View Full Version : What's in your medi kit?
I am off for a 60 mile or so walk with friends tomorrow and have been packing and repacking all night (much funzo)
I rarely need to open up my medi kit, other than the odd plaster here and there or some painkillers from too much whisky. Occasionaly the odd blister plaster. However it is small and compact and packed full of everything I need.
So opening it up I have:
Drugs/tablets.
6 Tramadols - fairly serious pain killers (opioid)
16 ibuprofen
8 asprin
8 paracetamol
6 valium
6 rennies, or chalk tablets. (my mate gets indigestion!)
10 pack of water purification tablets x 2
6 diclofenac tablets
Packet stuff:
Alcahol free wipes
Open weave bandage
1m of adhesive dressing strip (long plaster)
Mouth to mouth shield for resuscitation (I think I could lose this as in the UK I am really not ("bovvered")
Non adherent dressing (gauze)
Medical gloves (could ditch these too)
Astroplast tape.
Blister plasters
Hardware:
Mini scissors
Needle n thread.
That's it - although I am being given a large blood clotting/stopping gauze from a friend which seems to be for major trauma. Not sure I really need it and it is rather large but it can go in my (useful box) for a while at least!
Anything you would add or what is your own list?
I carry little, maybe too little.
6 Nurofen
Bandage
Tick Twisters
Alcohol wipes
Povidone iodine spray
4 assorted fabric plasters
1 small dressing pad
Tweezers
Water purifying tablets
Diorrhea tablets
Gaffer tape
Animal wool
Hmmmmm the iodine spray sounds like a good addition, I have no germ killing stuff like that so it is on the list now. Ticks, I twist em myself! I seem to remain fairly tick free though, maybe my blood type. Had one ever only compared to my mate who gets a half dozen on every walk we do, taken plenty off my cats n dogs though!. Tweezers would fit in to my kit nicely also :-)
Diorrhea tabs? Mine generally goes after 24 hours, not sure how useful these would be unless they stop it there and then! Unlikely as your stomach has turned to **** anyway at the point you get it! (lovely topic I know, it is rare thank goodness)
Totumpole
29-03-2012, 23:27
My daily bimble ouch pouch has:
LAtex gloves
steri strips
2"x2" gauze (x10)
Antiseptic wipe - x2
AFterbite wipe x1
Stetch bandage x1
various plasters
Safety pins
Co-codamol x4
diclofenac x2
fexofenadine (hardcore antihistamine) x2
Combudoron ointment (for burns)
Zinc Oxide tape
tweezers
Ohhh another person with diclofenac! :-) I think I got mine after a tooth extraction ;-) Good for swelling it seems....
Of all of them, the gaffer tape and Iodine spray get the most use.
I've never had a tick either but when I do, its coming off quick!
I forgot to list the Animal wool-Its the best thing ever for rubbing feet and blisters. I wouldn't be without it on long trips. It comes from Boots/Sheep. :)
Well no shortage of sheep wool here - I'll give that a blast for any future blisters!
OK this is annoying - My post has been moved. Part of my kit is my MEDI KIT - hence the subject. So it belongs to KIT chatter.
Yesterday my post got moved also - The moderators are being waaaay to judgemental over where a post belongs. Can you move it back please as I placed it in the right topic and where I wanted it to be. I can understand if I had made a mistake and you corrected it for me, but now you are simply taking control over other peoples decisions and judgements. You are here to monitor and ensure the forum runs smoothly, and not to DICTATE.
Enough now...
bushwacker bob
30-03-2012, 00:24
Its medical kit your talking about and there is a specific forum for medical kit so where else would be more appropriate? Edged tools or meet-ups perhaps?
What difference does it make?
The appropriate place is where I decide. I posted about KIT, in KIT chatter. When did the nanny state and nazi police infiltrate my existence in posting on a forum in a place I think appropriate?
I was posting about KIT, and the contents of such KIT, in a section named KIT..... I was not doing so for medicinal reasons, but for reasons as for what KIT to carry. It was about KIT. Totally out of line, and not a good running of a forum. Apologies if I seem grumpy about it but I am not happy at all about this....
bushwacker bob
30-03-2012, 00:41
Maybe you should talk about 'kit' then. Medical supplies are referred to as First aid kit or FAKs and are discussed in the appropriate section determined by the guy who owns the site. I dont believe he has right wing tendancies but its his forum so I abide by his rules. Simples.:D
As far as FAKs are concerned, I carry a clean hankie. If medical conditions require more than that call an ambulance.
I carry one of these (http://www.adventuremedicalkits.com/product.php?product=237&catname=Ultralight%20/%20Watertight&prodname=Ultralight%20/%20Watertight%20.5) plus an O'Tom tick remover and some Ibuprofen
I was talking about KIT - As in, I will be doing 60 miles, and I am packing my KIT. Part of that is my medical KIT..
