Reply With QuoteCouldn't you just undo the torx screw and file down the locking bar?
Modifying a Leatherman Wave to make it legal.
Hello, new to the boards, though I've been browsing them for months, finally decided to join in starting with a suggestion/question.
I recently purchased a Leatherman Wave multitool as an EDC knife without knowing the exact law, with the news talking about them recently I decided to look into the law a bit and have come to realise that my knife is illegal for every day carry, (ie without a valid reason) I'm a rather annoyed that its illegal just because it locks, I mean if a person is going to use a knife against a person then I don't think they care about the law, or if it locks or not, but anyway lets not get into the discussion of our silly laws.
I thought about just carrying it anyway, but with me being 20 I feel as though I'm likely to be more of a target for a police search or that they wouldn't believe me. I've looked into buying a Swiss Army Knife but none of them really take my fancy, so I've thought about modifying my Leatherman.
For anyone unfamiliar with the Leathermans locking mechanism, here is a picture of the blade locked.
And here is a photoshopped image of what I intend to do, it involves holding the locking spring in the down position whilst running a bead of TIG weld across it, then grind flush.
After seeing them photo's in high res, What I thought was a clean knife really isn't, It's due a bath!
Now my question is, would this make my knife legal if I did it on both the serrated and non serrated blades, or would I have to do the saw too? and also does anyone have any suggestions of ways I could do this without welding as I don't have a TIG welder and would need to blag a favour.
Opinions and suggestions will be welcome.
Thanks
Danny
Couldn't you just undo the torx screw and file down the locking bar?
:
...I swear by it. You'll often see me there, crouched and blaspheming...
I have no really helpful answer, but as a tester, see how sturdy the blade is if you're holding down the lock (or maybe find some temporary way of jamming it down so it doesn't engage the blade) that way you can decide if you actually want to modify it before you weld things down..
Personally I prefer my blades to be relatively secure in the open position, but others aren't so fussed.
One alternative is the British Army Knife - If you don't particularly need an actual point on the blade (it's a sheepfoot blade so cutting only, not so hot at poking) it might be ideal.
They come in 3 flavours. 1 piece, 2 piece and 3 piece.
1 piece = sheepfoot blade.
2 piece = sheepfoot blade and a can opener
3 piece = sheepfoot blade, can opener and a marlinspike.
Be aware though, I believe some of them lock open.
There are many styles from older ones with rubber scales to the more recent ones (like mine) which are all metal.
Mine comes with these words (all in uppercase) on the sideThe cutting edge was a bit of a mess when i got it, so don't be too surprised if you can't find a super neat one - but some elbow grease and a rub over some wet and dry, stones or diamond should see it right without too much bother.The original
British Army Knife (this line written in old english)
Stainless Steel
Made in Sheffield England
The look might appeal to you if you're into the leatherman look too.
Hope this helps.
Oh - and try the forum on the BritishBlades website. That place is crawling with people who can answer your questions about both the practical side of the modification and the legality of the end product.
Last edited by BigShot; 06-02-2009 at 02:37.
I agree.Originally Posted by BigShot
I think that you can ruin your tool. I own a Wave and I can't see using it without lock.
The more you know, the less you carry.
Hello,
Have you tried to bend the locking bar so that it bends downwards and therefore doesnt shift into the path of the back of the blade? Might be possible to place a screwdriver underneath the bar at the part where it is first visable and then bend the end downwards...
Just had a better idea. Just pop some large washers on between the blade and the body of the knife. Make them big so that they cover the space that the lock moves into. Problem solved and easy to undo. If your not sure what I mean post back and I'll sort out a diagram somehow.
With regards to the saw locking I'll put washers on them too.
Hope this helped
Jim
gzornenplat - i'm not really sure, though im a bit hesitant to try as I imagine they have thread locker on them and are set to a specific torque.
BigShot - I went with the Leatherman mainly because of it's features, main one being the pliers. And thanks for suggesting i try it without the lock, I've just tried and it flops aboutthat's that idea down the drain.
jimmyuk - Good suggestion about the washers, but again I've realised the knife is useless without the lock.
So now my question has changed, I think I'm going to have to give up the pliers and get a SAK
Thanks
Danny
Last edited by dannyg; 06-02-2009 at 03:12. Reason: Spelling
The Victorinox SwissTools have a different locking mechanism which looks like it
should be quite easy to remove (I don't think you'd be able to put it back, though)
and the blades on mine flick into place on their own when I hold the lock in the
unlock position while opening any of the blades/tools.
If you are interested, I'll take a couple of close-ups so you can see what it's like
:
...I swear by it. You'll often see me there, crouched and blaspheming...
