View Full Version : Burn treatment in the bush
Are there any natural ingredients found in the UK which can be used to treat burns? I carry a tube of Savlon in my FAK but just wondered if there was an alternative?
John Fenna
04-09-2011, 17:33
Cold water and lots of it!
Any kind of poultice or wrap that can be applied?
Ex member - Bilgerat
04-09-2011, 17:43
No......
John is correct....
Cold Water and lots of it is the only way to go..... Followed by a clean dry dressing..... Unless the burn is big then Cling-film fer a while.....
Anything else will screw the burn site up.....
Ex member - Bilgerat
04-09-2011, 17:45
http://www.patient.co.uk/health/Burns-and-Scalds.htm
shaggystu
04-09-2011, 17:47
minimum of 20 minutes under cold running water, followed by at least 20ml of whisky under no water at all, works for me!
stuart
edit; the whisky's for drinking, not for pouring on the wound, not that whisky would do any harm on a burn, it may even help, it's just a waste of good whisky!
udamiano
04-09-2011, 18:05
Yep lots of 'CLEAN' cold water, and about 20mins is about right for the time (most people don't do enough time)
Then any dressing that won't adhere to the burn, otherwise its going to sting like a sod when they try and remove it at the hospital. The courses I've attended all recommend Cling film, to keep it clean, or similar. I've always got some burn gel in my medi kit, and have used it a number of times, a bit pricey though, but worth it
tree beard
04-09-2011, 18:59
Lavender essential oil is brilliant for burns, the sooner applied the better . . . . . I always carry a bottle.
Check your local £stores; our local ones had a wee box of five sachets of the stuff for the £.
Shewie I think it depends on your burn. If it's just a wee nippy fingertip one the cold water is fine, but, it won't stop that pain niggling because of all the nerves in the fingertips. The cold water will just cool everything down enough that there won't be any more damage. That's when stuff like the burngel is good :)
None of the plants I know that were traditionally used are considered to be recommendable nowadays, and the only one I'd say off the cuff, so to speak, is the houseleek. This is kind of our native aloe vera.
Otherwise, best advice is to follow the first aid guides.
atb,
M
Ex member - Bilgerat
04-09-2011, 19:28
Woah....... Be careful of applying anything that the patient could be allergic to....
Anything beyond cold water could be "Prescribing"......
Lots of ointments contain Lanolin (Wool)....
The stuff like Lavender and Savlon may feel good, but can introduce complications...
Take care.........:)
When I had this nasty burn
http://www.jubileegroup.co.uk/JOS/misc/hand.jpg
from my Ghillie kettle about 18 months ago, initially I poured cold water that I had handy just in case (and very glad of my precautions I was too). Then I put it under a cold tap for about a quarter of an hour.
Then I took myself off to A&E, and got there about half an hour later. They sent me straight to the front of the queue, sat me next to a sink and put my hand under the cold tap again, for another quarter of an hour.
Half the skin on my hand eventually fell off but it healed very quickly with no scarring at all
Action on burns has to be FAST.
Scots_Charles_River
04-09-2011, 19:43
As others have said just cold water and cling film, to protect from infection. You lay on the cling film, take one full turn off first, so it's sterile. This is to protect the wound from infection. Anything added eg Burn gels, will only cause problems but may mask symptoms.
I burnt my calf last year. Was descending a hard MTB descent in the Pyrenees. Lifted my bike down a drop and the rear disk touched my calf. Luckily having a water bottle I skooshed it for the last ten mins of descent before I got to a tap. It branded me but did not blister due to the cooling of the burn with water.
Nick
Bilgerat I suspect that Shewie was asking for himself.
We generally know what our familiar outdoors companions are allergic to.
Not decrying your sound advice, just clarifying, and as was said, depends on the 'burn'
Toddy
Scots_Charles_River
04-09-2011, 19:48
Part of the problems of allergies is, unless the patient has had that ointment etc apllied before they may not know they are allergic!
Nick
Which is why we self apply.
No one else's responsibility.
cheers,
Toddy
Ex member - Bilgerat
04-09-2011, 21:11
No problems.... However I would not even self apply........... Cept Water, Clingfilm & Dry dressings....
Everyone listens to tales of what works, Butter was meant to be extremely good at one point.....
Savlon will help stop infection on cuts etc..... Major non starter here.... Pseudomonas Pyocyanea (P. pyocyanea) Will grow on Savlon........