@ Maybe you should talk about 'kit' then.
I'm not sure if you are blind, or stupid. Or just a troll :-/
Either way - your comment of: "I dont (sic) believe he has right wing tendancies but its his forum so I abide by his rules. Simples"
Is one of meek tendencies and a certain amount of "Way to my king".
My topic was right, my choice was right, my opinion is subject, but my subject, and no one elses. The forum keeper was wrong, but his subject and or opinion. Let them reply but feel free to carry on as is your right. ;-)
I had something similar and upgraded over the year. Probably too much now but I wouldn't leave the house without it!
bushwacker bob
30-03-2012, 00:57
When did the nanny state and nazi police infiltrate my exi..
Your choice of words my friend.
Yes, my choice. Unlike my topic choice which got moved. No more choice it seems. Anyway - I have made my point.
I had something similar and upgraded over the year. Probably too much now but I wouldn't leave the house without it!
My FAK grows over time too until I get sick of the bulk and trim it down again. I used to carry too many "what ifs" but not so much now, I figure if it's so bad that I or a hiking partner needs serious attention then I'm certainly not the one to give it, I'd rather contact the professionals and let them deal with it.
bushwacker bob
30-03-2012, 01:07
You carry a lot of prescription only drugs for a 3 day walk.
I can be bit thick but what exactly was your point?
My FAK grows over time too until I get sick of the bulk and trim it down again. I used to carry too many "what ifs" but not so much now, I figure if it's so bad that I or a hiking partner needs serious attention then I'm certainly not the one to give it, I'd rather contact the professionals and let them deal with it.
Well I removed the medical gloves and mouth protector earlier. Hard to part with anything else! Especially as it all fits into one neat bag that goes every where with me. So happy as it is now. I'm sure I may be missing a thing or two though, I think a set of tweezers might be useful and the iodine solution.
You carry a lot of prescription only drugs for a 3 day walk.
I can be bit thick but what exactly was your point?
To be prepared :-) They take up minimal room, are always in one bag, which sits on the side of my pack in a waterproof sack. Sec.... My scales say 67 grams.. I have 2 packs and I transfer it to each other with ease. The 67 grams do not hinder me in any way and are always with me. I would rather have them, than not and they cause no problem by being there.
The point was not the "prescription drugs" but to see what I had compared with others, and to see if I was missing anything important. So far I have learned Iodine could be an excellent addition. As may be a set of tweezers.
Thanks for your valuable input. :@)
In my experience the vast majority of people that use forums press the "New Posts" tab on entering the forum, so it doesn't really matter where the post is placed to most of us users.
It certainly isn't worth getting your knickers in a twist over.
As a mod on a few other forums i can tell you it's a thankless task that is done by people who get no financial gain, if the forum was left to run without moderation for a week then it would be an absolute free-for-all.
We don't do it for money or thanks but i don't think it's too much to ask for a little tolerance by members, it might stand you in good stead in the future to speak directly with the mod involved rather than throw your dummy out the pram.
Out of your 45 posts over the 8 months you've been a member, you've spent 5 either having a go at mods or other members.
You may well be right, but still it's not really a conducive environment for others to jump in and help you inthe future is it?
With regards to the FAK.
I would be extremely careful with the Tramadol even the 50mg tablets have a tendency to make the taker very dizzy and physically sick.
I can't foresee any circumstances where it would be wise to self medicate or medicate others with prescription tablets.
The side effects are likely to cause more problems than the tablets are going to solve.
Only things i have extra in my kit are.
Imodium, diarrhoea is a nightmare when out in the middle of nowhere
Antihistamine, in case there is any reaction to bee stings, pollen etc
Tick Lasso
Recoverice, a wrap in a sealed pack that cools when opened, great for sprained ankles etc
I also pack an Israeli type military bandage as i had a mate fall onto a branch a few years ago and it was difficult to for me to get enough pressure to stop the bleeding with a normal bandage.
Eye wash comes in a tube rather than a eye bath
Duct tape
There is a thread on here talking about the blood clotting powder, general consensus is, it's not a good buy for civvy use, a compression bandage is cheaper, cleaner and better.
Mesquite
30-03-2012, 06:52
My topic was right, my choice was right, my opinion is subject, but my subject, and no one elses. The forum keeper was wrong, but his subject and or opinion. Let them reply but feel free to carry on as is your right. ;-)
Looking at what you posted in your original post it's quite obvious why your post has been moved to the correct section of the forum as it is about MEDICAL kit and this sub-section is about all things medical hence its title Hygiene and First Aid/Medicinal.
