Badger Violence

**Shewie** · 10-01-2006, 15:45

A bit of a dodgy subject but something which I feel I should air to you all so I can gauge my reaction and get some advice at the same time.

A number of friends of mine who are generally decent folk have taken it upon themselves to destroy native creatures in the woodlands near to my home. I myself have joined them in the past for vermin control within a farm environment mainly focussing on rabbitts and rats - sometimes woodpigeon.
But recently they have gone after a particularly large badger set containing around 12 - 15 holes many of which appear to be active. They are arming themselves with items such as lead pipe, golf clubs and baseball bats - which personally I find outrageous and sick in the head. Obviously I have declined their offers to join them on their evening jaunts and as far as I`m aware they haven`t yet caught one the unfortunate little guys.
I`ve heard them discussing such things as "atomising" which I believe is the act of filling the badger holes with flammable gases and then lighting them and clubbing to death anything that appears from the holes.
I personally find this all a bit sick and wondered if anybody could shed some light on the laws regarding this kind of thing.
Any advice on talking to these people with a look to getting it stopped would be useful.

**xairbourne** · 10-01-2006, 15:54

Protection of Badgers Act 1992

http://www.opsi.gov.uk/ACTS/acts1992...20051_en_1.htm

check out the link (dont mess with the badgers)

**led** · 10-01-2006, 15:54

It's a difficult one, because it sounds unlikely that you are going to have a reasoned conversation with them. What about talking to your local badger group (eg http://www.sybadgergroup.f9.co.uk/) and tell them your concerns. They might sort things out.

**fa11en ange1** · 10-01-2006, 15:57

Take a look at THIS.

Depending how close you are to these friends I would consider one of two actions. First if they are good friends I would express your concerns and draw their attention to the law. However if this likely to result in any form of reprisal or if they are merely acquaintances rather than friends it may be better to report them anonamously to both the Police and RSPCA.

**Topcat02** · 10-01-2006, 15:59

Disgusting. Badgers have a tough enough life at the best of times.

If they are planning on using clubs, pipes, etc on the badgers, how exactly were you exterminating rabbits, rats, and pigeons. I assume this was done in a humane manner?

**torjusg** · 10-01-2006, 16:05

If they don't listen, report it to the police. Early cruelty to animals is considered one of the main signs of psycopathy. Cruelty is addictive and in time it may grow into a seriously perverse habit.

I know the problem with badger cruelty. Some former freinds of mine cornered (while drunk) a badger, stabbed it with a bowie knife and killed it by jumping on it's head. Disgusting and disrespectful!

Torjus Gaaren

**scanker** · 10-01-2006, 16:08

If you think they're in the wrong (which I think you do from what you've said) and they're your friends, then you should be able to tell them your thoughts.

If that's not the case, then maybe you should change your friends? I don't want to be offensive, but my friends wouldn't do such a thing. If they did, they'd no longer be my friends, simple as that.

I'd try to dissuade them from such action, pointing out the laws that have been mentioned which are in place to protect the badgers. If it was me, I'd be thinking of contacting the wildlife officer at your local police station, or the RSPCA.

**outdoorcode** · 10-01-2006, 16:23

Report them to the police & Rspca, and change friends would be my advice

**weekend_warrior** · 10-01-2006, 16:24

Originally Posted by outdoorcode

Report them to the police & Rspca, and change my friends would be my advice

Couldn't agree more! Do what you know is right....

**Lurch** · 10-01-2006, 16:32

Originally Posted by outdoorcode

Report them to the police & Rspca, and change friends would be my advice

Yup. Without question.
I'm not sold on the Badger Protection thing but the methods suggested here are disgusting. No true sportsman would even consider doing these things.

**Shewie** · 10-01-2006, 16:35

Topcat

As far as culling the rabbits and rats - we used air rifles for the rabbitts and a fast poison for the rats. All above board and there was no element of cruelty involved.