Natural remidies ie. leaves... Will only contaminate and bring on infection.....
I have 38 Years Front Line Medical experience.......:)
Thing is though, when you're out, and it's a wee nippy, painful, getting in the way of everything you're trying to do kind of burn, that it's instinctive to do something to stop it hurting.
This is just the latest thread on a common theme, and at the end of the day most of us treat ourselves, and even if (and most of us have) done FA courses year upon year, so know not to 'treat' anyone, we still offer advice on what worked for us.
I look on Shewie's question in that light.
Scorched fingers ? cold water, dry dressing......damned all use when he's stuck on an island in the middle of a loch (and that's likely knowing him :) ) and needs to be able to work effectively to get himself onto mainland and drive home again.
Cold water, and keep it cold, take the edge of pain off with the burngel and get a good night's sleep and fit to paddle ashore and drive home safely the next morning....now that's more likely.
No one's decrying good first aid advice, but this isn't a first aider getting someone out and to medical facilities. It's about
garnering enough information on what works so that the weekend's not a washout and safely back home. Besides, we're curious, I might know a fair amount of old remedies, but I really like to know what actually works :D
We're not in dispute, just widening the focus :)
cheers,
Toddy
I thought there'd be a few suggestions of plants but it seems that's not the case, just good old cold water.
I guess I was referring to burns occurring round a regular camp, just small stuff really. Finger burns from picking something up which you shouldn't have, a singed arm or hand from rearranging a trivet or clumsily lifting a griddle incorrectly.
I was expecting somebody to say honey, sphagnum and spit mashed up on a rock
Liam swears by flour, and he's a chef :)
Honey's good for ulcerated stuff, and sore throats (watch me get shot down in flames now :) ) I wouldn't use it on burns :)
Anyone else think we're sometimes in danger of allergy panicking ourselves into not trusting anything ?............and I *am* allergic to some things so I'm not being facile in my question.
cheers,
M
First google hit turned up this ...
http://www.home-remedy.org/burn-remedies.html
(http://www.home-remedy.org/burn-remedies.html)
Taken with a pinch of salt of course but some interesting suggestions
Graveworm
04-09-2011, 22:54
Pardon me for butting in. There is a lot to burns and treatment depends on the cause and severity etc. But generally like everyone else has said first aid is water for about 10 - 20 minutes depending on the thickness of the burn and the area of the body covered. If it's a really large area of the body then you may well be adding serious problems by overcooling. Follow with a non adherent dressing and again it's already been said; clingfilm is best unless you have proper burn dressings but they don't add much over clingfilm if you have already cooled things down. Burn dressings are most useful for large burn areas or where you can't find, or use running water. Creams etc are best avoided, especially oil, fat or alcohol based, on burns; some gels can be used on small burns. I'm a wilderness EMT, BATLS and a First Aid instructor if it helps.
Lots of water. With things like Savlon, once opened, discard at end of trip and take a new tube on your next journey.
?so what do you do if you don't have a tap full of running water nearby?
especially as a the boot full of boiling water seems a possible injurry (hadn't thougt of it myself but sounds like it could be nasty)
Wilderness EMT with BATLS training here and an herbalist.
?so what do you do if you don't have a tap full of running water nearby?
If you are somewhere that has little or no water you still need to reduce the heat of the burn rapidly. Mist and Fan the burn site. This means that you get it wet with water from your canteen and fan it with a jacket or the wind. The convection will reduce the heat.
You still need at least 20 minutes of cooling.
The original question was regarding plants available for burn treatment. If you are near the sea then bladderwrack (http://www.bckelp.com/bladderwrack_fresh_with_bulbs_ op_800x600.jpg) will be the weapon of choice. There are little sachets of gooey stuff at the end of each frond. Use this as you would with aloe.
To be honest.....rapid irrigation for at least 20 minutes followed by cling film is the best option.
Be sure not to cool the skin too quickly. Only use tepid water. DO NOT USE ICE! If you freeze the skin it will trap the heat deep within the tissues.
Lots of water. With things like Savlon, once opened, discard at end of trip and take a new tube on your next journey.
Why's that Rik ?
The Big Lebowski
05-09-2011, 08:30
On another note... I carry a 10cm x 10cm sterikool dressing for larger burns and several sachets of burns gel for smaller incidents.