End of the day when you own the forum you can post what you like where you like but as you don't then you agreed to abide by the owners rules and moderation of your posts by his representatives as they see fit when you signed up. If you don't like that then the usual response is you're perfectly free to go elsewhere where you're happier but in the meantime abide by the rules and accept the moderation.
Just to finish I feel the level of moderation on this forum is very light and, as far as I've experienced, very even handed which makes for a good family friendly forum.
Graham_S
30-03-2012, 07:36
I include a small mirror and a small head torch (Petzl eLite) in my FAK.
I don't want to be rummaging for a torch and a FAK if I need them, so I keep one in the kit.
The mirror is handy, I once banged my head and split the skin above my brow. Hard to attend to the wound when you can't see it.
sandbender
30-03-2012, 08:18
Hi
You have a lot of pain killers in there.
Some pointers may be found in this article from Paul Kirtley.
A Personal Wilderness First Aid Kit: What to Include? (http://paulkirtley.co.uk/2011/personal-wilderness-first-aid-kit/)
As suggested by Graham, a mirror can be very useful, even just for getting dirt or stray insects out of your eyes. I have an old steel WW2 heliograph which does the job.
Tweezers are a good addition too.
There are 24,000 members here, Tony runs the site for their benefit, it is the case that majority of people tend to post everything to 'Bushcraft Chatter' or 'Kit Chatter'. Which means that threads that some may find useful quickly vanish into the past. A Mod moving a thread to a more appropriate sub forum makes it easier for all of the members to find topics which interest them.
Have a good trip, post some pics. :)
I was talking about KIT - As in, I will be doing 60 miles, and I am packing my KIT. Part of that is my medical KIT..
@ Maybe you should talk about 'kit' then.
I'm not sure if you are blind, or stupid. Or just a troll :-/
Either way - your comment of: "I dont (sic) believe he has right wing tendancies but its his forum so I abide by his rules. Simples"
Is one of meek tendencies and a certain amount of "Way to my king".
My topic was right, my choice was right, my opinion is subject, but my subject, and no one elses. The forum keeper was wrong, but his subject and or opinion. Let them reply but feel free to carry on as is your right. ;-)
You where wrong about your choice to put your topic in. Simples, take it or leave it. If you had taken the effort to read you would have known. You show me a thread solely about a first aid kit in Kit Chatter.
Sideways chatter aside ...
Was this for a tooled outing with fires or are you doing Trailwalker or something?
Jimmy Bojangles
31-03-2012, 07:27
[QUOTE=
As suggested by Graham, a mirror can be very useful, even just for getting dirt or stray insects out of your eyes. I have an old steel WW2 heliograph which does the job.[/QUOTE]
I Must get a mirror, or heliograph as that would be more multi purpose. Last weekend I took the dog for a walk and got I fly in my eye, VERY minor but so damn annoying. Just could not get it out, so had to walk a half hour back to the house with one eye shut, took two sec's to get it out in front of the mirror.
How's that for REAL SURVIVAL? lol
Mat
Jimmy Bojangles
31-03-2012, 07:40
Well I removed the medical gloves.
I actually keep at least one latex glove in my kit after my last dog (Jaz :)) ran over some morons old camp in the woods and almost took one of his pads off on the broken glass (few thing make me more angry than that) The pad was literally hanging on by a thread, and would certainly come off on the walk home, i did try carrying him but that was a no go as he weighed over 30kg and kept trying to french kiss me! Lol I had a glove in my bag as I'd been doing some site work, (hmm, the lady doth protest too much! Lol) anyway, I pulled it tight over his foot, my friend donated one of his spare socks, we tied it up nice and snug and were able to walk him to the vets.
Also I guess you could cut a glove up to use as elastic strips etc.
Cheers
Mat
I have a small FAK in my shoulder bag that I usually carry around, paracetamol, brufen, x2 doses of each, some strips of plaster and SAK tweezers, a couple of small alcowipes to clean the skin.
The larger kit if we are out further has a couple more drugs, piriton and loperamide. More strips of plaster, a saline sachet, some sterile swabs, a thick wound dressing, and a triangular bandage,and a pair of non sterile gloves.
Near the head of loch lomond, we were with a group, when someone fell and broke their arm, 3 of us had triangular bandages as well as 2 shemaghs being offered. One of the group commented, she'd carried "this thing around in her pack for many years" and was oddly pleased to be finally using it...
21st century pict
03-04-2012, 15:38
Just got back from a 3 day walk and bivi out trip to Aviemore before the snow hit.
1x Trauma Dressing.
1x Celox Clotting Granules 35g.
1x 300 Meg Asprin.
1x Resuscitation face shield.
2 Antihistamine tablets.
Tick remover.
On the walk I had to use 8 paracetamal 6 ibuprofen 6 rennies and a whole strip of water purification tabs, all of which had to scrounge off NetFrog.