DannyG - if you're really not keen on the look of the SAKs there are alternatives, such as the BAK that I described above.
I also saw a really nice knife in a farm supplies shop last night, but can't for the life of me remember what brand it was. It was a really simple thing, just a main blade and a springback to hold it open. Cost about a tenner.
I'm not sure if you'll get a full-of-features knife without going down the leatherman or largeSAK route, but if it's the look of the leatherman you're after there are choices and all relatively cheap too.
I suppose if you really do need the pliers, you could remove the offending blades from your leatherman so you can EDC that, and supplement it with something like the BAK or similar for cutting duties.
A wise move I think, removing the lock is just asking for the removal of finger parts
That said, I have a Leatherman 'Crunch' which features a single, very small, non threatening blade. I filed away the blade part that engages with the locking mechanism making it a legally carry-able folding knife, additionally I have found the pliers on the 'Crunch' to be more useful than the ones on the 'Wave'.
http://www.leatherman.com/multi-tool...ls/crunch.aspx
If you really don't need the blades ,I'm sure they can be removed.I wouldn't like them to be unlockable, as you say they just flop about.
Leatherman designed this knife to have locking blades....
They know better than you!
I would think you are asking for trouble (and shorter fingers) if you try to modify this knife.
Slipjoints (UK legal) have a degree of resistance built into the mechanism to prevent easy closing on the fingers. Removing the lock will create a free floating knife blade that could easily close on you.
My advice would be to either:
1, Continue using and carrying it as intended. Most Police officers that i know carry multitools and although the law states they are illegal "without reason" i don't honestly think you have much of a problem. Unless you are using it in a threatening manner or consider yourself to be prone to be "stopped and searched" the chances of anything happening to you are slim. I have lent Police (that i don't know) my swisstool and they haven't batted an eyelid.
**that is unless you get a Police officer without any commen sense**
2, Hold to the letter of the law. Carry the Wave as and when you have due reason to. For UK legal EDC have a look around and carry something legal.
I stopped using my Swisstool for that reason. I now carry a Shing slipjoint (custom knife) for a blade and a leatherman squirt for small pliers and screwdrivers.
Good luck with whatever you decide to do
"They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance."
Famous last words of General John Sedgwick
May 8th, 1864
Every time I read something like this, it blows my mind that it's even an issue. It's a sad state of affairs, and I wonder how much further it will go.
Oblio - my sentiments EXACTLY!
The entire concept of these laws are so fundamentally flawed, and so fundamentally stupid that I find it hard to rise above abject ridicule and bitter sarcasm about it all.
That there's pretty much NO hope of turning it around with the frenzy the media are whipping up and the fact any sensible politician (oxymoron? I dunno) who agreed that it was silly would be comitting professional suicide to argue as such just add to the situation.
Utterly daft - it really is.
I've got a Gerber Legend mutiltool that is currently doing EDC duty. I undid the pivot bolt and took out the blade then spaced out with washers. Original washers and blade are stored together so I can reverse the process. I have a baby Victorinox and Gerber Eclipse in my wallet if I need a cutty thing.
My advice would be not to do anything that can't be undone to the Leatherman. It's a decent and pricey piece of kit so dont wreck that one. Is there any way of shimming between the lock and the scale so that the lock cannot engage? A little bit of superglue and it should only be removable with solvent and tools.
Anything you do to override the locking mechanism is likely to cause damage in the long term. I'd leave it well alone and only carry it when you have a specific purpose. If you find yourself in a situation where it might cause a problem, get it into the bottom of a bag so it is not immediately available and come clean about it being with you.
Frankly if you have any doubts, leave it at home and take the tools you need for your work only, then there can be no repercussions.
ATB
Ogri the trog
Improvise, Adapt & Overcome
www.Reddragonbushcraft.com
A multitool is not a knife
There was a case went to appeal a few years (can't remember the name) and the courts decided that a multitool is not a knife, therefore the 3 inch exemption doesn't apply. So anyone carrying a multitool runs the risk of arrest even if the blade doesn't lock and it's below 3 inches.
D'yer know, reading this thread has got me thinkin', everyone run!
maybe a SAK could be made with a piece of spare metal which could lock the blade when in use, yer know what I mean, left inserted like the toothpick at the side or the tweezers.
Reading the responses to this thread has pretty much changed my attitude towards this, What world are we living in where I feel as though I need to modify an everyday useful item, just to walk down the damn street without getting arrested. I think I'm just going to leave it as it is and then if need be, explain why I'm carrying it. If it then goes too far then so be it.