I've used this on three injury's in work, and all the patients said its wonderful stuff. The brand name was Sterikool, but there's lots of choice these days. Its worth having in your FAK.
al.
?are there two types of 'gel'?
one that 'treats' the burn - which may cause problems eg masking symptoms/causing problems for proper medics
and
another that merely cools the burn as an alternative to water - presumably this type is in some kind of bag/covering so that it does not stick to the wound?
The burn gel stuff dries onto the skin like newskin. It contains a pain killer.
It really is *only* for tiny wee scorches and burns. The kind Shewie described.
If the burn has caused skin to slough off, or is of any 'size' rather than just a touch, get to a A&E asap.
The stericool pads that TBL suggested sound useful though.
The only other burn cream that I'd ever used, and that was years ago, was the yellow flamazine. Not advised now by first aiders.
cheers,
Toddy
The Big Lebowski
05-09-2011, 10:16
As far as I know, the gel is simply to draw the heat out of the burn, say between your fingers and keep the skin moist while doing so... The sterikool patches are cold on the skin and bring instant relief. They are designed to be held in place with a bandage en-route to medical attention. I mention the brand name as its the only one we stock in work (through RS) but first hand user accounts say it's good at what it does.
Anything over a moderate accidental spill of hot liquid, or burnt fingers from a pot handle and it would be a decamp A&E anyway. Myself or someone else. A good burn (I've had a couple form catering) is never a pleasurable thing and gets more painful over time. Plus you risk infection if the skin is compromised in any way.
Water or a burns pad/gel as quick as possible to reduce the damage.
Next time I'm doing a contents check of the burns kit in work, I'll have a look and see what the compounds made of.
The Streikool pad 10x10cm can be purchased for around £2. Their own brand gel is around £5 for 6. Sachets of budget gel £1 for 6 via Asda or such.
http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/first-aid-kits/0481557/
al.
?so what do you do if you don't have a tap full of running water nearby? ...
Good question.
I think you have to accept that living as we do when out in the wilds things aren't ideal. So it's worth taking that extra bit of care. Presumably we have the time, after all, or we wouldn't be there.
Given that it's implicitly accepted that things are not ideal, water could be recirculated by holding the burned part over a bowl (I carry a collapsible one) or some other container to catch the water which runs off. Something like a spoon or cup or just the hand could be used to keep the burned part wet. If it's the hand that's burned (it often is, e.g. my previous post :() then you can just agitate the water with the burned part. Water is a really excellent material for heat transfer (which is why we use it in central heating systems and car radiators for example) and, more to the point, storage. As long as the amount of water being used is quite a lot bigger than the amount of flesh to be cooled, the water won't warm up appreciably so it will continue to have the all-important cooling effect on the burn.
The big drawback in this scenario of course is that the recycled water is inevitably going to be contaminated to some extent. In my relative ignorance I'd take the view that if the water could be kept reasonably clean then in the short term the risk of contamination would probably be preferable to the certainty of damage from heat, but I'd welcome views from the medics here.
udamiano
05-09-2011, 11:11
I suppose at lot of the answers depend on the size and location of the burn, and if it's deep or not. large deep burns cause the body to go into shock, as fluid from the damaged area seeps into the burn, this really needs experienced medical personnel to deal with. especially if as you say the local water cannot be trusted, then really its a question of if you don't treat the area with an antiseptic will the patient die, again, really this is a question for a qualified medic.
I would suggest that if anyone does intend to go into an area where the chances of evacuation cannot be guaranteed within a short period of time, then the group should include a qualified medic, and not just a first-aider, yes this will probably increase the overall cost, but the question is, how much is your life worth.
well thats how I see it anyway
Day
Ex member - Bilgerat
05-09-2011, 11:34
Why's that Rik ?
Re Savlon....
As stated in my post..... Pseudomonas Pyocyanea (P. pyocyanea) Will grow on Savlon........
Savlon is a media for making this bacteria grow....... This may cause septicaemia.... and can be fatal......
And as fer allergies.... It is not only the allergy that you have to be careful of it is the secondary effects of the allergy....
Pustules.. Granuloma... Skin & Tissue Necrosis.... Leading to a much increased infection risk......
Sometimes you have to accept there is not much you are able to do....
Re Savlon....
As stated in my post..... Pseudomonas Pyocyanea (P. pyocyanea) Will grow on Savlon........