Cheers Bro.
PS. It's not indigestion its Whisky burn.
John Fenna
03-04-2012, 16:29
Having done CPR twice for real I am a big fan of face shields.
Both occassions I did CPR - on people I knew pretty well - I did not have a face shield on me.
Both times I ended up tasting their vomit - both vomitted prior to collapse - and I can tell you ... it aint nice.
As to the gloves - I keep then in the kit.
Dealing with casualties often means exposing yourself to blood, faeces and urine spillage ... not nice on the hands, especially if you too have open wounds no matter how minor...
I have various FAKs to cover different possible scenarios, from an "ouch pouch" for when I am whittling to a large kit kept in the van....
I tend to add a scalpel blade to my kit, handy for getting out splinters or if you need to cut something out that scissors or your knife are too bulky bladed to get rid.
Native Nathan
03-04-2012, 21:25
OK My Med Kit is a bit well alot more comprehensive than most.
Before I post my List I have to ask Why the Prescription Drugs?
I'm not having a go just curious?
Here is a link to the Thread I posted my Med kit with Pictures on
http://www.bushcraftuk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=79836&highlight=
It is small enough not to be a burden or too heavy or awkward to carry, yet complete enough to to cope with nearly any scenario that could come up.
The Aim of this kit it two fold, firstly to take care of all the little PITA things like a Headache, Toothache, The trots, Small Blisters, little nicks on fingers etc...etc...
And Secondly to control a major Bleed until further, more suitable help arrives, E.G. an Ambulance,
It is not designed to treat a Major bleed and then allow the Casualty to continue to climb Mount Everest, but rather to stop the Casualty from bleeding out while waiting for the ambulance to arrive.
In our field we have to accept an element of self-responsibility regarding our personal First aid.
Many of us venture to place where conventional Ambulances can't get to, or to places when although conventional Ambulances can get to you they take much longer than normal to arrive, as such we need to be prepared and able to help ourselves for any given period should the need arise.
Large Wound Dressing Module:
4x 4”x4” Sterile Gauze Pads
2x 3”x4” Non Stick Pads
1x 5”x9” Abdominal Pad
2x Tegaderm Dressings
4x Pre-cut Moleskin Pads
2x 2”x4” Large Plasters
Small Wound Dressing Module:
5x Small Butterfly Closures
3x Large Butterfly Closures
3x 3”x¼” 3M Steri-Strips
2x Fingertip Plasters
2x Knuckle Plasters
4x Finger Plasters
2x Large Finger Plasters
3x Kids Finger Plasters
2x Triple Antibiotic Cream Sachets
2x Compeed Blister Patches
Equipment Module:
4x Safety Pins
2x Splint Out
1x Razor knife
1x Precision Tweezers
1x Mini Bandage Scissors
1x Pencil
2x Benzoin Tincture Ampoules
1x Liquid Skin Instant Glue
1x CPR Face Mask
Irrigation Module:
6x Alcohol Prep Pads
2x Betadine Pre Pads
4x Anti-Septic Hand Wipes
1x 20cc Syringe
1x ZeroWet Irrigation Shield
3x Pairs Black Nitrile Gloves
Medications Module:
4x Ibuprofen 2x 200mg
4x Paracetamol 2x500mg
4x Diphenhydramine 25mg
4x Zantac/Ranitidine 75mg
2x Meclizine 2x 25mg
2x Aspirin 2x 325mg
1x Hydrocortisone Cream 1% sachet
1x Mitigator Sting Relief
4x Sting Relief Pads
1x Burn Gel sachet
2x Dioralyte Sachets
Additional Items:
1x Roll of Zinc Oxide Tape
1x Roll of Self Adhesive Tape
1x Roll of Fabric Tape
1x Tin of Vaseline Lip Balm
1x Triangular Bandage
1x Space Blanket
1x Fresnel Magnifying lens
1x Eye Bath
1x Small Tube of Sudocrem
1x 6”x12” Alokak Bag
Sever Blood Stopping & Chest Trauma Module: - Add On
2x 6”x12” Alokak Bag
1x SWAT-T Tourniquet
1x Israeli Bandage - 4”
1x Quick Clot Haemostatic Sponge
1x 3 foot strip of Duct Tape
3x Safety Pins
3x pairs Nitrile Gloves
2x Antimicrobial Wipes
1x Asherman Chest Seal
1x Mini Sharpie Marker
1x NPA
1x KY Jelly Sachet
1x 14# Decompression Needle
2x Small Halo Chest Seals
Luxury Nice to Have Items
1x An Orange BIC Lighter
2x Dioralyte Sachets
3x Mini Red Chemical Light Sticks
1x Hi Intensity 5 Min Chemical Light Stick
1x White Chemical Light Stick
1x Casualty Evacuation Form
1x Tick Remover
1x SAM Splint, Finger
The Kids Addon Modules are from when I take my Kids with me.
