NI Patrol Pack

[Urban]

As I now have three of these I would like to swap one.

It is a brand new DPM Webtext NI Patrol Pack 30-50ltrs, very comfortable and an exact copy of the issue one. Brand new condition and I would like to swap it for something useful/interesting....

[rapidboy]

Trade value ???

[woodstock]

Trade value ???

same question

[tomtom]

Urban, please include a trade value in your offer.

http://www.bushcraftuk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9471

TT.

[C_Claycomb]

WARNING:
Before anyone takes up this offer, check these threads.
http://www.bushcraftuk.com/forum/sho...56426&posted=1

http://www.britishblades.com/forums/...ad.php?t=47966

[fast but dim]

looks like the guy who ripped me off a while ago.

do not bother.

[Aaron]

Given their previous 'dealings' this member would appear to be stealing from people. Why have they not been banned?

[Humpback]

Go easy,
he/she is recuperating from that plane crash in Russia.



I'll get my coat.

[andy_e]

I've ben thinking about this thread for a couple of days, dishonesty really p*sses me off. While I'm sure the vast majority of swaps are genuine and successful, I thought perhaps it might be worth suggesting an additional set of safeguards for these kind of transactions:

If a user has less than say 50 - 100 posts then :

1) they should either wait until they have contributed more to the group, or get someone who is more "senior" to vouch for their veracity.

2) It's possible that they just don't contribute, I'm sure there are a huge number of lurkers. Therefore, in the case that they do not know anyone else they should be prepared to post out first.

On eBay, for example, we judge a user by their feedback the higher the positive number the more secure we feel. With no disrespect to anyone, I would feel more secure swapping an item with say tomtom above, who has almost 4000 posts here than someone with fewer, especially someone with 5 posts.

[rapidboy]

Go easy,
he/she is recuperating from that plane crash in Russia.



I'll get my coat.

[rapidboy]

Having had a few bad deals on here over the last year i have become very reluctant to deal with new members.
That said everyone is a new member at some time and it's up to the buyer to do as much as you can before entering into a transaction to satisfy yourself that the individual is genuine.
Asking for eBay or other forum references is one way to check credit history or ask for full contact details and use them to further the deal to ensure they are who they say they are.
At the end of the day even deals with trusted and respected members of the community can go bad so you enter into any deals at your own risk.

[andy_e]

At the end of the day even deals with trusted and respected members of the community can go bad so you enter into any deals at your own risk.

You make a good point there rapidboy, though it's possibly easier to find out why it's gone bad if the person is well-known within this community.

[Ahjno]

I've ben thinking about this thread for a couple of days, dishonesty really p*sses me off. While I'm sure the vast majority of swaps are genuine and successful, I thought perhaps it might be worth suggesting an additional set of safeguards for these kind of transactions:

If a user has less than say 50 - 100 posts then :

1) they should either wait until they have contributed more to the group, or get someone who is more "senior" to vouch for their veracity.

2) It's possible that they just don't contribute, I'm sure there are a huge number of lurkers. Therefore, in the case that they do not know anyone else they should be prepared to post out first.

On eBay, for example, we judge a user by their feedback the higher the positive number the more secure we feel. With no disrespect to anyone, I would feel more secure swapping an item with say tomtom above, who has almost 4000 posts here than someone with fewer, especially someone with 5 posts.

That's some food for thought.

First of all it's a shame the BCUK Swapsection is misused and abused,

Uti, non abuti - To use, not abuse

and as far I'm concerned a ban is in it's place here. Though that decission is up to Them With The Power.

Second there's a reason to be cautious for every member, eventhough it's here on BCUK, where 99% of it's (active) members are fantastic, and IMHO an example of how the world should be like. This (BCUK) is still the internet and you can't see the person on the other end of the wire ... I have to repeat Rapidboy's comment being it [using the BCUK Swap facility is] on your own risk.

A mon avis (that's french ), using a minimal amount of posts would not be very effective, as there are people who only post to add up their postcount (for instance: using the same welcome text in the Introductionsection repetitively) - hence, you're not informed well enough to make a judgement on one's credibillity.

I would suggest, if Admin has thoughts to adjust the rules and would go along with the idea of a minimal amount of posts, to:
1. Put the minimal amount on (for say) 300, and (cumulative)
2. Being a member for a minimal period of (for say) 9 months.

This way you:
- prevent a quick and deliberate adding up of post count by making simple easy posts just to gain the right to swap
- due to a longer time of being a member, people 'will get to know you' (ieg if you're thrustworthy enough) (...) which could make it easier for one to make a decission to agree on an offer to swap.

I would think such a system is fair, although it's no guarentee by far that all swaps by then will run smooth ...
On participating in the Members Classifieds there's the rule of being a Full Member, why not adding some more strict regulation on the Swap section aswell? Though this for all BCUK members (who fullfill all above - or other, made by Admin - criteria).

Another idea, though more labour intensive for Admin, is either:
1. Admin and the mods decide if you are allowed to swap, no matter what amount of posts you've got or the amount of time you're a (normal) member;
Downside of this only most active members (those you can name by heart if I wake you up in the middle of the night) are allowed to swap, just because their active and participate.
or
2. Block all members and only gain acces after contact (formal request and by leaving all contact details) with a mod / Admin.
or
3. It's also possible to use the method as descripted as above under 2 and using minimal posts & membership period, though that would a bit to steep I reckon ...

