View Full Version : Puukko Knife Video
Mikey-Baby
10-05-2005, 21:26
Hi ive just got myself a lapp puukko knife and i was searching the forums for peoples reviews etc (i decided to get one after the review on the main page) but the search mainly found things about a video of one being hammered into a tree and so forth. I was just wondering if anyone could re-post the video or E-mail it me because all the old links dont seem to work. Cheers Mikey :)
giancarlo
11-05-2005, 00:43
For server space / bandwidth issues, I think the video was hosted somewhere else originally...
Now we have this big fast server we can put it on here, no problems.... just where is it? ;)
Hmmm... Tone?
I have the videos if any one wants them pm me your email address and I will email them to you - they are 4mb each.
Cheers
JFW
OldJimbo
04-06-2005, 20:54
I found copies of these while looking for other stuff.
The played with mplayer plugin on firefox with no problems streaming. You might have to right mouse click and download..
If there's any problem with putting them up will people please let me know.
hammering (http://oldjimbo.com/pics/pukkohammering.avi)
standing (http://oldjimbo.com/pics/pukkostandingon.avi)
Jimbo,
That's very freaky! I was just talking about this video on Knifeforums.
Thanks!
Hmmm, hammering a knife into a tree. Is it just me or do more people fail to see the bushcraft in that?
the test comes from a book by Mr *insert name I can't spell here*
He says that a bushcraft knife should be strong enough for you to hammer it 4cm into a tree and then stand on it. Since a lot of people are concerned about the strength of a stick tang some people here decided to put one to the test.
Mr *insert name I can't spell here*
Mors Kochanski
rapidboy
04-06-2005, 23:46
They will be punching it through a car door next. :rolleyes:
Don't forget chopping up breeze blocks....
Greenpete
05-06-2005, 00:34
Hmmm, hammering a knife into a tree. Is it just me or do more people fail to see the bushcraft in that?
I'm with you on that one! I think a lot of people are missing the point here!
I thought it was all about living 'with' nature, not just having fun at its expense!
pete
Greenpete
05-06-2005, 00:36
the test comes from a book by Mr *insert name I can't spell here*
He says that a bush craft knife should be strong enough for you to hammer it 4cm into a tree and then stand on it. Since a lot of people are concerned about the strength of a stick tang some people here decided to put one to the test.
That sounds like a survival sort of an angle rather than a bush craft one?
Pete
OldJimbo
05-06-2005, 05:31
Mors is probably one of the oldest and most accomplished bushcrafters and primitive skills people around, It was the fact that he only uses a Mora that made people curious about his statement about knives. That and the fact that most people didn't believe that a stick tang really is strong enough to take that.
I can certainly remove the links here if people are offended... You have to be understanding of where I live and that I spend a lot of time clearing trails. So it simply never occurred to me that people would be upset.
OldJimbo, don't worry about it, those that aren’t interested shouldn't bother watching it.
The tree was going to be cut down and the knife's strength was in question from those that use full tang knives....it answered some questions for a lot of people.
This is now two years old and all this conversation has gone on before, it’s interesting to some and not to others….
bothyman
05-06-2005, 08:20
I thought it was all about living 'with' nature, not just having fun at its expense!
pete
Hello Pete.
I'm with you on that one.
Maybe we need another section called "The good old ways" or something. :rolleyes:
Why would someone want to hammer a knife into a tree, what has the Tree done to deserve that?? or that knife for that matter??
Greenpete
05-06-2005, 14:22
Hello Pete.
I'm with you on that one.
Maybe we need another section called "The good old ways" or something. :rolleyes:
Why would someone want to hammer a knife into a tree, what has the Tree done to deserve that?? or that knife for that matter??
Hi Mick!
I like that ! Though it reminds me of a quote a friend of mine used to give every time someone said 'the good old days' "Ah! The good old days of rickets and scurvy!" He would say! Prompting the question, were they as good as we like to think?
I would like a way to see the difference between the people that really want to live on an every day basis as 'close to nature' as they can and those that find that unrealistic and can only really do it at weekends though.