Kids Wound Dressing Module: - Add On
2x 2”x2” Non Stick Pads
5x Long Finger Plasters
4x Short Finger Plasters
2x Large Finger Plasters
2x Triple Antibiotic Cream sachets
2x Knee / Elbow Plasters
4x Square Plasters
3x Small Butterfly Closures
2x Antiseptic Wipes
2x Small Compeed Blister Patches
1x Small Pre-cut Moleskin Patch
Kids Medication Module: - Add On
4x Diphenhydramine 25mg
2x Meclizine 2x 25mg
4x Sting Relief Pads
2x Paracetamol 120mg Sachets
2x Paracetamol 240mg (6+) Sachets
2x Ibuprofen 100mg Sachets
1x Medicine Spoon 5 & 2.5ml
1x Teething Gel
4x Gaviscon Junior
1x Advent Magic Cream
bushwacker bob
03-04-2012, 21:31
You forgot the ambulance:)
crucible
04-04-2012, 00:25
Plasters
Duct tape plasters
Duct tape
Ibuprofen
3 levels or really good painkillers, from Tylenol 3, to Oxycontin, to Stadol(synthetic morphine)
Disposable pocket mask
Immodium - gastric meds
Alcohol based hand sanitizer
Totumpole
04-04-2012, 09:52
I include a small mirror and a small head torch (Petzl eLite) in my FAK
Good idea, think I may well make those additions.
........6 ibuprofen .......PS. It's not indigestion its Whisky burn.
Ibuprofen is probably not the best choice of analgesia for indigestion (or whisky burn) as it can be a gastric irritant (particularly with repeated/prolonged use). Otherwise a great painkiller.
Having done CPR twice for real I am a big fan of face shields.
Both occassions I did CPR - on people I knew pretty well - I did not have a face shield on me.
Both times I ended up tasting their vomit - both vomitted prior to collapse - and I can tell you ... it aint nice.
You can most likely do without the faceshield as current guidance is for only chest compressions and no ventilations, it is far more effective for solo bystander resuscitation.
See this BHF video - its genius!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ILxjxfB4zNk
sandbender
04-04-2012, 10:19
"...See this BHF video - its genius!..."
"Here is one I made earlier" my coffee is on now on the keyboard! :D
lannyman8
04-04-2012, 19:47
well i totally understand the drugs, especially for longer walks...
when im doing anything over a day or lots of miles i take a blister/meds pouch, this consists:-
micro pore tape, for blister prevention, i find its better than zink oxide tape, but thats just me.
comped, walking blister plasters, i normally use these on other people, i know when (if ever) im getting a blister, prevention is better than cure.
second skin, spray type plaster for blisters, i use the bottle type with the spreader as its smaller.
diclofenac sodium, for when my knees WILL get bad, normaly about 1 strip (12 tablets i think).
co codamol, also for my knees and if my back plays up while carrying 25-30 kg...:)
the above all goes in a waterproof bag in the top flap of my bergan for easy use when walking.
i also have a small FAK with the following:-
plasters, any small selection for cuts that wont stop bleeding.
paracetamol, for normal non mega painful stuff.
gaviscon tablets, i tend to get a bad belly if eating allot of sugar, it does not agree with me but is good for calories.
tick removal tool, for the obvious.
tourniquet, just because its spare, it can be used as a splint, arm support/sling (for broken arm etc), back up belt etc etc etc etc.
israli bandage, this covers everything basically, the only reason i carry this is because mistakes just sometimes happen, and i dont want to get blood on my socks....;)
at the end of the day you should know what your body needs, and take items to deal with that when it happens, just like my pill selection.
hope this is of some use.
regards.
chris.
Careful with your co-codamol.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-17487432
Graveworm
04-04-2012, 20:59
as current guidance is for only chest compressions and no ventilations, it is far more effective for solo bystander resuscitation.
Love the video but to be clear the CURRENT GUIDANCE (http://www.resus.org.uk/pages/bls.pdf) is not for only chest compressions; it's an option for those who are unable or unwilling to do ventilations.
Maybe one more idea for the medic kit "a chill pill". ;)
lannyman8
04-04-2012, 21:23
Careful with your co-codamol.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-17487432
coool, more for less...;)
im on 30/500 anyway so its all good...:)
thanks for the heads up though...
Totumpole
05-04-2012, 10:26
Love the video but to be clear the CURRENT GUIDANCE (http://www.resus.org.uk/pages/bls.pdf) is not for only chest compressions; it's an option for those who are unable or unwilling to do ventilations.
