we are but are the rest ? solar flare survival

[Bluebs4]

after todays big solar flare and all the playing up mother natures been doing over the last couple of years should we prep just incase? and if so what would you stock up on ,best preservatives ect ect.....................

http://www.solar-storm-warning.com/H...lar_Storm.html

[Laurentius]

Well if there was a biggie today, it seems not have disabled my computer or the internet does it?

I need to stock up on kalashnikov's and fiercely loyal warriors to protect my own, the rest will follow from that.

[spandit]

Well if there was a biggie today, it seems not have disabled my computer or the internet does it?

Gmail went down earlier today... I was distraught

[Urban X]

after todays big solar flare and all the playing up mother natures been doing over the last couple of years should we prep just incase?

Nah, it'll all be over on 21st Dec of this year, finito, no more hominids et al, end of the world, etc., etc., better off getting some camping & bushcraft in before we all go pfffftttt! Who the hell wants to eat rice n beans for the next 15 years?

What would I stock up on, alcohol, tobacco and firearms, damnit, the ATF already have that one covered, umm.... Salt, plenty of salt.


Si

[udamiano]

So if in the case of a large Solar flare, drastically effecting the earth! what are the known issues.

firstly a large surge in the national grid that would overload the circuit and thus blow all the 'Darleks' in the sheds up (transformers and regulators, an such)

If this was the case then the loss of electricity would be the main problem, and as such all that is dependant upon it, so electric lights, heating, communications (although this has a separate circuit ) refrigeration.

so lets consider what this is likely to mean. So for the man/women in the street that after sunset all forms of natural lighting would be gone, so some form of illumination would be required to perform any extension of a days work.

Refrigeration would not happen so, how would you extend the life of any foods you have, especially meat, dairy, or fish product. these would either have to be processed to prolong storage, or used on a need to basic which would mean an adoption of a different set of eating habits. If on cold winters though the ambient low temperature would of course help to prolong the 'shelf life' of those times, the hot summers (if we do get any) would have an adverse effect.

consider your heating arrangements and how much do you rely upon them. don't get sidetracked that your heating is gas and therefore not going to be effected, sorry the gas in the main is pumped through the pipes probably using some form of electric pumps which of course no longer works. Is there an alternative that can be used safely to heat your home (I say safely, because flues that are designed to vent gas fumes are NOT suitable to vent fumes from a real fire)

The supply chain will be initially disrupted so things like bread, milk and fresh goods would be very hard come by, I would also imagine going by the usual hysteria that is accompanied by a small fully of snow in the UK, that most shops and supermarkets would be long stripped bear. so what and how do you eat until the problem is sorted.

lack of power in water treatment facilities would also mean a lack of clean fresh water, and an increase in associated diseases like cholera, in fact due to lack of general manufacturing, I would imagine a shortage of medicines would follow in a short time, with medical institutions being given the highest priority. So a simple cut or worse could turn into something a lot more problematic, so what and how would you treat these problems, say without the use of modern medical supplies.

Of course the main issue will be how fast can the initial damage be rectified, this of source would be a major consideration, as no matter how well you horde or prep, a prolonged state will have every increasing problems. these include general law and order and security, as those with not, look to those with have, with envious eyes.

Da

[Laurentius]

Who is to say I have not been eating rice and beans over the last 15 years never mind the next, well with the odd dish of bacon and eggs in between

[Laurentius]

Udamimaiono, you worry too much. I would miss my computer sorely, but even though my flat is heated by electricity and I cook by same, doesn't mean I couldn't do without it. I still have an open half and could burn anything I want in that, were it not for smokeless zone legislation, but when the balloon goes up, who is going to enforce it (cough ... splutter)

I think the worst thing actually is the dependance of modern shopping on POS communication, debit card authentication and all that. I can recall during the power cuts of the three day week in the 70's when shops stayed open by the light of tilley lamps and still did business, I don't think they could do that today.

[udamiano]

Nah does worry me not in the slightest tbh, I was responding to the OP question.

I have full back up services including a generator and fuel store. So quite happy. communications could be done through wireless radio, a bit slow but...

the post was mearly to give a basis for discussion. I like threads like this, it shows how creative people can be when it really comes down to it.