Does that sound elitist? I hope not!
Pete
I am not sure I understand the objection some people have to the video.
Every new product has to be tested to the point of failure to determine where its weaknesses lay. It's called destruction testing and is industry standard no matter what you are manufacturing. (Why do we have crash tests for cars??)
Every so often the test needs to be repeated with one product selected at random from stock to ensure that the quality control is doing its job. Knife makers routinely snap one of there blades in a vise to check the grain structure.
In this video we were attempting to test the suitablity of the knife for bushcraft after mainy people had aired the view that a stick tang was not strong enough for bushcraft.
As there is no industry standard test for bushcraft we found the next best thing, a description in the book 'Northern Bushcraft' By Mors Kochanski which says:
"As a test of strength, a good knife should not break when driven 4cm into a standing tree at right angles to the grain, and the handle bears your weight as you stand on it."
If you are manufacturing or reviewing a product which people may later come to depend on it is your responsiblity to ensure that it will not fail them even when put to unreasonable use.
As for the damage to the tree in the video, we specifically chose a tree in Dorset that was about to be cut down with a chainsaw for coppicing.
The video proved as best we could that it was unreasonable to argue that a well made stick tang knife could not be suitable for bushcraft.
If such tests were not undertaken then manufacturers would not know what problems needed to be resolved with their products and quality could not be ensured to the customer.
Greenpete
05-06-2005, 14:55
I am not sure I understand the objection some people have to the video.
Every new product has to be tested to the point of failure to determine where its weaknesses lay. It's called destruction testing and is industry standard no matter what you are manufacturing. (Why do we have crash tests for cars??)
Every so often the test needs to be repeated with one product selected at random from stock to ensure that the quality control is doing its job. Knife makers routinely snap one of there blades in a vise to check the grain structure.
In this video we were attempting to test the suitablity of the knife for bushcraft after mainy people had aired the view that a stick tang was not strong enough for bushcraft.
As there is no industry standard test for bushcraft we found the next best thing, a description in the book 'Northern Bushcraft' By Mors Kochanski which says:
"As a test of strength, a good knife should not break when driven 4cm into a standing tree at right angles to the grain, and the handle bears your weight as you stand on it."
If you are manufacturing or reviewing a product which people may later come to depend on it is your responsibility to ensure that it will not fail them even when put to unreasonable use.
As for the damage to the tree in the video, we specifically chose a tree in Dorset that was about to be cut down with a chainsaw for coppicing.
The video proved as best we could that it was unreasonable to argue that a well made stick tang knife could not be suitable for bushcraft.
If such tests were not undertaken then manufacturers would not know what problems needed to be resolved with their products and quality could not be ensured to the customer.
Mmmm.... I see your point. It can come over as a bit gung hoe though! I think I can safely say that I wouldn't use my knife to do such a thing (unless absolutely desperate in which case you might be prepared to sacrifice your knife) but I still know that it is a good knife well up to the job it's intended for.
I must also admit that I haven't seen the video. :( So maybe I should wind my neck in?!
Pete ;)
bothyman
05-06-2005, 14:57
Hi Mick!
"Ah! The good old days of rickets and scurvy!"
I would like a way to see the difference between the people that really want to live on an every day basis as 'close to nature' as they can and those that find that unrealistic and can only really do it at weekends though.
Pete
Hello Pete
Ooh, I never got rickets and scurvy what was it like?? :confused:
The answer to the second one is "We each choose our own reality"
Some People want a nice house and a shiny 4x4 , then want to try and escape from it for the weekend, that is the way they see their reality.
Don't you wish you were "Domesticated" too ;)
Pete,
You do make a fair point if it was being done just for fun, without choosing a tree that was about to be removed anyway.
In this context, it's an acceptable thing to do, in my opinion.
bothyman
05-06-2005, 15:08
Pete,
You do make a fair point if it was being done just for fun, without choosing a tree that was about to be removed anyway.
In this context, it's an acceptable thing to do, in my opinion.