OK fair enough. You are correct, the current guidance does state to teach lay people CPR with chest compressions and rescue breaths. I had a big rant ready about coronary perfusion pressures and what not, but having read the guidance I would be going against said guidance and don't want to confuse matters with my tired post night shift opinions of medical protocol. What I will reinforce is that if someone clearly has no pulse and is not breathing and you have no idea what you are doing, giving compression only CPR to the best of your ability is better than nothing. Early shock is also the key (for cardiac arrest)- so call out in dramatic E.R/Holby City style - I NEED A DEFIB - STAT!!!! DOn't worry, it's clever and will tell you what to do when it gets there :)
Maybe one more idea for the medic kit "a chill pill". ;)
You are probably right, mine is in the form of a liquid and I would never go out for an overnighter without a couple! I'm indulging in one right now, it's 9 years old and peaty!
coool, more for less...
And without prescription!
With regards to the FAK.
I would be extremely careful with the Tramadol even the 50mg tablets have a tendency to make the taker very dizzy and physically sick.
I can't foresee any circumstances where it would be wise to self medicate or medicate others with prescription tablets.
The side effects are likely to cause more problems than the tablets are going to solve.
^^^ Totally agree ^^^
Netfrog you don't mention re: the Tramadol Hyrdochloride whether you are prescribed them, I'm not on about the fact that you have prescription drugs in your kit, but as a regular 'prescribed' user of Tramadol, they are a very powerful pain killer and not along the same lines as any of the over the counter meds you'll get (in the UK at least). If you haven't taken them but have been given them or heard about them, forget them. If you're prescribed then you'll know all of the side effects of course.
I am prescribed 500 - 600mg a day for severe pain the cause of which is neither here nor there, I don't suffer any ill effects at all even at the elevated dosage because I've been on them for years. But I gave my Sister 1 x 50mg once because she was in severe pain after a fall at my place and I thought I'd killed her. On the train back home with her 20 y/o son she became dizzy, nauseous, had heart palpitations, sweating profusely, blurred vision, they were on the verge of calling a doctor but the symptoms passed in the hour it took to get to her place and she had a couple of hours sleep and was fine.
That was just one and maybe she had a more severe reaction than most people would but I'll never let anyone have one of those things again, as you say they are an artificial opiate, a strong one and the side effects cover the whole reverse side of the info leaflet in the box. Not in my opinion a good addition to anyone's med kit unless you are prescribed them.
Not having a dig, just wouldn't like to see anyone add them to their 'FAK' without knowing what they can do. :(
Si
kiltedpict
07-04-2012, 01:23
Couldn't agree more. It's illegal and dangerous to give someone else a drug that was prescribed for you.
Actually, even certain "over the counter" drugs (eg co-codamol), while legal for the person who bought them to take as directed, it's illegal to give one to someone else as it contains codeine.
It's a fickle world we live in!
ATB
KP
lannyman8
07-04-2012, 12:04
^^^ Totally agree ^^^
Not having a dig, just wouldn't like to see anyone add them to their 'FAK' without knowing what they can do. :(
Si
thats true, the tablets i have, are used from time to time, but have been used many times, and again the side effects some times out way the benefit...it all depends how bad my back is etc etc etc.
and of course, no medication should be given to another person AT ALL, who knows what reaction could happen, especially with a stronger drug....
as i said in my other post though, my drugs are for me only, and for about a week so i have enough if i become bad....
regards.
chris.
winst0nsmith
07-04-2012, 16:29
Saftery pins
Tweezers
Scissors
Various plasters
Butterfly stutures
Individual wet wipes and antiseptic wipes
Triangular bandage
Crepe bandage
Gause pads
Menolin pads
Micropore tape
Tampons
Mirror
Curved needle with thin fishing line pre-attached
Strip of 30/500 Co-codamol
Rubbing alcohol/yarrow tinciture
Generally stays in my bag though, a bandana, gaffer tape, tissue and either plantian or yarrow tends to get most jobs done.
Can I ask what the plantain or yarrow are for? Just bein' nosey. :D
Si
lannyman8
09-04-2012, 22:16
Can I ask what the plantain or yarrow are for? Just bein' nosey. :D
Si
Si, i know plantain helps stop bleeding and is good for cleaning wounds and helps heel them too. not sure about the yarrow, probably the same reasons???
Ah, right have to look those up, I got a big herbal book here somewhere, could be time to have a good read through it for other useful plants too. :)
Cheers
Si
Native Nathan
10-04-2012, 12:28
Yarrow is great for stopping bleeding, as is Plantain, but not as good as Yarrow
Archillies was said to have used Yarrow to stop the bleeding of his soldiers
Graveworm
10-04-2012, 23:02
It's illegal and dangerous to give someone else a drug that was prescribed for you.