My 2 € cents

[Chopper]

Having had a few bad deals on here over the last year i have become very reluctant to deal with new members.
That said everyone is a new member at some time and it's up to the buyer to do as much as you can before entering into a transaction to satisfy yourself that the individual is genuine.
Asking for eBay or other forum references is one way to check credit history or ask for full contact details and use them to further the deal to ensure they are who they say they are.
At the end of the day even deals with trusted and respected members of the community can go bad so you enter into any deals at your own risk.

Well Said

[rapidboy]

The British Blades rep system is also worth consideration, i don't know why more forums dost use a system like that.
You can see instantly a members trading/buying/selling history.

[Chopper]

The British Blades rep system is also worth consideration, i don't know why more forums dost use a system like that.
You can see instantly a members trading/buying/selling history.

Now that would be a great idea.

[spamel]

Why hasn't this Urban characters' account been nuked yet?

[C_Claycomb]

His account hasn't been nuked mainly because no one has been able to be bothered yet. He didn't post much in the first place, and is unlikely to do so now anyway. Anyway, wishes granted.

I am not sure how the trading rep system works differently from the regular rep system. When we had a rep system here, various members, some no longer with us and some of their mates that remained, merrily went around boosting each other's rep for the hell of it and negative reping people they didn't see eye to eye with. It caused a fair bit of bad feeling and more hassle than it was felt that it was worth.

It is all food for though, but I don't expect that any changes will be brought till the new year.

[h2o]

why not have a thread where members can recommend other members trust worthyness .

[Dougster]

Just look at the threads they have added to in swaps/sales and do a little legwork.

I am in a trade with a noob, this hasn't made me question it. If I lose I lose, but I'm not going to think they all go that way.

I've just traded my car in as it's had a new clutch, gearbox, engine management system, engine and turbo. I have to force from my mind the possibility of the same happening on the new one because it's unlikely.

Once bitten is fair enough, but this has hardly ever happened here or on BB. Lets not ruin the good thing all but a small handful have developed. Too much good has been traded.

[spamel]

Nice to see that the douche bag won't be able to rip any one off any more here. Stay alert though people, the next newbie could be him signing back up as another user.

[rapidboy]

I think if your banned properly it's your IP addy that gets banned so it's not just a matter of signing up again.

[spamel]

I'd like to think so, but it does happen that people drop back in and it gets missed. Let's just say that people need to be a bit more cautious (sp?) as it seems people have found us in our nice little hidey hole and are willing to take advantage.

[Dougster]

it seems people have found us in our nice little hidey hole and are willing to take advantage.

Hope not.

Oh well, peace and goodwill to all men. For a bit anyway.

[Damascus]

I think the vast majority out there are honest and dare say proud of what they produce and sell, to to stop a person selling by the amount of posts he has sent is rather near sighted.

I have been a member for sometime and only sent about 80 posts, why I've not always had anything to say and I am sure on this point I am not alone.

If rules are to be made lets think hard and don't do a govement special and have some knee jerk law passed for ever to be regretted because it wasn't thought through properly.

Thus ended my two pennies worth

[Dougster]

Hear hear. I think the system works fine. On the few occasions it seem to have happened it's been very clear.

RB got taken for a ride once and pm'd me when I was about to enter a deal with the same guy to explain what had happened.

Can we just look out for each other? Leave it as it is please.

If I'm going on a rant: I don't believe anyone should be looking for BCUK to 'look after' us. If we press this website and it's host to become a more protected circle, it becomes a tighter circle and less open to new people joining it. Why shouldn't someone new be able to join in and get stuck in? BCUK has the right approach in allowing us a portal to do things. Just cos we can't do it properly 100% of the time doesn't mean they should change it.

We could just realise that life carries risks and understand that try as they might, things my not always smell of roses.

I think it's time we all gathered a little responsibility and looked at all the posts in trade threads raving about the goods and traders on here. Move your eyes away from one man, who may very well get run over by karma on boxing day.

[John Fenna]

I vote for personal responsibility!
If I enter a totaly unsecured transaction it is my choice and my responsibility if things go t*ts up on me.
I did have one swap that seemed to go bad with me sending off my goods to a site member and nothing arriving. The fellow who was sending me the goods claimed that they had been sent and I put it down to the good old PO stuffing us all again.
Next thing I know REPLACEMENT goods come through the door.
The other guy had taken the responsibility to make sure that the swap went well, despite the PO, and was happier to be out of pocket than seem to be a bad swapster.
Full marks to him - and I would hope that other swappsters would take this line.
If a swap does go bad on you (and how rare is that) I hope people would shrug it off and take the responsibility to then warn others, so the ratfink does not have the oportunity to repeat the rippoff!
If the culprit can be found and the errors of their ways pointed out to them in a calm, loving and peacable way then some much the better.



Especially if you have learned how to be calm, loving and peacable when taking personal responsibility for kicking seven shades of manure out of a piece of thieving slime!

[andy_e]

Especially if you have learned how to be calm, loving and peacable when taking personal responsibility for kicking seven shades of manure out of a piece of thieving slime!

Hahahahaha! As opposed to merely being emotionally detached?