I think I shall have to have words as most of you are as shocked as myself. I`ve grown up all my life with these people and the last thing I want is to see them locked up - it`s sad to see them go down this route though all the same and it should be stopped. A quiet word at first followed by a conversation with the RSPCA I think.

Thanks for your comments.

**Hellz** · 10-01-2006, 16:36

Originally Posted by outdoorcode

Report them to the police & Rspca, and change friends would be my advice

Absolutely!

There is no way my conscience would allow me not to take action.

Hellz

**Wolfie** · 10-01-2006, 16:36

If you are worried about your "mates" finding out you reported them call Crimestoppers on 0800 555111 to report the offence, then you don't have to give your personal details.

Personally I'd have no worries about reporting them to the Police. These are not people you want to call your friends.

**jdlenton** · 10-01-2006, 16:37

I wouldn't even enter into conversation with these disgusting individuals. Try and find out when and where they will be attempting there hideous pass time and make sure the get caught red handed.

James

**weekend_warrior** · 10-01-2006, 16:43

....and God help them if the badger gets one in first, they can do some serious damage. We had something similar happen not far from me - Police and RSPCA took a very dim view, two of 'em got locked up

**familne** · 10-01-2006, 16:51

Originally Posted by Shewie

A bit of a dodgy subject but something which I feel I should air to you all so I can gauge my reaction and get some advice at the same time.

A number of friends of mine who are generally decent folk have taken it upon themselves to destroy native creatures in the woodlands near to my home. I myself have joined them in the past for vermin control within a farm environment mainly focussing on rabbitts and rats - sometimes woodpigeon.
But recently they have gone after a particularly large badger set containing around 12 - 15 holes many of which appear to be active. They are arming themselves with items such as lead pipe, golf clubs and baseball bats - which personally I find outrageous and sick in the head. Obviously I have declined their offers to join them on their evening jaunts and as far as I`m aware they haven`t yet caught one the unfortunate little guys.
I`ve heard them discussing such things as "atomising" which I believe is the act of filling the badger holes with flammable gases and then lighting them and clubbing to death anything that appears from the holes.
I personally find this all a bit sick and wondered if anybody could shed some light on the laws regarding this kind of thing.
Any advice on talking to these people with a look to getting it stopped would be useful.

This is absolutely despicable. Badgers are fully protected under law as others have pointed out. It is a serious offence to harm them or their sett in any way without a licence. Report them IMMEDIATELY to the police, rspca, local badger group etc. do it anonymously if you have to but do it now! Let them know when and where they plan to carry out the next attack so they can be caught in the act.

This really makes my blood boil, I would give mindless idiots like this a taste of their own medicine if it were legal

**daveymonkey** · 10-01-2006, 17:01

What a world to live in when people do this, its makes me sick, we should all chip in so they can go polar bear hunting with a pen knife.

**weekend_warrior** · 10-01-2006, 17:03

What????

..and waste a penknife!

**RovingArcher** · 10-01-2006, 17:09

Sorry to say this, but it sounds to me like they are out for the bloodlust and if it were me in your place, they would be turned in to the authorities. Because any man that will club an animal for fun, will abuse a child or woman in anger.

**Jamie** · 10-01-2006, 17:18

Originally Posted by Lurch

No true sportsman would even consider doing these things.

I would suggest that no true humane person would consider doing that sort of thing - it really is totally reprehensible and revolting behavious. And we consider our society civilised?

some police do have a countryside/environmental crimes section (usually a pc who does it in conjunction with 'normal' policing duties)

**Ogri the trog** · 10-01-2006, 17:44

Originally Posted by weekend_warrior

....and God help them if the badger gets one in first, they can do some serious damage.

Yup, I've read some horrific stories about injured badgers causing great pain to the perpetrators. No-way can I condone this action - get them reported.