Savlon is a media for making this bacteria grow....... This may cause septicaemia.... and can be fatal......
Can that happen even with a cap screwed on? I can remember my mum having a huge tube of it in the bathroom cabinet when we were growing up, that one must have been getting on for 10 years old at least.
Ex member - Bilgerat
05-09-2011, 12:02
Can that happen even with a cap screwed on? I can remember my mum having a huge tube of it in the bathroom cabinet when we were growing up, that one must have been getting on for 10 years old at least.
The bacteria (P. pyocyanea) needs air to grow... So it will not grow in the tube wiv the cap screwed on.... However when you apply Savlon to the skin then the Bacteria will grow in the Savlon (and you) using the Savlon as nutriment...
Burn damaged tissue needs to be kept sterile as possible.... So I would avoid its use...
In fact I really would avoid its use anywhere.........
Interesting thread.
Having spent some time with Fraiser from costal survial rectently and noticed how he treated a sever scald with natural remedies quite successfully I would recomend sending him a PM or waiting for him to post.
I have just had a read of the oxford hand book of expedition and wilderness medicine (oxford hand books are carried by most medics).
They recommend
Minor burns
-Stop the burning process, baisically remove the heat source
-cool the burn, immerse in tepid water. Cooling large areas can trigger hypothermia. Chemical burns will need high levels of irregation
-Control the pain, baisically pain killers
-Use suitable burn dressings, cling film is ideal. Cling film is sterile as long as the first few centimeters are discarded. Hand burns may be treated in a plastic bag. Cooling gels such as burnshield are useful to cool the burn and provide good pain relief.
Key points,
-Burns to significant areas such as hands feet face and genitalia should be assessed by a specialist.
-10%+ body surface burnt need to evac
-Blistered burns should not be de roofed, large blisters may be asperated with a serile needle
-Bactroban or silver sulphadiazine creams help prent infection and should be applied under the cling film or plastic bag. parafin gause is usefull to dress burns as it is less likely to adhere to the burn.
-elevate limbs to reduce swelling
-Ibuprofen is usually sufficent analgesia for a dressed burn.
-Burns should be redressed and checked for infecton every 24-48hrs.
I am not a doc, just relaying the info in a trusted medical text.
Another option is honey. There is a good chance that you will have this in camp for your breakfast porridge.
After you have cooled the burn with 20 minutes of irrigation, put a lot of honey on it and then wrap with cling film or something similar.
The research is here (http://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&q=honey+burn&as_sdt=0%2C5&as_ylo=2006&as_vis=0) regarding honey use for burns.
Having a thought about this actually, and the issues of cooling, infection, allergy and so on.
The British Navy of the past used vinegar for all of the burns, scrapes, blisters, etc., even for soaking the suture threads.
They didn't use alcohol because that was drinkable.
But, alcohol evaporates and thus cools the skin, while vinegar stops bacterial growth 'and' is a recommended douche or wash for even intimate places.
Just wondering, but....is a bottle of Sarson's a good idea in the camp ? :D
cheers,
Toddy
p.s. Thank you, good to know about the honey; I've only used it on the festering wee pustles around skelfs and it was amazingly effective :D
Why's that Rik ?
Its cuts down the chance of bacteria growth, bugs grow in all sorts of mediums even disinfectant, so open, use, dispose and replace. The chance of serious bacterial growth is not high but I won't take the chance of infection/cross infection and for what a tube costs its not worth messing about.
Search for bacteria growth savlon and you will see where the panic started after some hospital stock was found to be contaminated.
Ex member - Bilgerat
05-09-2011, 13:43
I feel we are wandering a bit off the burn topic here...
Honey sometimes contains spores of the bacterium Clostridium botulinum, which can transform into toxin-producing bacteria.
Vinegar slows down the rate of Bacteria reprodution particullary when in an anerobic state (No Oxygen) (Lid sealed) however once out of the bottle and especially when diluted.... (Blood, water etc... ) And in aerobic conditions wont act as an effective surface antibiotic.....
The problem wiv Savlon starts once it has been put on a wound.....
Savlon really is worse than useless in a lot of situations.... And can lead to septicaemia and death....
Really don't use any.......
mrcharly
05-09-2011, 14:25
How does that compare to iodine-based antiseptics, such as betadine?
