Small Portable Firebox/Stove

**Beech Nut** · 15-12-2006, 12:23

Folks

I have been working with some friends of mine to develop a small flat pack firebox/stove. We are just about there, in fact a prototype was taken to the December Bush moot by andyn and some of you may have seen it. A couple of suggestions on improvements were made and we have now put these on the latest model. Below are some pics of the item before the updates. basically the latest version is slightly wider to accommodate a 12cm billy can and has more air holes along the sides to allow larger pieces of wood to burn easier.

They are all Stainless steel and VERY well made. You can choose to have the top plate on, with or without a chimney, or remove the plate and attach the rack (great for toast). This is just to suss out who would be interested in one of these, as I think they would make a very useful item in your kit. I am making no profit on these and if I can get 20 of you together can get them at £40+postage each.

Feel free to ask questions.

Jon

**TheGreenMan** · 15-12-2006, 12:36

Hello Beech Nut,

A very nice design. How much do these weigh? I'm very interested if they're not too heavy, Jon.

Thanks.

Best regards,
Paul.

**Justin Time** · 15-12-2006, 12:46

count me in please

**Hiker** · 15-12-2006, 13:37

They look great mate , i also would be interested to know how much they weigh

**Beech Nut** · 15-12-2006, 13:47

Folks

Just put one on the scales. They are 1.7kg all in.

jon

**scoops_uk** · 15-12-2006, 13:50

Do I get commission?

http://www.bushcraftuk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=14511

http://www.bushcraftuk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=15468

That's identical (bar a detail or two) to my posted design back in August. What did you do tweak my CAD file and send it to a cutting firm.

Not at all impressed.

Scoops

**Moff8** · 15-12-2006, 13:54

I would be interested.

**andyn** · 15-12-2006, 14:03

As stated, I had the chance to have a play with this at the winter moot, and after a minute or two remembering which bit went where and adding some wood I had a nice hot stove at hand. the chimney works really well and once fitted and heated up a bit starts pulling in lots of air to get some serious heat in the stove. Those around thought that an extra couple of air holes could have been benifical and this was one of the suggestions that went back (and acted upon from what i understand).

I then popped my 12cm billy on top and came to the quick conclusion...well 15 mins later, that because the billy was a fraction wider than the stove it sat up on the edges and didnt make contact with the top plate. so the temperature of the water stayed relatively low. Jon Pickett lent me his 10cm billy which fitted fine and as soon as the water was poured in, it started hissing and was soon to the boil. This was the second observation, as the 10cm billy isn't that versile so we suggested that the stove was widened to accomodate a 12cm billy (again a change i believe has now been made).

Overall it was excellent quality of construction and with the cnages that have now been made i think this is a very versitile and long lasting stove.

My only other bit of critism is on its weight,I would guestimate that they weighed about 2kg, but its a weigh off (no pun intended) with quality of materials, and its one that i'd be happy to live with.

P.S not envolved with the company, just asked if i'd like to try it out.

**loz.** · 15-12-2006, 14:28

Originally Posted by scoops_uk

Do I get commission?

http://www.bushcraftuk.com/community...ad.php?t=14511

http://www.bushcraftuk.com/community...ad.php?t=15468

That's identical (bar a detail or two) to my posted design back in August. What did you do tweak my CAD file and send it to a cutting firm.

Not at all impressed.

Scoops

Ah now,

to be honest you didn't alter things much from

Little Dandy Stove

**andyn** · 15-12-2006, 14:41

Originally Posted by scoops_uk

Do I get commission?

http://www.bushcraftuk.com/community...ad.php?t=14511

http://www.bushcraftuk.com/community...ad.php?t=15468

That's identical (bar a detail or two) to my posted design back in August. What did you do tweak my CAD file and send it to a cutting firm.

Not at all impressed.

Scoops

LOL...of course mate, you can have as much as Beech nut is getting...none.

Don't fret so much matey. From what I can see this isn't about a designer making money its about making a good design of woodstove available to the members of BCUK who havent the time/tools/materials to make there own. As Loz says, the basic design is available freely elsewhere.

**scoops_uk** · 15-12-2006, 14:41

Which is why I made my design freely available to everyone, as Nimblewill did, and credited my inspiration by calling my stove "The Modified Nimblewill" and referring to the original in my posts.

As against:

"I have been working with some friends of mine to develop a small flat pack firebox/stove."

Which gives no credit to anyone other than themselves.

Scoops

**scoops_uk** · 15-12-2006, 14:57

[QUOTE=andyn]LOL...of course mate, you can have as much as Beech nut is getting...none.

[QUOTE]

I'm quite happy with none, as I said to Loz I was the first to admit when I was basing my stuff on someone else's ideas. I did everything I could to make my design freely available to anyone who wanted a go. I even made the CAD file available for people to modify.

I'm also entirely happy for someone to sell the stoves here for non-profit.

But, I think claiming something as your own when it's obviously based on Nimblewill's original or on my own alterations is a poor show.

Do I feel like sharing my future progress? Is it in the interests of sustaining this great online community?

Make up your own mind.

Scoops

P.S. I've said my piece now, unless I'm asked a direct question I won't be saying any more.

**bothyman** · 15-12-2006, 15:29

Don't forget this one

>> http://www.canoepaddler.me.uk/fireboxes.htm

MickT

**Marts** · 15-12-2006, 15:34

Was chatting to Andy about this at the moot. Glad to hear the modifications have been made.