Ogri the trog

**JonnyP** · 10-01-2006, 18:23

Just picked up on this.........I know there has been a lot in the news about badgers causing problems to cattle with the TB, but this is know excuse (if that is why they are doing it). Last year I had the pleasure of seeing badgers close up in the wild for the first time in my life, they are amazing and beautiful creatures that should be left well alone. I am in full agreement with the previous threads.
REPORT THEM to the authorities. Maybe you can do it so your so called friends don't know its you who is reporting them. Good on you for listing it here so others can comment, but please go further and let others know who will do something about it. Good luck................Jon

**C_Claycomb** · 10-01-2006, 18:53

If you try to warn these people that what they are doing is wrong, could get them in a lot of trouble, and that you don't approve, then if they are caught at it they will probably suspect you said something.

I think you will probably lose them as friends anyway. If you say nothing and they carry on, will you really want to be around them anymore?

How old are they? Its still sick, but teenagers can do some pretty stupid things because they haven't thought them through.

**demographic** · 10-01-2006, 19:08

For me theres no grey in this issue at all.
What they are planning to do is just wrong and thats it.

Don't get me wrong as I have gone lamping for rabbits and hares so I am not a tree hugging, tofu scoffing vegan but theres NO excuse for battering badgers.

Also the research into TB infection showed that the badger culls actually increased the problem as the surviving badgers simply moved into another area and spread infection further.

**martin** · 10-01-2006, 20:24

Take the lead pipe off them and give them a thick ear with it. And that is the polite reply.

**Wayne** · 10-01-2006, 21:01

Your in a difficult situation. These people have been your friends for years and you have conflicting emotions. You no its wrong otherwise you would not have opened this thread. It is hard to drop your friends in the mire but they have judged themselves by their actions.

You do have to be discreet though and inform the police and RSPCA quietly. people willing to smash badgers with lead pipes and golf clubs are likely to take it personally if they feel you grassed them up.

Please do the right thing i have been a sett monitor for my local badger group for years and they a wonderful creatures. No animal dseserves such a painful death.

**Razorstrop** · 10-01-2006, 21:02

They need reporting and God forbid if I ever come across someone doing that when I am out and about.

Either way it needs stopping now.

Mr Strop

**Goose** · 10-01-2006, 21:34

I have done and do some strange things (to some) including shooting, which some people would find as wrong as everyone finds the idea of what these people want to do, this a seperate issue.
Getting kicks from just killing in the most bloodthirsty way possible is totally wrong, by anyones standards.
Do these friends play gory computer games? What will they move on to, killing their granny for a few quid, trying to kill their whole family so they can be adopted by a rich family? These are two stories out of todays newspaper, I bet the teenagers that committed those crimes will have started out hurting/killing animals for fun.
I agree with the majority of posts(all?), if you can't talk them out of it you don't want them as friends, and even if you don't take part but stay and listen to them planning and bragging about it later, without reporting it, you will be accepting their behaviour, so encouraging it to possibly move up a gear.

**spoony** · 10-01-2006, 21:43

report to rspa and police, enough said, cant believe you havent already done so, this kind of behaviour doesnt even warrent a thread, and you shouldnt even need us to tell you what to do for gods sake,

**monkey_pork** · 10-01-2006, 22:09

Originally Posted by demographic

For me theres no grey in this issue at all.
What they are planning to do is just wrong and thats it.

Don't get me wrong as I have gone lamping for rabbits and hares so I am not a tree hugging, tofu scoffing vegan but theres NO excuse for battering badgers.

Also the research into TB infection showed that the badger culls actually increased the problem as the surviving badgers simply moved into another area and spread infection further.

Actually ... I am a tofu scoffing, vegan tree hugger, but I'd have absolutely no hesitation in the application of summary justice if I encountered such activity. My lifestyle may be one of compassion, but it doesn't extend to these people. Like everyone else here, it would be unconscionable to do anything other than to report them and let the law run it's course.

I recall Ben Bradshaw MP saying this about the TB related trial culls during last summer. I seem to recall that the Radio 4 'Today' program carried the interview. The cull simply opened up areas, which were then quickly filled by wandering badgers, and didn't actually solve the TB problem ...

Good luck in resolving this.

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