View Full Version : Alice packs
any good?
I have one but no frame or straps
wondering if it was worth getting the extras for?
Some info in these old threads....
http://www.bushcraftuk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=45780&highlight=Alice+pack
http://www.bushcraftuk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41688
Bon chance
nolightweight
22-02-2010, 23:38
It's a love/hate thing. Seem to be very popular Stateside which seeing as they can get this gear as cheap across the pond as we can get surplus PLCE kit over here isn't surprising.
I have one (medium with frame) from new and used it for the last few months at meets.
I like it a lot. I've just got a Lowe Alpine Sting which will suit me fine for the colder months and long hauls but Alice will be back in for the kinder seasons; either as a complete unit or just strapping kit to the frame.
I've got the enhanced kidney pad from Blackhawk and just waiting for the shoulder straps to become available. Aside from that I've left what isn't broken without fixing.
HTH Tengu.
keen-edge
23-02-2010, 00:11
I got this little baby in the post today:) its a large Alice pack these are brand new from strikeforce £46.00 posted with the frame i love it i also have a medium you can see in the pic the size difference:eek: the frame can be used with both packs and the medium can also be used with out the frame i love mine ;)
http://i989.photobucket.com/albums/af20/keen-edge/bushy040-1.jpg
http://i989.photobucket.com/albums/af20/keen-edge/bushy045.jpg
http://i989.photobucket.com/albums/af20/keen-edge/bushy043.jpg
Thanks fo the advice.
What does HTH mean, please?
Melonfish
23-02-2010, 09:30
Marmite for sure, you either love em or hate em. my medium makes a good cycle pack as it site high on the shoulders and i can get a fair amount of stuff in there.
Good packs, but definitely a marmite thing :D
Rabbitsmacker
23-02-2010, 12:13
i loved my medium one, with no frame, og green, didn't realise how much until it was gone. now have a large pack, have to have a frame for that one, very good also, use it for the fishing gear, mine came from 22's stores at hereford but nothing special about it apart from the sand in it!
i have to say, i do prefer the medium pack dimensions, and have thought about having a padded back fitted by a kit modder to make it a soft carry job, thought about having the snugpak rocket pak back and straps added.
they are bomb proof as you'd expect from military, they aren't waterproof though, we're talking jungle warfare/desert equipment here, drainage holes in the bottom and only the lid has a water proof backing on it which decays if abused.
someone said earlier a marmite thing, i love them, but be aware, they do creak with age and heavy loads.
i did get a GSbergen which is similar to the medium alice pack, doesn't take as much, and the fframe being steel and not ali as in the alice packs case weighs a tonne!
i'd give 'em a go. plenty of og ones available. fairly cheap. last forever. cult status.
launditch1
23-02-2010, 12:16
Anyone know where i could get a new frame and straps from?
Rabbitsmacker
23-02-2010, 15:22
when i was trying to get my hands on frame etc first time round, the hardest thing to get hold of was the lumber pad, i've seen all sorts of belts cobbled into use, but the genuine ones are more difficult to get hold of. shoulder straps come on the medium usually, but not on the large as the logic is you should already have them attached to the frame. or use your medium pack straps.
i think the australian army packs of the same design use identical or near identical parts so no need to limit your search for US stuff. also, if you want to pay a small fortune look at plat-a-tac combat packs, they do ALICE type stuff, or have it modified direct by searching under MALICE packs.
this link is to someone i have bought from before, very good service, often has US stuff, has this frame, all it would need is a paint if you want it pristine.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/US-Army-aluminium-LC-1-pack-frame_W0QQitemZ170449641284QQc mdZViewItemQQptZUK_Collectable s_Militaria_LE?hash=item27af97 1f44
Davey569
23-02-2010, 19:21
I have one. Its a medium in US woodland camo and I think its one of the best packs going. I must admit, I originally wanted one because its the pack John Locke uses in LOST :D but once I got one and started to watch reviews it is trully versatile, its lightweight, basic and tough as old boots. If you can get one for the right price, I would deffinately reccomend one. Infact Im after a second pack in OD if anyone has one. :) dont use the frame either pack it right and its comfortable as it is.
A counter point view.
I have some experience with a Large ALICE pack.
Large ALICE packs are horrendous to carry normal camping load weight in for a reasonable walking type day in my experience. For the cash there are far better packs/ rucsacks/ bergens on the market for a similar outlay and you don't have to sort out different straps back pads and modifications.
The Issue PLCE is better ( if you get the correct back length to suit you) for example. A secondhand : Vulcan, Sting, Roc,Saracen, Jaguar is light years ahead of the Large ALICE in every possible way...
It is tough (apart from the frame which pops rivets reasonably regularly) and does float well if you're swimming it across a river and it does drain quickly...
The NZ Army issued OG ALICE packs as standard ( which I had) then a DPM version and now Issues a modified version with massively improved shoulder straps ( ie padded and wide enough not to cut the blood flow off to your arms and with a decent adjusting buckle) and that modern implement of wonder the fastex buckle on the pockets and lid closure. It's also marginally waterproof.