The 70s were slightly different, we used money more then, as opposed to plastic transactions and computer banking through cash machines, the shops may stay open but would unlikely to accept plastic, just hard cash which interestingly would need to be attained how?

[Laurentius]

I have a generator too, petrol unfortunately so I can't run it on cooking fat, in fact I can't run it at all where I live now, it is a legacy from the past when I did not live in a flat.. Guess I will have to make do with a solar panel and battery after all.

[Urban X]

I think the worst thing actually is the dependance of modern shopping on POS communication, debit card authentication and all that. I can recall during the power cuts of the three day week in the 70's when shops stayed open by the light of tilley lamps and still did business, I don't think they could do that today.

I remember those days too, but those were the days of cash, I think you're spot on Laurentius, the problem wouldn't be the shops being able to stay open but the POS systems, etc., etc., and us having the actual cash to buy things, I used to go to the bank or BS with my book and get money out, now I use an ATM, even if I do go into the bank it's all done via computer, plastic would be useful for spreading heatsink paste on cpu coolers and the odd lock, but not much else.

It'd be mass panic if the grids went pop, rioting, the inevitable looting... Could get tricky..

Reckon Solar Flares are the least of our worries though personally. And after reading the "What have you bought.." thread for a good few hours today there are soooo many shiny things I NEEED to buy before the balloon goes up. So, so many shiny things I discovered in that thread...


Si

[udamiano]

interesting enough, the solar panel solution would probably be the best option, certainly for running small critical services, a small camp fridge for instance. or even a single set of LEDs.
The problem of course is storing /producing enough charge to last any significant length of time.

And you said you have an open hearth which would be a significant bonus, again playing devil advocate what would you burn in it to say cook on, and do you have say the types of pots and pans that would be unto open fire cooking.

I hope you don't mind, as i said I find these types of threads, and peoples ideas very interesting.

I think I also read that your now the proud owner of an allotment. Now thats is something that would be worth it veritable weight in gold

[Laurentius]

We have become all too conditioned to credit and debit cards, and I had the usual panic when I lost my debit card over the weekend, fortunately I had some spare cash, it is always worthwhile keeping some cash because it need not be a solar flare.

[Urban X]

Some interesting ideas and gizmos in this thread regarding Solar stuff. I've gotta get one of these to have a play.

Yep, re cash, I do try and keep half of my money in cash, unless it's a heavy bill month, but then I have to fight the temptation more, I find it easier to spend cash than I do wave the plastic, well, apart from Paypal which coupled with that Bay place has to be the worst thing ever for juicing the old account.


Si

[santaman2000]

So if in the case of a large Solar flare, drastically effecting the earth! what are the known issues.

firstly a large surge in the national grid that would overload the circuit and thus blow all the 'Darleks' in the sheds up (transformers and regulators, an such)

If this was the case then the loss of electricity would be the main problem, and as such all that is dependant upon it, so electric lights, heating, communications (although this has a separate circuit ) refrigeration...

...consider your heating arrangements and how much do you rely upon them. don't get sidetracked that your heating is gas and therefore not going to be effected, sorry the gas in the main is pumped through the pipes probably using some form of electric pumps which of course no longer works...

Sounds logical but in the cases where electricity has gone down (longest period here was for over 2 weeks after a hurricane) the gas (I'm on natural gas piped in) has never once gone down. And I suppose even if it had, that wouldn't have effected the homes that have their own butane tanks (the norm here is a 500 gallon tank)

Mosy residents in hurricane zones have a small gasoline generator for emergency electric power but a few have permanently installed (hard wired) large back-up generators that burn eithe natural gas or butane. None have experienced any fuel shortages problems yet; as I said though, my longest period so far has been 2 weeks. Areas around New Orleans went 6-8 weeks. Some even longer.

[udamiano]

I totally agree, I believe its been to much of a quiet easy revolution for the banking system to move us to easily controlled computer monitored spending. I usually prefer to use cash where possible. Not for any deep down conspiracy theory type reason, I just prefer it that way LOL.

[cbr6fs]

Problem comes from a really big solar flare, not only will it take out Satellites, power supply infrastructure, it's also fry smaller electronics like phones, TV's Radio's, car electrics and generator electrics.

I'm not confident that we will get a flare THAT big soon, but for the hassle i do have 2 radios, chargers and a few bits that are stored in a home made faraday cage.