Count me in.

**Buckshot** · 15-12-2006, 16:20

I could be interested in this as well

**Bushwacker** · 15-12-2006, 16:31

very similar to the nomad firebox I got from C,Randall @ SOTP. and they work very nicely thank you. Make a small spacer for a trangier to sit on and it`s even more versatile.

**Bisamratte** · 15-12-2006, 16:32

I think I'm interested too

**scoops_uk** · 15-12-2006, 16:45

Non commercial?

http://www.woodlandedge.co.uk/

**Beech Nut** · 15-12-2006, 17:00

Scoops

I have Pm'd you ref your concerns on design. Woodlandedge are the people who make the stove and I am not part of the company. They basically said if I can get 20 people to gether they will sell the stove for £40.00 I am not part of woodlandedge and getting no money out of this. It is in my opinion no different to any other group buy set up on this forum.

Regards

jon

**Beech Nut** · 15-12-2006, 17:31

I think I had better post ref the design. My original post was hastly put together and as such I did not spend a lot of time on the subject of design. When the idea of creating a Stove was put to me, a lot of different stoves were looked at. This included Scoops stove. Over a period of 3 months various designs were created and the best bits of each incorporated in this final version. I am more than happy to acknowledge that scoops design was one of the best we looked at and his version of this stove inspired the method of attaching the plates together, although adjustments were made to improve this even further.
I would like to apologies to scoops and any other person who can see aspects of their design in this stove, it was not my intention to miss this out, but my lack of time spent on the original post making sure I covered this subject.

This designed is significantly different from any other stove and as such the creators of this version are perfectly within their rights to produce this stove on a commercial basis.
Good design is good design (eg. woodlore knife) and if it works people will create their own version of it. I do however regret not mentioning Scoops design on my original post especially as he is a valued member of this community.

My humble apologies scoops.

Regards

Jon

**scoops_uk** · 15-12-2006, 17:47

Jon,

I was sending this in response to your PM, I hope you don't mind my posting it here instead...

Thank you for your comments, and first off I am pleased that we can have a reasonable discussion.

I am delighted that you liked my stove design and I am entirely happy for the stove to be made by others on a not for profit basis.

However, the stoves are clearly now being *marketed* on the Woodland Edge website as a commercial product.

Being "significantly different" is a matter of opinion and the UK Patent Office suggests that a design should "have individual character" and not "remind an informed person of an existing design". I do not believe that the woodland edge stove is sufficiently different to meet these criteria.

I have a clearly established and published prior claim to the intellectual property of this design. As does Mimblewill Nomad, who I duly credited, before me. You have conceded that you passed my design to Woodland Edge as a basis for their design. This should not have been done without my permission and without them being fully aware of the origins.

I believe their marketing of the product to be an infringement of my own (as we are in the UK and Nimblewill Nomad is not) design right, which provides an automatic 5 year protection and does not require registration.

However, bearing in mind the spirit of my original posting of my design on the forum I am happy to accept your apology.

This does still leave the problem of Woodland Edge and it is my intention to pursue the matter further as I now know this to be a commercial exercise on their part.

Regards,

Scoops_uk

**Beech Nut** · 15-12-2006, 18:04

Scoops

i am getting the stove pulled from the site. last thing we want is a battle of design rights.
PM me your email address and I will get them to contact you if your happy.

Jon

**andyn** · 15-12-2006, 18:11

Scoops, is not really any of my interest execpt i'd quiet like one of these stoves so would like to see the matter resolved. But can you link to which part of the UK patent office indicates what you are saying, as as far as i am aware a product design does not come under UK copyright laws but you would need a design patent. Just my two pence worth.

Like i said, im not trying to stir the issue but if anything would like to know how all budding designers can save themselves £60 by not filling for a patent.

**scoops_uk** · 15-12-2006, 18:30

Hi Andy,

The Patent office link is here.

Without predjudice to any discussions I might have with Woodland Edge, I am primarily interested in some credit being given where credit is due, not cashing in.

As such, I see no reason why this matter can't be resolved quickly and amicably.

Jon, I will PM you my email address. Assuming Woodland Edge, like yourself, are reasonable sorts, don't worry about pulling the stove just yet. I imagine we would all like to avoid any uneccessary dispute.

Regards,

Scoops

**fred gordon** · 15-12-2006, 19:41

I would be interested. Just what I've been looking for to replace the one I have, especially now that it takes the 12cm billy.

**mayfly** · 15-12-2006, 20:02

I'd very much like one of these if this goes ahead.
Chris

**Beech Nut** · 15-12-2006, 20:06

Folks

Keep registering your interest. Issues between Woodland Edge and Scoops will be resolved soon.

Jon

**Graham_S** · 15-12-2006, 20:21

i'd like one too if this goes ahead.

**Gibbsy** · 15-12-2006, 20:52

I would like to register my interest please...

**Neanderthal** · 15-12-2006, 20:59

I was inspired by scoops excellent stove and detailed instructions so had a go at creating something similar.
However lacking any materials, tools or particular skills I offer this as an alternative perspective.

It is 'constructed' from tin cans from the recycle bin, cut with tin snips and hammered flat with a brick. I also drilled a few holes in it.

Seems to work OK though.

"It's not what you know, it's what you can make out of junk."

Stu

Thread: Small Portable Firebox/Stove

Thread Tools

Display

Small Portable Firebox/Stove

Firebox

Posting Permissions