Stew
I think it would have been easier to stick the blade in a vice , put a piece of pipe on the end and swing on it, it would have had much the same effect.
It would either bend or break which is the same answer as I think they were looking for.
Stew
I think it would have been easier to stick the blade in a vice , put a piece of pipe on the end and swing on it, it would have had much the same effect.
It would either bend or break which is the same answer as I think they were looking for.
Fair point.
OldJimbo
05-06-2005, 17:57
I would like a way to see the difference between the people that really want to live on an every day basis as 'close to nature' as they can and those that find that unrealistic and can only really do it at weekends though.
Does that sound elitist? I hope not!
Most of us have to work for a living. Anyway I had to put off my retirement and sell my land in order to raise grand-kids. Soon my time comes though and I'll be most of my time in the outdoors.
Some people dream of the outdoors because they're running away from something in their lives, and that of course never works out. For some of us, though, what we want is there. Most of my hobbies involve the outdoors in some way - and that's why I live where I do. That die was cast long ago when I got my degrees in geology and zoology.
But anyway - ask away. You may not want to, because for me, living the outdoors involves things like cutting trees, hunting and fishing. Pretty old fashioned stuff! At the same time I'd ask you to consider your global footprint. It may well be that you consume far more of this earth's resources than I do with the way I do things.
If I'm geting a little off-topic, please pardon me. It seems to me that the impacts we have on the wild areas vary significantly depending on the region. In Jimbo's case, he lives in a very lush, fertile, wet climate. Downed trees, tree stumps, impacts by man do not last a long time. Where I live (Front Range of the Rocky Mountains), it is much drier, more sparsely vegetated and less fertile. Stumps are still visible from trees cut 80 years ago (to try and stop a forest fire). Roads are not overgrown nearly as fast. Structures last longer. The impacts of man do not vanish overnight. I'd feel a lot better about cutting trees in B.C. than my area. I practice "leave no trace" in Colorado.
Steve
OldJimbo
05-06-2005, 22:56
Now that's a good point that you've brought up, Steve.
Blimey gents.
Lets all get a grip here. This knife was driven into a trunk of an overstood hazel stool. This piece of woodland was in my charge and have been managing it for many years and this acre was due for coppicing the following month, this particular rack of hazel was last coppiced in the early 60's.
I think the lack of understanding demonstrated by the 'concern for the tree' is slightly misguided. It would be interesting to see how many people in the 'concerned' camp make sure that the charcoal that they use is made in this country and do they make sure that all of their wood products in their houses come from the UK.
The point being, by buying wood products from abroad we are looking after other peoples woodlands at the expense of our own. The guys responsible for that video have done more to promote the understanding of our woodlands than most people I know.
Think we all should remember to look at the bigger picture here.
Jack.
Well put Jack, I was thinking there was a lot of fuss about this when none was required.
Keep up the good work Jack.
Cheers
JFW
rapidboy
07-06-2005, 10:45
The guys responsible for that video have done more to promote the understanding of our woodlands than most people I know.
Think we all should remember to look at the bigger picture here.
Jack.
Well said ,i actually found the video very interesting.
rb
Jack - what I really want to know is...
Did you ever manage to get the knife out? :)
Jack - what I really want to know is...
Did you ever manage to get the knife out? :)
Hi Marts.
Yes we did, just knocked the knive from side to side and worked it back of the hazel and Roving Rich rehandled it!
......................come to think of it, I have never seen it since.................Rich?
I think it would have been easier to stick the blade in a vice , put a piece of pipe on the end and swing on it, it would have had much the same effect.
well surprisingly no. the other side of the test as i remember, was partly to validate the test itself. as already pointed out, mors kochanski is a well respected long time bushcrafter, why would he have need of, or suggest such a test. it's much more complicated and subtil than you'd think.
you can get big burly survival knives that will easily support a big guy's weight. but try hammering one 4cms into a tree at ninety degrees to the grain. it's almost impossible.
perhaps this test defines the optimum compromise between a rough tough prybar style knife and a slender razor sharp slicer eh? ;) :cool:
cheers, and.