We keep betadine gel and an iodine-based tincture in the house for minor wounds. I've noticed that if I have red inflamed scratches on my hands and dab them with tincture, they heal very very quickly compared to just washing them.
The trust stopped us using Betadine about four ago.
Back on topic, for burns, water, water, water and seek professional help asap if needed. No need for any lotions or potions in the UK, we are never far from proper treatment.
Back on topic, for burns, water, water, water and seek professional help asap if needed. No need for any lotions or potions in the UK, we are never far from proper treatment.
That is the case for the car campers among us but what if you're on a week long trip up a sea loch in the northwest of Scotland for instance, if you don't want to cut it short to seek medical attention I'm trying to find out the alternatives.
John Fenna
05-09-2011, 16:24
Having a thought about this actually, and the issues of cooling, infection, allergy and so on.
The British Navy of the past used vinegar for all of the burns, scrapes, blisters, etc., even for soaking the suture threads.
They didn't use alcohol because that was drinkable.
Just wondering, but....is a bottle of Sarson's a good idea in the camp ? :D
The is a higher chance of there being lots af alcohol on site anyway :)
But you will not get me to part with a good whisky just to stop some clumsy beggars arm from rotting off - get them to the blummin hospital!
Ex member - Bilgerat
05-09-2011, 17:07
That is the case for the car campers among us but what if you're on a week long trip up a sea loch in the northwest of Scotland for instance, if you don't want to cut it short to seek medical attention I'm trying to find out the alternatives.
Strewth man..... There are none......... If you need medical help fer a burn you need to get yerself or them to a medical unit......
All the questions in the world will not find what you are hoping for.... Word....
Strewth man..... There are none......... If you need medical help fer a burn you need to get yerself or them to a medical unit......
All the questions in the world will not find what you are hoping for.... Word....
Chill your boots, forums are for asking questions and not getting drivel back
Wind it in
Ex member - Bilgerat
05-09-2011, 17:26
Chill your boots, forums are for asking questions and not getting drivel back
Wind it in
Wind the drivel in yersel......
You don't seem to want to know the truth.... Man..... You try peoples patience...
Johns reply should have been enough but oh no.....
My family always use liberal slatherings of aloe vera gel on burns to remarkable effect. I've treated a couple of burns which I thought were going to heal really slowly this way and been good as new save a little erythema within 24 hours.
Anecdotal I know but there are research papers which atest to it's efficacy even on 2nd degree burns. I'm mobile so can't link, but I have posted them on another thread. I'll have a chat with my A&E counterpart next time I see her and report back.
Wind the drivel in yersel......
You don't seem to want to know the truth.... Man..... You try peoples patience...
Johns reply should have been enough but oh no.....
Another one for the ignore list
Ex member - Bilgerat
05-09-2011, 17:37
Looks like some people will remain ignorant....
Just sliced 6" strip of cling film off the roll and wrapped it round a piece of cardboard, it slots in nicely into the back of my FAK.
Where can I pick up these burn gels, anybody bought some recently?
The bladderwrack is a useful one to know as we usually end up on sea lochs on our trips, I can't say I've ever really noticed any on the west coast of Scotland but I've never really looked for it before.
I've dug out my collapsible bowl again and I'll put it back in my wannigan, it should come in handy for bathing in cold water.
I've never had a bad burn, just those little annoying ones. It's something I've though about before though so I've updated my FAK and got a few things to look out for.
That is the case for the car campers among us but what if you're on a week long trip up a sea loch in the northwest of Scotland for instance, if you don't want to cut it short to seek medical attention I'm trying to find out the alternatives.
You have two real options, stay where you are and run the risk of infection or go and get the burn looked at, choice is yours. Dressing the wound with non sterile clingfilm is very much a temporary measure used while you make your way to the professionals.
Ex member - Bilgerat
05-09-2011, 18:15
Bout the only one I would use....
And have issued to my teams.....
http://www.amazon.com/Water-Jel-Burn-Pain-Relief/dp/B0006GE5N6
Note.... First Aid use only..... Please bear in mind this is not recommend to be included in the "First Aid Kits" as the temptation is to use this instead of Water....
For Casualty recover to a Medical unit only to ease pain......
The Only things that should be in First Aid Kits are Dressings and Bandages.... Oh and Safety Pins....:)
Tho other "Emergency equipment" can be placed in as required fer Specialist Circumstances...
Usual termed "Medical Kit".....:)
Ex member - Bilgerat
05-09-2011, 18:45
And whilst we are on the subject...