That's your best bet really if your concerned, as IF the flair is big enough to take down the power supply grid there is a good chance it's taken out the electronics in your car and your generator, by covering them in a faraday you dramatically reduce the risk.\

[udamiano]

Sounds logical but in the cases where electricity has gone down (longest period here was for over 2 weeks after a hurricane) the gas (I'm on natural gas piped in) has never once gone down. And I suppose even if it had, that wouldn't have effected the homes that have their own butane tanks (the norm here is a 500 gallon tank)

I'm guessing that the gas is pumped down the pipes from regional pump stations within an enclosed system, so if one station goes down the station before takes up the slack and increases the load. this would probable mean that the pumping station was outside the effected area, which is a smart move.
I use fuel oil and have a 3000lt storage tank, but the same would go for butane storage off the grid.
So OK for a while, but without top-up the tanks will inevitably run dry, Again I believe this is a hypothetical scenario, and just playing devils advocate to get the ideas running

[Laurentius]

I thought that a car was a Faraday cage, a car can be struck by lightening and survive.

[udamiano]

I thought that a car was a Faraday cage, a car can be struck by lightening and survive.

No the current will take the path of least resistance, which in the cars case is the body, so it doesn't need to enter the engine bay, A large EMP however causes induced current to flow in a closed electrical circuit, creating a flow of electrons where effectively there was none to start with, this damages small circuits by overloading them with more current than they are designed to cope with

[santaman2000]

I'm guessing that the gas is pumped down the pipes from regional pump stations within an enclosed system, so if one station goes down the station before takes up the slack and increases the load. this would probable mean that the pumping station was outside the effected area, which is a smart move.
I use fuel oil and have a 3000lt storage tank, but the same would go for butane storage off the grid.
So OK for a while, but without top-up the tanks will inevitably run dry, Again I believe this is a hypothetical scenario, and just playing devils advocate to get the ideas running

Agreed much would depend on just how long before normalcy was restored. Assuming that even a massive solar flare would only effect 1/2 the planet (the other half being away from the Sun) I would imagine that some sort of international rescue efforts would eventually commence. Granted politics and exploitation would likely effect said efforts.

[santaman2000]

I thought that a car was a Faraday cage, a car can be struck by lightening and survive.

The general belief about a car surving a lightning strike has more to do with it NOT being grounded (rubber tires are an insulator) Similar to birds sitting on power lines.

[Andy BB]

I'd get a big club and stalk houses with smoke coming from the chimneys and light coming from the windows, cos they'll obviously have the supplies I need. And my long term preper of training all my daughters to higher levels of black belts in full-contact taekwondo will provide me with a ready-made defense force to hang on to my ill-gotten gains

[Bushwhacker]

Who's going to run and maintain all of the world's current nuclear power stations when the proverbial hits the fan?
They'll all be in meltdown within a couple of years, good luck with that!

[southey]

IF it does this picture depicts how I shall live(thats me with the cool ass knife hand!!!)

[Prawnster]

The communications network should be unaffected by a solar flare, the hard lines anyway. The government spent a lot of money making sure BT's network is EMP proof. My father in law designed and built the hardware. They were thinking more along the lines of a nuclear strike scenario than a solar flare. Same principle though, I believe.


Sent from whatever the coolest gadget is these days.

[southey]

saw an interesting doc about the power grid too, they open every switch in the system to accommodate the surge, cool huh!

[Bushwhacker]

[blacktimberwolf]

I thought that a car was a Faraday cage, a car can be struck by lightening and survive.

It is but only the occupants will survive if they don't touch anything metal connected to the out side...the car however will probably have a rendezvous with the scrapyard.

[blacktimberwolf]

Who's going to run and maintain all of the world's current nuclear power stations when the proverbial hits the fan?

EDF of course

[iHydro]

Interesting thread. My first thought would be to move higher up out of the way of the chaos and panic, getting myself and my family to a relative safety away from looting etc. I'd then go and find adequate supplies to help establish a more permanent shelter. I'm by no means a bushcrafter but I'd do my best to live off the land and feed my family until the worst has passed (maybe 6 months) by which point looting will be over, population will have withered due to lack of food/water. I'd then prepare to move on to somewhere else where I could better provide for my family and start rebuilding a community with other likeminded people.