When literally everything is wet ?

[Paullyfuzz]

Was on Dartmoor over the weekend and it didn't stop raining all the time. Went into a few woods just to have a look see and everything was wet and had been for some time. I would have no problem getting a small fire started as I always carry dry tinder with me. Im not really sure however, how I would sustain any kind of decent fire as the fuel around was wet wet wet.
Whats the solution ?

[Peteo]

Any dry standing wood at all? Thats whats always worked for me. I just kee a fire going with dry standing, split the wet and dry it out around the fire before putting it on

[santaman2000]

If you can get a fire going the rest is easy. Just put the wet wood near the fire to dry before you need it. If the fire is hot enough it will steam off the water from the re-fuel anyway (just put it on a few minutes before you need it)

This has always worked for me anyway.

[Paullyfuzz]

There was no dry standing wood anywhere. everything was wet through as it had been raining so long. The only dry stuff was the small amount of tinder I had with me in my firefighting kit. The only solution I could see was to start splitting logs until I got to the dry stuff ?

[rik_uk3]

Plan your kit and food based on NOT having a fire then when you can its a bonus. You don't NEED a fire, hikers and climbers do fine without one so if your clothes/sleeping bag/shelter are up to the weather you should have no problems really; pack a micro stove and 250gm canister of gas, well worth the weight and comfort provided.

[Paullyfuzz]

I hear ya Rik, but was just wondering what to do in such wet conditions .

[BareThrills]

I tested a new bit of kit this weekend. I gathered wood from the drainage ditches at rough close which were actively floating in the water. I then lit this bad boy under a stack of it.



Its made from a maxi tealight candle (£2 for 9 at tesco). I replaced the wick with two cotton rope wicks. It burns for an hour and after 20 mins i had dried and burned the wet wood to establish a great heart to the fire. If you dont have cotton rope you could use cardboard. It will get you out of jail in pretty much all conditions.

without this i would batton out standing deadwood to get to the dry heart. My preferred wet start tinder is maya sticks and if its really bad ill wrap some rubber around them.

[udamiano]

The only solution I could see was to start splitting logs until I got to the dry stuff ?

Simply, yes thats the only answer if the surrounding fuel is that wet. Build a small shelter to cover the split wood, thats off the ground and near the fire, to help the drying process. For Tinder i tend to use either 'wet fire' or inner tube' in those conditions and save my natural tinder to dryer times, I carry these with me as well as my natural stuff, as you never know, A small shelter above your fire in the first instances will help get the fire going, nothing exotic, I often just use the wet split wood as a kinda roof as its wet anyway, simply put four stakes into the ground, two cross pieces and then lay the split wood across to make a cover.
Making a descent fire in wet conditions is all about good preparation. the more prep the better the fire. Think alter fire with a cover

[mrcharly]

this is where a small folding saw is really useful.

Quite often there are short lengths of dead wood on tree branches - with a saw it is easy to cut these off. They won't be very wet, the water will have mostly run off.

As for fire lighting, when I lived by a solid fuel stove and the tinder was wet, I found a tea light made a great firelighter. Don't light it directly, but place it so some tinder will start melting the tea light. The molten wax runs and soaks into the wood, then burns for ages. You can, in extremis, stand the tea light on edge on a pile of thin sticks and light the wick. The wax will run onto the sticks, then light those.

[The Lord Poncho]

Simply, yes thats the only answer if the surrounding fuel is that wet. Build a small shelter to cover the split wood, thats off the ground and near the fire, to help the drying process. For Tinder i tend to use either 'wet fire' or inner tube' in those conditions and save my natural tinder to dryer times, I carry these with me as well as my natural stuff, as you never know, A small shelter above your fire in the first instances will help get the fire going, nothing exotic, I often just use the wet split wood as a kinda roof as its wet anyway, simply put four stakes into the ground, two cross pieces and then lay the split wood across to make a cover.
Making a descent fire in wet conditions is all about good preparation. the more prep the better the fire. Think alter fire with a cover

I've done something along a similar idea, but maybe not quite as involved- essentially I build a fire reflector out of wet wood, and rotate the logs within, taking out dry ones for the fire and replacing with wet. That way you get the benefit of some reflected heat as well (although i suppose it must take a bit of energy out of the reflected heat if it is drying the wood as well).

