docken grub

[grip]

when i was a kid we used large white grubs found living under the roots of docks .As i remember they were deadly bait for trout.I wonder if anyone else used these and do they know what these grubs turned into in their final life stage .Cheers grip

[Toddy]

Were they sort of wrinkled/ concertina style ? and not white white but kind of dirty creamy white ?
If so they're crane fly larvae.

cheers,
Toddy

[locum76]

One of the lads at the farm was telling me about using these bugs for trout fishing just today. He reckons they ace worms.

[grip]

yes your description of them is spot on thanks for clearing up a 30 year mystery.It never fails to amaze me what a diverse and talented bunch of people post on here thanks again Toddy. atb grip

[Cledan99]

There is also a "fly" version that we use, called an okey dokey
Simple to tie and can be deadly

[johnnytheboy]

I had an old book, clear water trout fishing or something along those lines, it went on about them. But no matter how many dockys i dug up I never found any!!!

[Toddy]

Try in the lawn under the daisies and buttercups. They're root eaters, mostly survive on grass, but they seem to like the small sweet side shoots of the dockens. They don't do well in bone dry conditions and dock roots go deep for moisture.

cheers,
M

[pango]

Were they sort of wrinkled/ concertina style ? and not white white but kind of dirty creamy white ?
If so they're crane fly larvae.

cheers,
Toddy

Cranefly larvae makes sense, Toddy. There has always been the myth that they're Stag Beetle larvae but I always thought that to be nonsense. For one thing, I've never seen a Stag Beetle anywhere in Scotland! What is a surprise to me is the realisation that I've never sought to identify them!

I've used Docken Grubs since I was a boy and yes, they are deadly for trout, sea trout and salmon, although something of a nuisance to keep on the hook, easily pinched off and short lived as a bait.

They're very difficult to find in dry summer conditions and I believe they're most common under Tansies which tend to proliferate on recovering industrial landscapes.

There is an issue here though, that the devastation I've seen caused by anglers ripping Dockens and Tansies out by the roots is unacceptable to me, and a full day's fishing using only Docken grubs requires a substantial number. I no longer use them!

I have set out with the intentions of heeling the plants back in and giving them a drink but it doesn't do much good... they say "The road to hell is lined with good intentions."

[JonathanD]

Stag beetle larvae are big critters and live in rotting logs and decaying wood.

http://bugguide.net/images/raw/HQBRZQJRKQOR0QZ00QORYK1RLQJQ40 3QG000U0FQ70DQ50FQHQ9R403Q3KTQ I0TQ80DQJKYQ50JQ.jpg

Crane fly larvae are also known as leatherjackets and quite alot smaller.

http://www.news.cornell.edu/stories/Aug05/crane.fly.larvae.jpghttp://swittersb.files.wordpress.com/2009/06/crane_fly2.jpg

The only other white larvae I know that are root eaters are cockchafer larvae.

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/122/372362225_2e92ee5a6f.jpg

[pango]

That's the guy, Jonathan! The cockchafer larvae.

I'm feeling a wee bit sheepish here, as I once prided myself in my knowledge of entomology as relevant to a fly-fisherman, and although concerned mainly with larvae, nymph and adult "forms", I'm somewhat shocked to discover that I never bothered to identify a familiar grub.

I did know that the leatherjacket is the cranefly larvae... after you reminded me! I've never caught a fish on one and have always suspected they exude some defensive chemical.

[JonathanD]

Cockchafer larvae is very similar to Stag beetle larvae, just smaller, which is probably where some people get mixed up. No idea about leatherjackets exuding foul chemicals, birds love them.

[QDanT]

No idea about leatherjackets exuding foul chemicals, birds love them.
There was quite a few brown empty skins (hatched ?) about on the moor and does this look to be feeding it's young with a leatherjacket ?
http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j274/QDanT/feedingbig.jpg
from Link (http://www.bushcraftuk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=58589)
cheers Danny

[JonathanD]

There was quite a few brown empty skins (hatched ?) about on the moor and does this look to be feeding it's young with a leatherjacket ?
http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j274/QDanT/feedingbig.jpg
from Link (http://www.bushcraftuk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=58589)
cheers Danny

Yeah, I think you are right there, it does very much look like it.