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daved
24-08-2005, 12:20
The "normal" daily energy needs for an adult is supposed to be 2000 - 2500 kCalories and higher if you are doing strenuous exercise (I remember reading "Mind over matter" and being astonished at how many calories they were using).

What would this equate to in terms of wild foods? Anybody go any idea of the nutritional content of things you can forage? How many nettles, mushrooms, chestnuts etc would you have to eat to get to the right level?

To give some guidance, I had a look on a loaf of bread (it's lunchtime ;) ) and 2 slices (100g) of wholemeal bread is about 230 calories and according to a packet of Smash, 100g of potato is 60 calories (surprisingly low I thought).

Anybody know if there is a good source for this type of information? Alternatively, are there any scientists/teachers out there with access to a calorimeter who fancies an experiment?

Curious to see just how much you would need to gather to maintain a "normal" diet.

Dave

Toddy
24-08-2005, 13:05
The "normal" daily energy needs for an adult is supposed to be 2000 - 2500 kCalories and higher if you are doing strenuous exercise (I remember reading "Mind over matter" and being astonished at how many calories they were using).

What would this equate to in terms of wild foods? Anybody go any idea of the nutritional content of things you can forage? How many nettles, mushrooms, chestnuts etc would you have to eat to get to the right level?

To give some guidance, I had a look on a loaf of bread (it's lunchtime ;) ) and 2 slices (100g) of wholemeal bread is about 230 calories and according to a packet of Smash, 100g of potato is 60 calories (surprisingly low I thought).

Anybody know if there is a good source for this type of information? Alternatively, are there any scientists/teachers out there with access to a calorimeter who fancies an experiment?

Curious to see just how much you would need to gather to maintain a "normal" diet.

Dave

http://www.diet-i.com/calorie_chart/index.htm

Seems I have a survivors metabolism, any more than 1000 kcalories a day and I'm fat :( On the other hand, so long as I have sufficient water I can survive comfortably on my own reserves for a while :) .

Cheers,
Toddy

daved
24-08-2005, 14:56

http://www.diet-i.com/calorie_chart/index.htm

Seems I have a survivors metabolism, any more than 1000 calories a day and I'm fat :( On the other hand, so long as I have sufficient water I can survive comfortably on my own reserves for a while :) .

Cheers,
Toddy

1000 Calories!!! Blimey, you're a cheap date!

I was listening to an interview on radio4 with some people who had been in a japanese internment camp during the war. They said that the daily rations were as low as 300 calories - amazing what bodies can cope with.

I guess the information on the website you suggested could be used to estimate values for wild foods by finding the nearest equivalent - I don't suppose there is that much variation amongst mushrooms species for instance. Unfortunately, things like burdock root and pignuts don't usually feature in weight-watcher style diets (just special cakes and biscuits) so its hard to pick up information on those sites.

What I am interested to find out is how wild foods compare with domestic ones and what the implications are - for example, do you need to gather twice the amount? Three times?

Having said all that, I think I am probably jumping the gun a bit as I wouldn't really know how many common vegetables you would need to hit the calorie targets - back to your website I think.

Dave

andyn
24-08-2005, 15:02
To be honest, I don't monitor my calorie intake that much and just eat until it "fills the hole"..normally just snacking on small (but proper food) throughout the day followed by a small evening meal.

So i'd be more interested in knowing how much would i need to find in order to constiture for a healthy meal....you know the "5 a day" saying. Well how many blackberries is a portion of fruit?

What quantities of food do other people end up eating when they are out roughing it?

21-09-2005, 07:19
The "normal" daily energy needs for an adult is supposed to be 2000 - 2500 kCalories and higher if you are doing strenuous exercise (I remember reading "Mind over matter" and being astonished at how many calories they were using).

What would this equate to in terms of wild foods? Anybody go any idea of the nutritional content of things you can forage? How many nettles, mushrooms, chestnuts etc would you have to eat to get to the right level?

To give some guidance, I had a look on a loaf of bread (it's lunchtime ;) ) and 2 slices (100g) of wholemeal bread is about 230 calories and according to a packet of Smash, 100g of potato is 60 calories (surprisingly low I thought).

Anybody know if there is a good source for this type of information? Alternatively, are there any scientists/teachers out there with access to a calorimeter who fancies an experiment?

Curious to see just how much you would need to gather to maintain a "normal" diet.