KP
It is definitely potentially dangerous but not specifically illegal unless the drug is also controlled by the misuse of drugs act (Most painkillers and tranquilisers are for example).
kiltedpict
11-04-2012, 06:49
It is definitely potentially dangerous but not specifically illegal unless the drug is also controlled by the miue of drugs act (Most painkillers and tranquilisers are for example).
Your probably correct, but by giving someone a "prescription only medication", are you not technically "prescribing", something which you need to be qualified and registered to do? Surely that got to be breaking some law?
Cheers in advance
KP
John Fenna
11-04-2012, 08:13
You can most likely do without the faceshield as current guidance is for only chest compressions and no ventilations, it is far more effective for solo bystander resuscitation.
See this BHF video - its genius!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ILxjxfB4zNk
The 1st Aid trainers I have talked to recently (I have done two 1st Aid courses in the past 6 months) all agree that the vid is amusing but misleading... the "medalion" is too high for eficient compressions for one ...
they also all agree that full CPR - with ventilations - is better if you have the training (and we all have training dont we? If not why not? ).
Their opion seems to be that the hands only stuff is just for untrained folk to do something to help (no matter how ineffectual) rather than nothing at all ... it makes you feel better to have done something rather than watch a person die ... and most will die even with full CPR.... "survivor guilt" is a real phenomenon!
kiltedpict
11-04-2012, 09:01
BBC news report on the ASA's findings following complaints made against the advert
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-17666999
Graveworm
11-04-2012, 11:57
Your probably correct, but by giving someone a "prescription only medication", are you not technically "prescribing", something which you need to be qualified and registered to do? Surely that got to be breaking some law?
Cheers in advance
KP
The medicines act is all about supplying or selling in the course of a business. Supplying is not the same as prescribing. A pharmacist doesn't prescribe they supply the drugs so that the customer can follow the prescribed treatment often the drugs supplied under a prescription could also be supplied without a prescription.
The 1st Aid trainers I have talked to recently (I have done two 1st Aid courses in the past 6 months) all agree that the vid is amusing but misleading... the "medalion" is too high for eficient compressions for one ...
they also all agree that full CPR - with ventilations - is better if you have the training (and we all have training dont we? If not why not? ).
Their opion seems to be that the hands only stuff is just for untrained folk to do something to help (no matter how ineffectual) rather than nothing at all ... it makes you feel better to have done something rather than watch a person die ... and most will die even with full CPR.... "survivor guilt" is a real phenomenon!
The nationl resus council certainly thinks hands only cpr is a very viable means of maintaining an O2 flow also for keeping the heart in as good a shape as possible by preventing swelling of the chambers so as to respond to a defibrillator this is supported by research which I unfortunately can't find to quote., the medallion ting is a bit bad as if that's the info someone takes away, what happens I the sov is over the to the left or right?
The medicines act is all about supplying or selling in the course of a business. Supplying is not the same as prescribing. A pharmacist doesn't prescribe they supply the drugs so that the customer can follow the prescribed treatment often the drugs supplied under a prescription could also be supplied without a prescription.
MR teams administer Diclophenac, oxygen, morphine, epi pens and lots more prescription only drugs. Out of the 20 odd casualty carers in our team authorised to administer only 1 is a doctor and he's newly qualified so not able to prescribe yet!
The administration of prescription only drugs doesn't have to be by the prescribed.
kiltedpict
11-04-2012, 16:06
MR teams administer Diclophenac, oxygen, morphine, epi pens and lots more prescription only drugs. Out of the 20 odd casualty carers in our team authorised to administer only 1 is a doctor and he's newly qualified so not able to prescribe yet!
The administration of prescription only drugs doesn't have to be by the prescribed.
Well that makes sense as I administer POM's on a daily basis and I can't prescribe!
I would expect in the MR environment (and other similar) the team members are giving POM's based on training and protocols overseen / written by the team Dr? Or how does it work?
KP
I carry:
Duct tape
Superglue
Couple of pain killers
Iodine spray
And i got some blood clotting powder given from a friend who works with chainsaws.
I have treated cuts, grazes, blisters and sprains with duct tape and for small cuts/nicks the superglue gets used.
Never had to use it but if Myself or anyone I come accross has a large cut i believe the clot powder will work wonders.
Do not use the quickclot powder if you've not been trained, get it right and you'll only cause a night mare for the hospital staff who have to try and wash it out the wound, get it wrong and your blind with burns to your eys, nose and mouth and your a nightmare for hospital staff again.
Well that makes sense as I administer POM's on a daily basis and I can't prescribe!
I would expect in the MR environment (and other similar) the team members are giving POM's based on training and protocols overseen / written by the team Dr? Or how does it work?
KP
Spot on. You can administer drugs only if you are certified Casualty Carer.