[udamiano]

The problem in heavy rain is always two fold, getting the fire to a level before the rain can put it out, and secondly stopping the wet ground from putting your fire out. Ive built fires when its literally stair rodding it down, I agree it sounds a bit involved, but believe me the extra time spent at the beginning will make all the difference later on. the fire will eventually become big enough, so it consumes your little cover, but by then it has got to a stage that a little rain is unlikely to put it out.

[John Fenna]

The problem in heavy rain is always two fold, getting the fire to a level before the rain can put it out, and secondly stopping the wet ground from putting your fire out. Ive built fires when its literally stair rodding it down, I agree it sounds a bit involved, but believe me the extra time spent at the beginning will make all the difference later on. the fire will eventually become big enough, so it consumes your little cover, but by then it has got to a stage that a little rain is unlikely to put it out.

I have used this kind of set up myself and they do work well
My "get out of jail card" is a block of wax and sawdust mix in an old egg carton segment - I get both the dead candles I use, the sawdust and cartons free (from my church, from my sawing of firewood at home and busted/stained cartons that cannot be reused) and I simple melt the old candle stubs and pour the wax into the cartons which are full of sawdust, then add sawdust and wax until the sections are full. The wax soaked egg devider bits make great wicks and it is a dead cert firelighter - or even fuel for a hobo (but a bit sooty for regular use...) - no matter what the weather

[tomongoose]

Last time I was on Dartmoor and it was soaking I managed to use some gorse that had been swaled and cut the outer layers off and it was dry inside. I had enough for my little wood stove and had I perseverd I could have got enough for a small fire

[Buckshot]

I was helping to run a scout survival camp last weekend in similar conditions
Parts of the wood looked like the Somme!
One group came to me saying they couldn't light a fire So I went with them to have a look
One lad was trying to split wood, but they only had a 3 sticks and said that was 'lots'
I helped split some 2 inch branches and then went to find some small stuff
There was loads of broken twigs hanging in the trees, wet outer but dry inner, similarly dead fallen trees with branches pointing up were stripped.
Soon we had double handfulls of matchstick, pencil and finger thickness sticks about a foot long
An inch long piece of innertube went on top of the split sticks creating a base and dry area above the ground
Then lower the sticks gently onto the flame from the inner tube until they start to take, then the next etc.
We also made a roof for the fire which helped.
Once you've got to the point where inch plus logs can go on you're there.

That's how I did it anyway

Mark

[spandit]

Thrust your hand inside a leylandii and there is normally a load of dry, dead stuff that burns like fury - don't know how widespread these are in the wild but there is no shortage in urban areas!

If you can find softwood it's likely to be full of resin and burn quite well

[oldtimer]

I found myself in a similar situation some years ago in the Rockies. Cold, miserable with hungry wife and two small boys. I'm sorry to say we went to bed hungry with my reputation in tatters. An American Civil Air Patrol member we met later told me about using the resin-rich heartwood from dead pine trees which will light and burn in almost any conditions. This can then be used to ignite wood wet on the outside. Trouble is, its a bit like so many survival tips in that it is location specific. There are plenty of suitable dead pines in the Rockies but it might not be so easy to find on Dartmoor. I also learned the hard way on that trip how sound the advice Buckshot gives about small pieces of wood and that when you need a fire in a hurry, slow down, take your time and goabout it carefully.

Although I nowadays avoid making open fires as often as possible being a dedicated "leave no trace" practitioner, I always have the odd vaseline daubed cotton wool ball in the pack just in case.

[Harvestman]

There's an argument that says, if it is that wet, just do without a fire.

If you need the fire for warmth, then you've packed the wrong kit. If you need it for cooking, you should have checked the weather forecast and packed a stove. I'm not criticising you personally, because you are requesting information, and I do believe that wet firemaking is an important skill that people should practice - you might need it in a survival situation, say, after falling in a river. Lots of good tips have been posted here already, but there's nothing like the experience of actually trying to do it for real.