Dave
______________________________ ______________________________ _____
THE NUTRITIONAL COMPOSITION OF WILD FOOD PLANTS (PER 100 GRAMS)

Alfalfa, or Lucerne (Medicago sativa) - 52 (calories)
Amaranth, or Pigweed (Amaranthus spp.) - 42
Arrowhead, or Duck Potatoes (Sagittaria spp.) - 107
Asparagus (Asparagus officinalis) - 20
Bamboo (Bambusa spp.) - 27
Beechnut, American (Fagus grandifolia) - 568
Beggarticks (Bidens bipinnata) - 33
Blackberry (Rubus spp.) - 58
Blueberry (Vaccinium spp.) - 62
Burdock, Great (Arctium lappa) - 89
Butternut (Juglans cinerea) - 629
Cherry, Sour Red (Prunus cerasus) - 58
Cherry, Sweet (P. avium) - 48
Chestnut (Castanea spp.) - 194
Chicory (Cichorium intybus) - 20
Chives (Allium schoenoprasum) - 27
Chufa, or Yellow Nut Grass (Cyperus esculentus) - 311
Crabapple (Pyrus spp.) - 68
Cranberry, Large (Vaccinium macrocarpon) - 46
Dandelion (Taraxacum officinale) - 45
Dayflower (Commelina spp.) - 43
Day Lily (Hemerocallis fulva) - 42
Dock (Rumex spp.) - 28
Dock, Curled (Rumex crispus) - 21
Duckweed (Lemna spp.) - 18
Elderberry, Common (Sambucus canadensis) - 72
Fennel (Foeniculum vulgare) - 31
Filbert, or Hazelnut (Corylus americana) - 634
Galinsoga, or Quick Weed (Galinsoga parviflora) - 42
Garlic (Allium spp.) - 137
Grape, Concord (Vitis spp.) - 69
Ground-Cherry, or Husk-Tomato (Physalis spp.) - 40
Hickory (nuts) (Carya spp.) - 673
Honewort, or Wild Chervil (Cryptotaenia spp.) - 18
Horsetail, Common (Equisetum tuberosus) - 20
Jerusalem Artichoke (Helianthus tuberosus) - 77
Knotweed (Polygonum spp.) - 64
Kudzu (roots) (Pueraria lobata) - 113
Lamb's Quarters, or Pigweed (Chenopodium album) - 43
Leek, or Ramp (bulbs) (Allium spp.) - 52
Mallow (Malva spp.) - 37
Mallow, High (Malva sylvestris) - 28
Maple (sugar) (Acer saccharum) -348
Mexican Tea (Chenopodium ambrosioides) - 42
Milkweed (Asclepias syriaca) - -
Mint (Mentha spp.) -32
Mugwort, Common (Artemisia vulgaris) - 35
Mulberry, White (Morus alba) - 53
Mustard (greens) (Brassica spp.) - 23
Nettle, Stinging (Urtica dioica) - 65
Oak (acorns) (Quercus spp.) - 48
Pawpaw (Asimina triloba) - 85
Pecan (Carya illinoensis) - 610
Peppergrass (Lepidum spp.) - 32
Persimmon (Diospyros virginiana) - 127
Prickly Pear (Opuntia humifusa) - 42
Primrose-Willow (Jussiaea spp.) - 41
Purslane (Portulaca oleracea) - 21
Rape, or Field Mustard (Brassica rapa) - 32
Raspberry, Black (Rubus occidentalis) - 57
Raspberry, Red (Rubus idaeus) - 73
Rice, Wild (Zizania aquatica) - 353
Sheep Sorrel (Rumex acetosella) - 77
Shepherd's Purse (Capsella bursa-pastoris) - 33
Sow Thistle, Common (Sonchus oleraceus) - 20
Soybean (Glycine max) - 400
Storksbill, or Alfilaria (Erodium cicutarium) - -
Strawberry, Wild (Fragaria spp.) - 37
Sunflower (seed) (Helianthus annuus) - 560
Vegetable Oyster, or Salsify (Tragopogon porrifolius) - 89
Violet (leaves) (Viola spp.) - -
Walnut, Black (Juglans nigra) - 628
Watercress (Nasturtium officinale) - 19
Water Hyacinth (Eichhornia crassipes) - 30
Water Primrose (Jussiaea repens) - 43
Water Shield (Brassenia schreberi) - 10
Wood Sorrel (Oxalis spp.) - -
Yucca (flowers) (Yucca aloifolia) - 33

Hope this helps,

:) Doc :)

Toddy
21-09-2005, 08:02
Oh excellent :) Thank you.
Cheers,
Toddy

daved
22-09-2005, 14:28
Useful information there, Doc-canada. Thanks. That covers a lot of the foods.
Where did you get your figures?