Again, thanks to everybody for there suggestions and opinions on this subject.
Danny
Dan, it's unusual to see a Wave in Southport.
Oh yes, perhaps I should of got a Leatherman Sand.
Just to ask! What are the chances of being stopped and searched as you go about your business? Maybe if you are acting furtive or aggressively ok. But every day?
Jon R.
Nevertheless, I wouldn't recommend carrying a locking knife in the UK without good reason.
I'd think a non-locking saw was less dangerous than a non locking blade. Both must be used carefully. A better solution would be to buy a slipjoint multi-tool.
Danny- you are quite right- you are quite likely to get turned over by the old bill. As an EDC it is illegal, for use when bushcrafting it's not.
ANY locking blade is illegal- that stretches to anything that has a blade or is sharply pointed. I also have a wave so that rules most of it out!
My advice- get another. Flog it if cash is tight and replace with a non locker. You could carry it as an EDC and rely on the old bill taking a wider and sensible view but would you drive at 10 mph above the limit and hope the old bill saw that you are a safe and sensible driver?
Exemplo Ducemus
I carry my Wave and a slip joint sub 3" almost all of the time.
I have never been in a situation yet when Mr Plod has thought it worth his time searching me.
I look like a middle class blimp not a thug (well not always) live in a very rural area and act in an acceptible manner in our local towns.
The only times I have interacted with the Police in the last couple of decades is when I have phoned them to report road hazzards (floods etc).
Seeing a police officer around here is rare, seeing them out of their cars is rarer.
I think it so unlikely that one of them stops me for a search that I will risk carrying my favourite tool around with me. I am sure I will find a reason to have it on me if I ever do get stopped!
The law propperly applied is not bad, but mis applied it is stupid!
And if you think laws will only be applied in the way they were written to be then just remember that Anti-terrprist laws were used to freeze Icelands assets in UK banks!
Love makes the World go round......Lust makes it all go pear-shaped...
Chance of being searched are higher than most think.
Now we have random searches in train stations and the likes there's a very real risk of a completely sane and safe person carrying a locking blade being patted down and prosecuted.
Also if a crime happens NEAR you and the police get a report that someone matching your description is up to mischief, you can be stopped.
If you've got long hair, dark skin or any number of things that can get one of the legion of bad cops (the good ones aren't a problem) to single you out you're also far more likely to be stopped.
I disagree that the law isn't bad...
...I think it's blimmin terrible.
Most stabbings happen with screwdrivers and kitchen knives, and no law has ever managed to disarm the kind of scumbag who carries a knife with the intent of attacking someone.
Meanwhile, ordinary folk like us, like mums, dads and grandparents who pose no threat to anyone have to take the knife off our belt when we leave the woods, have to think about what tool to carry "just in case" we are searched and it serves absolutely NO purpose in terms of making society safer.
It's bleedin' MAD!
I hope things will change one day, but it won't likely be one day soon.
When (if?) the law allows, I'll be carrying a locking blade as EDC as they are far safer - until then I'm not running the risk.
Pity.
Now heres a reason for making large flint blades. You can the call them an artifact or a pendant
Jon R.
trail2, that just won't work these days here. If it's small enough to wear as a pendant the law allows a sub 3" blade in any case, but over that and the law states it cannot be carried "just in case" you need it. It extends to any, yes ANY item that is bladed or sharply pointed and extends to axes, saws etc. Shops can be prosecuted for selling things like bow saws to under 16 year olds. A 4 or 5" flint blade is more likely to get you into trouble as an offensive weapon as it "made, used or adapted" for that purpose.
Here we can have blanket authorisations in law made by a relatively low ranking police officer (Inspector/lieutenant) that will designate an area were police WILL stop and search anyone within it. It's just not worth the risk IMO.
Exemplo Ducemus
widu - unless that flint blade folded into a handle without a locking device to keep it open, it would be considered a fixed blade anyway!
Good point about the designated areas (thanks to the terrorism act and, if I recall correctly, the criminal justice act and possibly even prevention of crime but i'm less sure about the last one) - I hadn't really thought of it in those terms, not that they disagree with what I said.
But in essence, if you walk into one of those areas you're going to be searched no matter how well-to-do you might appear. That's another reason I keep within the sub 3" non-locking folder thing. I'm just not prepared to run the risk - as annoying as it is that I have to check my bag and pockets for any locking or fixed blades every time I leave the house for non-bushcraft purposes just in case I've forgotten sonething is in there and I get searched - I don't want some numpty legal type giving me trouble for something completely innocent and reasonable.
In one word: DON'T!
Klenchblaize
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