tarp taught on the ridge.
Tensioning the corners to the ground will probably make the sides too low. You could tie them to trees or cut some supporting poles and then peg to the ground.
Hope this helps.

Mike.

[santaman2000]

Yes santaman was right. NOt using frame but the shape is /\ (no side cover).

Sorry English is not my mother tounge so sometimes it may not be clear.

@56santaman2000: Thanks for the information. You sound like you really got a lot to talk about bushcraft

Just another question: Do we need a ridge line, or we just tie the center of the tarps directly to 2 trees, and then the corner to the pegs on the ground?...

I would not peg the sides to the ground. I would rather use guy lines from the tarp to the ground so as to leave the sides elevated as well if using the tarp as you intend as a comunal dining fly. Similar to this illustration www.scoutmastercg.com/2006/06/philmont_din

[ndh611]

I have just bought a 3x5m (12x20 in inch) tarp. Very good material. I also tried to set it up (at home) with my friends. Man, it's bigger than what I imagined, very comfortable inside :-)

Thanks Mike, Ged and Santaman for your sharing thoughts and illustration/picture.

I have seen both Ged and Santaman photo. The illustration from Philmont seems a bit over-killed for a tarp newbie like myself, but I got the idea. May be a I will simplify the string setup a little.

Mike, I will try both with and without a ridge-line and see what works best. Thanks for referring to the adjustable Prusik knot.

I have just watched Ray Mears video on Youtube about his choice of knots. Good but complicated stuff!!!
I have always used two half hitches (but quick release one) and it works for me well, did not fail if you know how to tie it properly and if I need tension, I just wrap around the object one more time before tying the knot.
May be that's why I will never be an expert, knowing just bowline, sheet-bend, clover-hitch, all simple stuff ha ha

[spiritwalker]

could have gone for a parachute for a communal camp?

[ndh611]

Hello, I have been back from the trip. The tarp was successfully set up with much ease (after learning a bunch of knots from Youtube).
Below are the pictures. I hope you enjoy.


The tarp


The tarp - side view


Prusik knot (I decided to use the ridgeline to prevent the tarp from wearing, and also have an extra line to hang stuff inside the tarp)


Me - tying the hammock


Marlinspike + Prusik makes a perfect suspension system. Marlinspike knot is great for hanging stuff also. Learnt this trick from Youtube.


Me sitting on the hammock. My weight is no problem


Lying on the hammock


Coffee and sausages on an alcohol stove made out of aluminium foil


Jungle made cover lid (with the aid of aluminium foil he he)


I set up this with a saw and a small machete


Some sausages


Buns on charcoal


This light is hung using natural cords from the jungle. This saves nylon cords. Will use more on the next trip.


Enjoying dinner under the tarp


The view after we leave. Everything has been cleaned up, as if no one stay there for a night.
--------
Thanks everyone again for your precious advices. This is a great forum.

[MartinK9]

Great pics, thanks for sharing.

[Seoras]

Great pics guys.

Thanks for sharing.

Looks like you chose a great spot.

Cheers

George

[ged]

Great photos - no rain then?

[Wayne]

Great photos. Looks like you had a great time. Thanks for sharing.

[ndh611]

Great photos - no rain then?

Yes Ged, no rain. The whole week it was raining, then it spares a day for us. How nice ha ha!
Actually it was raining at the city, my wife called to check if we are ok, but it did not rain in the jungle at all.

MartinK9, George, Wayne: thank you guys. We did have a great time in the jungle. It's super relaxing. I'm just back and already miss it.

[Scots_Charles_River]

cool pics.