Most members of our team are taught a level of first aid which exceeds First Aid At Work. It includes the use of airway adjuncts, chest seals, jaw thrusts and a few other bits and pieces. Even then they are not expected to take the lead. The training can be used if they are first on scene but it is mainly intended to allow them to.assist a Casualty Carer. The CC asks for oxygen, morphine, entonox, nebuliser, etc and the team member can prepare it for them. But only the Casualty Carer can administer the POM.
I think the Casualty Care training and certification standard is the same across all MR teams. Our team is looking to exceed these standards when it comes to any drugs, not just POM. Quite soon a Casualty Carer in our team will only be authorised to administer drugs if they have passed an additional certification exam which covers just drugs. It will go in to more detail on side affects, interactions, contraindications, etc. I'm looking forward to this as I felt we didnt spend enough time on drugs in the training and trying to include it in continuation training along with all whether subjects we need to keep abreast of is difficult. This additional certification will give the team Medical Officer and me the confidence in me that is needed to be sure I won't kill someone by mistake!
Hope this helps. If you have any more questions just drop me a line.
Nigel.
kiltedpict
11-04-2012, 21:59
Cheers Nigel. Great explanation, thanks for that.
ATB
KP
Graveworm
11-04-2012, 23:43
The nationl resus council certainly thinks hands only cpr is a very viable means of maintaining an O2 flow also for keeping the heart in as good a shape as possible by preventing swelling of the chambers so as to respond to a defibrillator this is supported by research which I unfortunately can't find to quote., the medallion ting is a bit bad as if that's the info someone takes away, what happens I the sov is over the to the left or right?
That might be slightly overstating the case. What they actually say is:
It is effective for a limited period only (probably less than 5 min) and is not recommended as the
standard management of out-of-hospital cardiac arrest.
Totumpole
12-04-2012, 16:31
That might be slightly overstating the case. What they actually say is:
It is effective for a limited period only (probably less than 5 min) and is not recommended as the
standard management of out-of-hospital cardiac arrest.
Just to throw in my 2 pence worth to the discussion.....
It's nigh on impossible to get good quality research regarding the goings on around cardiac arrest - its not something you can double blind placebo control! Resuscitation guidelines are based on the limited research available (which is shoddy at best) and expert opinion. If you read the current guidelines it does elude to the fact that there is an increasing preponderance towards chest compressions for 1 simple fact - cessation of chest compressions leads to a loss of coronary perfusion pressure (ie the output from your heart that keeps blood going to the heart muscle itself). YEs, after a certain amount of time there will be a lack of oxygen in the blood that does reach the heart, but for bystander, or even first aider CPR, maintaining this coronary perfusion pressure is easier with compression only CPR (in the earlier quoted guideline they state they do not want to confuse people by changing guidance completely going off in a different direction), and personally I think this is the way things are going. It takes a good portion of the chest compressions (I’m remembering 10 to 15, but dont quote me) to regain an adequate coronary perfusion pressure.
It’s been said a couple of times that it is only effective for 5 minutes, but realistically if you do not have a paramedic in attendance within 5 minutes (who can give DC cardioversion hopefully restoring output, and if not intubate to allow asynchronous chest compressions and ventilation), you are a long way up S*** creek with no paddle. I work as part of the cardiac arrest team in the hospital, and to be perfectly honest even members of this team, who have been in their profession for many more years than I have, give suboptimal chest compressions. If in the group of professionals, whose job it is to do this on a day to day basis, struggle to perform adequate chest compression and thus maintain good coronary perfusion pressure, then jo public with bystander A doing CPR and attempting to blow expired gases into the lungs, losing about 8 - 10 seconds of CPR, thus losing the coronary perfusion pressure it took half the last cycle of chest compression to build up........ ah I think you get my point. Time will tell what the resus council go with when they next review the guidelines.
The kettle of fish may be a different one if you throw oxygen into the mix, because you are then putting more than 17% oxygen into the lungs, and it’s also slightly different if you have multiple trained people able to perform bystander CPR, as the down time between compressions is less if the second person is able to maintain an open airway and reduce the time taken to give breaths between compressions.
Dammit I knew I couldn’t hold the rant back forever!
Sorry to thread jack. THis is a useful thread, always good to compare kit lists and I will be updating my kit as result of some of the kit lists in here. Some interesting discussion too.
entropydog
13-04-2012, 22:54
Chewing Aspirin is always a good start for 95% feeling chest pains. CPR is for those that are already dead and very rarely works. If you can hook them up to an AED within 5 mins they have a slightly better chance of returning to life. In urban areas Ambulances may arrive in time. In the outdoors??.. It’s instinctive to go out of your way to sustain another’s life to the upmost and a 1% chance is always better that none, but it’s the speed of getting the AED that counts.