Hydrofluoric Acid Burns...... Not really one that will be of concern to Bushcrafters in the wild however a special note is probably worthwhile here.
Melted Brake hoses and other melted Hydraulic hoses are the most common source for this type of burn...
Common in using old car parts containg brake fluid to light fires....
(Brake fluid is better and more toxic) than petrol fer flames....
A burn of this sort will keep on burning full thickness down and into the bone, adding Water will not treat this or retard the burn...
calcium gluconate gel or For digital burns, if calcium gluconate gel is not available, the fingers may be soaked in magnesium hydroxide–containing antacid preparations (eg, Mylanta) en route to a medical facility.....
Only use Rubber from tyres or inner-tubes fer tinder......
Point 1
I routinely take myself and family to locations with only sea access which are more than three hours away from the local Level 2 Hospital A&E, and a further 2 hours from there to the local Level 3 Hospital A&E by blue light ambulance. This journey includes a boat trip, and sometimes the boatmen isn't available, or it's blowing a gale. The only option is to call out the lifeboat, or air extraction. For a serious burn that's a given. For a minor burn, I'm not sure ambulance control would allocate their resources that way. For more serious injuries, it would be prudent given an appropriate level of medical knowledge to attempt self-treatment while waiting for the arrival of paramedical services.
Point 2
Hospital A&E's are quite busy enough without every single person who suffers a minor burn turning up at their door.
Point 3
Many people on here are medical professionals, or have extensive first aid experience. At the end of the day any individual can make a choice as to when and how to seek medical treatment for themselves, and whether self-treatment is a viable option for them. They need to judge whether trip to casualty for a minor injury is the best use of their time, and the time of their local hospital emergency service. At the end of the day, every competent adult takes responsibility for their own actions and health.
Scots_Charles_River
05-09-2011, 19:14
I thought there'd be a few suggestions of plants but it seems that's not the case, just good old cold water.
I guess I was referring to burns occurring round a regular camp, just small stuff really. Finger burns from picking something up which you shouldn't have, a singed arm or hand from rearranging a trivet or clumsily lifting a griddle incorrectly.
I was expecting somebody to say honey, sphagnum and spit mashed up on a rock
Witch Hazel gel works well on wasp stings and small light burns, like if you touched a hot kettle lid. As long as the skins not broken.
I have one in my bumbag, when travelling.
http://www.superdrug.com/first-aid/witch-doctor-gel-35g/invt/69732/
Nick
hoppinmad
05-09-2011, 22:42
Hi,
The new British Standards Institute [BS-8599-1:2011] first aid kits now include burn relief dreesings
Ex member - Bilgerat
06-09-2011, 12:33
I think Scots has a valid point which can be missed....
A minor burn.... OK. Big deal... I dont think we are too concerned wiv those...
However Skin Broken or as a Burn takes of skin layers....
The Skin is a good natural barrier and yerself heals its self more or less wiv minor things...
Wiv yer skin missing thats when infection can happen very quickly... Hence cover up wiv an impermeable membrane.... Clingfilm...
Hoppinmad.... Good to know that FA Kit can now include those dressings... :)
Point 1
I routinely take myself and family to locations with only sea access which are more than three hours away from the local Level 2 Hospital A&E, and a further 2 hours from there to the local Level 3 Hospital A&E by blue light ambulance. This journey includes a boat trip, and sometimes the boatmen isn't available, or it's blowing a gale. The only option is to call out the lifeboat, or air extraction. For a serious burn that's a given. For a minor burn, I'm not sure ambulance control would allocate their resources that way. For more serious injuries, it would be prudent given an appropriate level of medical knowledge to attempt self-treatment while waiting for the arrival of paramedical services.
Point 2
Hospital A&E's are quite busy enough without every single person who suffers a minor burn turning up at their door.
Point 3
Many people on here are medical professionals, or have extensive first aid experience. At the end of the day any individual can make a choice as to when and how to seek medical treatment for themselves, and whether self-treatment is a viable option for them. They need to judge whether trip to casualty for a minor injury is the best use of their time, and the time of their local hospital emergency service. At the end of the day, every competent adult takes responsibility for their own actions and health.
Very well put, Ronnie.
There is no reason to clog up the A&E departments with injuries that can be treated at home with just a little bit of training.