Just emphasising that preparedness is also important, as it can sometimes mean you don't find yourself in a difficult position in the first place. Personally I always have enough tinder and dry kindling on me to get a decent fire going.

[Bosun]

I suspect that I was at the same "do" as Buckshot. Miserden?

Slightly OT, but my feet got soaked and stayed that way for most of Sunday. As a consequence, I think that I've rather stupidly contracted a touch of trench foot (and I'm one of those leaders who goes on at the YP about footcare).

It was v painful on Sunday/Monday, so it's an experience I'd like to avoid in the future. Changing socks wasn't really an option (I was carrying spares) as my approach shoes were so wet that the socks became soaks almost as soon as I put them on. I suppose that I could've worn my hiking boots - or even wellies - but they weren't where I was.

Has anyone tried Sealskinz waterproof socks? Any good.

[zarkwon]

No fires allowed on Dartmoor mate. Stoves only. Problem solved

[santaman2000]

I found myself in a similar situation some years ago in the Rockies. Cold, miserable with hungry wife and two small boys. I'm sorry to say we went to bed hungry with my reputation in tatters. An American Civil Air Patrol member we met later told me about using the resin-rich heartwood from dead pine trees which will light and burn in almost any conditions. This can then be used to ignite wood wet on the outside. Trouble is, its a bit like so many survival tips in that it is location specific. There are plenty of suitable dead pines in the Rockies but it might not be so easy to find on Dartmoor...

I could have sworn I'd read discussions on this forum regarding fatwood?

[BareThrills]

I could have sworn I'd read discussions on this forum regarding fatwood?

Yes fatwood is widely used by people on the forum and its my personal favourite. if you can find some in the wild then cool but I buy mine as ive never seen it in my usual haunts

[Buckshot]

I suspect that I was at the same "do" as Buckshot. Miserden?

Slightly OT, but my feet got soaked and stayed that way for most of Sunday. As a consequence, I think that I've rather stupidly contracted a touch of trench foot (and I'm one of those leaders who goes on at the YP about footcare).

It was v painful on Sunday/Monday, so it's an experience I'd like to avoid in the future. Changing socks wasn't really an option (I was carrying spares) as my approach shoes were so wet that the socks became soaks almost as soon as I put them on. I suppose that I could've worn my hiking boots - or even wellies - but they weren't where I was.

Has anyone tried Sealskinz waterproof socks? Any good.

Indeed the same place
I was in the outsiders camp at BCHQ
Similar to you I didn't pack wellies. Infact the boots were an after thought. I normally just wear my Five fingers
I have sealskinz socks I used in my mocs when deer stalking. Work really well. Keep them clean as dirt seems to reduce the 'proofing' somehow. Don't know how but someone I know said that he's used them and after a wear or two they aren't so good until you wash them, then they work again.

Mark

[NikolaTesla]

Thrust your hand inside a leylandii and there is normally a load of dry, dead stuff that burns like fury - don't know how widespread these are in the wild but there is no shortage in urban areas!

If you can find softwood it's likely to be full of resin and burn quite well

Yeah I doubt you will get them out in the bush, but everyone plants them, my garden has about 5 of them. They burn like gorse and should be dry if you get it from inside of the tree.

[ged]

Put a tarp or some other shelter over the fire, then the rain won't bother it and wood that you put around it to dry will actually get dry.

Obviously the tarp needs to be high enough that it doesn't catch fire. That means that to shelter the fire effectively if there's a lot of wind and little or no shelter from the wind, it will need to be reasonably big. A second tarp could shelter both you and the fire from sideways-driving wnd and rain.

I've used just a sheet of plythene, a few bits of cordage and a very big rock to make it possible to light a fire and keep it going realtively easily in very heavy rain.

[Shewie]

Some good tips here already, one way I've found to work well is to stack the split wood in a tipi style around the fire, that way you get to dry out the thicker stuff while establishing some embers. Once it goes though you need to repeat the process once again.

Another method I tried on a course was to use a tea light candle and stack smaller wood around it, cover the whole thing with big pieces of bark, sycamore and cedar work well, the candle and roof act like an oven and really help things along.