Interesting to see the figure for chestnuts. I've just come back from a trip to Northern Italy where the whole hillside was covered with chestnut trees - no problem gathering your kilo of nuts there. Quite a lot of chewing to get your daily calories though. Saw an astonishing variety of funghi there too. Unfortunately my only positive ID was fly agaric (and porcini, but that in a restaurant ;) )

Abbe Osram
22-09-2005, 15:12
Hi Guys,
I had a look at the swedish survival handbook, it states:

Sleeping 70 kcal/ per hour
Marching 4km/hour flat ground 240 kcal/ per hour
Marching with bagpack27 kg 4km/hour easy terrain 545 kcal/per hour
Heavy march/ heavy work 700 kcal per hour
Easy work 2500 kcal per day
Normal army work being in the woods 4400 kcal per day
Stationary survival situation first day 4500 kcal per day
Stationary survival situation second day 3000 kcal per day
7 days survival winter training with minus 30 to minus 40 cold 6000 kcal per day

what I found the most challanging thing up here is to gather the Carbohydrates
one needs about 500 kcal per day, one would need to eat about 20 to 30 roots of the dandelion to manage that.

cheers
Abbe

Abbe Osram
22-09-2005, 15:39
If you trawl through the following you'll find a nutritional breakdown of a few wild foods:

http://www.weightlossforgood.co.uk/nutrition/nutrition.htm

thats a cool list mate
thanks
Abbe

ilovemybed
22-09-2005, 15:49
Dunno if I'm teaching y'all to suck eggs but I thought its worth clarifying:

1 Calorie = 1000 calories = 1kcal

daved
22-09-2005, 16:18
Yep, we are talking in terms of kCals (at least I hope we all are.)
Good to point that out though to avoid any confusion.

Stuart
22-09-2005, 17:26
does anyone know where I can find a nutritional chart for wild animals?

redcollective
22-09-2005, 17:52
Try here:

http://www.fao.org/documents/show_cdr.asp?url_file=/docrep/w7540e/w7540e07.htm

for african animals.

this next one has some interesting comparison with domestic meats but alas the context is again, african:

A search of scholar.google.com reveals a load of information but there's so much detail and most of the studies are very specific, looking at proteins and faty acid (at that point my brain tuned out).

Isn't squirrel in the Atkins book?
:D

just found this:

http://www.nutritiondata.com/index.html

in the drop down box on the right select lamb, veal and game and then press search - it's anabsolutely huge list from muskrat to moose. enjoy.

Abbe Osram
22-09-2005, 18:23
Try here:

http://www.fao.org/documents/show_cdr.asp?url_file=/docrep/w7540e/w7540e07.htm

for african animals.

this next one has some interesting comparison with domestic meats but alas the context is again, african:

A search of scholar.google.com reveals a load of information but there's so much detail and most of the studies are very specific, looking at proteins and faty acid (at that point my brain tuned out).

Isn't squirrel in the Atkins book?
:D

just found this:

http://www.nutritiondata.com/index.html

in the drop down box on the right select lamb, veal and game and then press search - it's anabsolutely huge list from muskrat to moose. enjoy.

the nutritiondata link is amazing brother, thanks a lot.
I didnt think that such a thing exist.

thanks!!!
Abbe

Stuart
23-09-2005, 09:22
just found this:

http://www.nutritiondata.com/index.html

in the drop down box on the right select lamb, veal and game and then press search - it's anabsolutely huge list from muskrat to moose. enjoy.

perfect thats exactly what I was looking for, Thanks :D

R-J
23-09-2005, 09:49
in the drop down box on the right select lamb, veal and game and then press search - it's anabsolutely huge list from muskrat to moose. enjoy.

didnt know`such a site existed! thanks for hte heads up :)

philaw
08-11-2005, 11:03
Does everyone know the basics for working out how many calories are in something? It's 4 Calories per gram each for carbohydrates, protein and alcohol and 9 grams for fat. You can guesstimate a lot just with that. For example: a tin of beer that's 550ml and 4% alcohol has 22ml of alcohol, which is 22g and 88 Calories. Add on some more for the carboydrates in the cereals used to make it and you'll arrive at a figure of about 150 Calories, if my maths is right. If anyone has a tin handy they can check it and let us know.

If anyone here is knowledgable on this stuff maybe they could give us some good shorthand ways of estimating this stuff. What abbe found in the swedish army survival manual was very good.