I have worked for years in the A&E in various places and have been amazed at what minor injuries people would bring into the hospital. We used to call them "GOMERS" which stood for "Get Out Of My ER".
Everyone should have a few days of medical training which gives them just enough common sense to be able to treat minor injuries and know when to evacuate to hospital.
...Everyone should have a few days of medical training ...
Agreed.
... which gives them just enough common sense ...
In my experience that's asking a lot.
I think if you ask most medics they'd rather have the triage nurse put you in the queue at A&E than have to admit someone suffering from the results of poor treatment to what would otherwise have been a minor injury.
Thanks for the comments on types of gel and what to do in the absence of a tap.
In following the link about the new regs I ended up on the St John's Ambulance site and their advice page http://www.sja.org.uk/sja/first-aid-advice/effects-of-heat-and-cold/burns-and-scalds.aspx says
"Start cooling the burn immediately under running water for at least 10 minutes" ie no mention of gels etc
BUT in their shop http://www.stjohnsupplies.co.uk/ they sell:
"Burnblott
Instant relief for minor burns and scalds.
This is far more effective than cold water and can be used on burns, scalds and sunburn. The sachet of burn gel moisturises, cools and soothes the burn, minimising the trauma and helping prevent infection.Size: 3.5ml (1/8 oz)"
and costs 54p per sachet (don't get too excited the P&P are horrendous). And they also sell:
"Burnshield burn dressings
Sterile trauma burn dressings. Easy to apply. Individually packaged. Open cell foam dressing impregnated with hydrogel.
PK10 Instant relief for minor burns and scalds.
This is far more effective than cold water and can be used on burns, scalds and sunburn. The sachet of burn gel moisturises, cools and soothes the burn, minimising the trauma and helping prevent infection.
Size: 3.5ml (1/8 oz)" £4.80 for a pack of 10
and .....
"Burnshield dressings
Burnshield dressings come in three different sizes and each contain the specially formulated Hydrogel which is non toxic and non irritant. The dressings have the tremendous ability to absorb and dissipate heat from the burn,providing relief, minimising shock and skin damage, halting the burn process and physically protecting against further contamination.Suitable for finger burns
Suitable for:
EMS
Fire
NHS
Industry and retail.
Material: Open cell foam designed to hold gel in place and allow for heat dissipation.
Active: Impregnated with Burnshield Hydrogel.
Application: Dress the majority of most common burn areas."
Price:£2.70 for 10cm x 10cm or £8.10 for 20cm x 20cm
I guess these are equivalent to TBL''s Sterikool.
To me these products look like the sort of thing that could form part of a FAK for us. Main problem seems to be that the P&P charges are prohibitive - £10 for both St John's Ambulance and the sterikool people so far as I can tell.
The ebay sites have both the gel and the dressings in various quantities and sizes.
These are just the first ones I came across. No connection with any of the sellers.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Burnshield-Burn-Gel-Dressing-10cm-x-10cm-First-Aid-/400235546311?pt=UK_BOI_Medical _Lab_Equipment_Medical_Supplie s_Disposables_ET&hash=item5d2fe5c6c7
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Reliburn-Burn-Gel-Relief-Scalds-Burns-First-Aid-/180680350726?pt=UK_BOI_Medical _Lab_Equipment_Medical_Supplie s_Disposables_ET&var=&hash=item6fc3f2a2b3
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BURNS-FIRST-AID-KIT-GRAB-BAG-BURNS-GEL-/220828386187?pt=UK_Health_Beau ty_First_Aid_ET&hash=item336a65c38b
cheers,
Toddy
Thanks Toddy - they look miuch better value
Scots_Charles_River
05-10-2011, 18:24
I'm on a first aid course next thursday/friday, nice way to end the school term, and will see what the latest thinking on burns is.
Great provider, did work for BASP originally.
http://www.outwardlymobile.com/emergaidod.htm
Nick
BUT in their shop http://www.stjohnsupplies.co.uk/ they sell:
"Burnblott
Instant relief for minor burns and scalds.
They are trying to make money. Companies will tell you anything to sell you their crap. You are absolutely correct. Run tap water over your burn for 20 minutes. Then cover with cling film. I like to put honey between the cling film and the burn.
But first aid suppliers can't really make any money if you use honey for your burns.
Scots_Charles_River
05-10-2011, 19:53
They could sell 'honey coated coolpacks' !