Everyone involved with rucksack design and sales seems to agree that the best way to carry weight in a rucksack on your back is to share the load between your hips and shoulders and pretty much every Rucksack design for civilian use from the late 1970's onwards has adopted this convention with the use of a frame either external or pretty much exclusively these days internal and a substantial padded hipbelt with a mechanisim for adjustment and tightening said hip belt and pehaps a method of adjusting the back length. Rucksacks like the ALICE and SAS/PARA and GS Bergen were of course designed before such 'radical' thinking and are products of a military school of thought. So short frames minimal padding and no waistbelt.
Everyone I know who's used an SAS/PARA bergen modified it in some way to get it more comfortable from 1/2 a kipmat stuck down the back to extra straps pipe lagging on the frame, fitting a set of manpack straps from a MILAN etc etc.. ALICE is the same. The fact that such a large add on an modification market exists for the ALICE should tell you that the standard item is less than ideal. If it was good as standard the're be no need for all of the add on bits would there? It's utter cack when compared to a modern ( or anything made by Berghaus or Karrimor since about 1980) rucksack.
It's also interesting to note the the USMC now issues the ILBE pack which is based on a modern Arcteryx Design ( The Tango IIRC) to replace the ALICE.
I'm not a fan as you can tell.
keen-edge
24-02-2010, 10:50
:) I love mine :);)
nolightweight
24-02-2010, 11:31
I like mine too.
I know it's limitations, but it does what I want it to do...
....and does it very well :rolleyes:
Certainly not figuring on buying PLCE anytime soon. There's a lot of replacements and add ons for that as well...
Got a pack for light loads and short distance (Alice)
Got a pack for heavier loads and longer distance (Sting)
Job done :)
Davey569
24-02-2010, 11:44
I know it's limitations, but it does what I want it to do...
....and does it very well :rolleyes:
Entirely true. It is a great pack for summer use or long hikes when you need that bit extra kit.
Only thing that might make it slightly more comfortable is molle straps but the original ones do me just fine. :)
keen-edge
24-02-2010, 16:27
i have the medium and now a large and find them great if any one is interested i got my large Alice pack brand new with the frame from here it cost me £46.00 posted just ring them:) this is the site;)
http://www.strikeforcesupplies.co.uk/index.php?page=contact
bigjackbrass
24-02-2010, 18:50
And of course you can do this with them (http://www.instructables.com/id/Be-a-Ghostbuster-for-Halloween!/) :D
big_swede
24-02-2010, 19:49
How much do they weigh?
RAPPLEBY2000
24-02-2010, 21:21
How much do they weigh?
according to the US Army Manual : "FM 21-15 Care and use of individual equipment"
Frame, pack, including lower back, shoulder, and waist straps = 3.10 pounds (US)
FYI just the sack part:
pack medium = 2.46 pounds (US)
pack Large = 2.86 pounds (US)
the frame is aluminum, the harnesses are nylon with foam padding nothing really heavyweight compared to the older or British steel frames.
as usual some strong views about Military equipment....yawn....For me ALICE works very well I find it comfy enough and it's tough and highly adaptable.
horses for courses!
Phil6201
26-02-2010, 11:12
We have them issued at work I love them so much I went and spent about $600NZD on a Karrimor 60-100 so I never have to carry a damn ALICE pack again!
Never has such a bulky, awkward pack been designed that can hold so little.
Of course much of my issue with it comes from the fact that about 10 years ago I tore a disc in my lower back, right where the lumbar pad of an Alice pack transfers all the weight too.
I always love the retro-look of the ALICE packs. But they have a killer reputation.
I wonder hwo comfy they woud be without the metal frame?
Does anyone know the capacity of the different sizes - Small, medium, large (wasn't the small one a civilian thing?)
Davey569
26-02-2010, 15:00
I always love the retro-look of the ALICE packs. But they have a killer reputation.
I wonder hwo comfy they woud be without the metal frame?
Does anyone know the capacity of the different sizes - Small, medium, large (wasn't the small one a civilian thing?)
I dont use the frame with mine and its mega comfy if you pack it right, it moulds to the shape of your back. Its the medium one and Id guess it were about 40-45l :)
RAPPLEBY2000
26-02-2010, 15:57
It should be pointed out that most of the complaints about military equipment are from those in the military that were forced to carry huge loads.
civilian use of Military rucksacks is a different issue, we don;'t have to carry Ammunition, NBC gear, etc etc.
hi durulz,yes you are correct the U.S. military never issued a small ALICE rucksack only medium and large size...also no buttpack(bumpack)was ever issued as part of the ALICE web equipment set..i still use my medium or large ALICE ruck for camping all the time, but anymore just as a suit case from home to camp via my jeep:) ..vince g. 11binf
It should be pointed out that most of the complaints about military equipment are from those in the military that were forced to carry huge loads.
civilian use of Military rucksacks is a different issue, we don;'t have to carry Ammunition, NBC gear, etc etc.
My use of it was entirely as a civilian carrying a normal backpacking load of kit,
Sleeping bag,
Clothing,
Waterproofs,
Cooking kit,
Bivvy set up
A few days food etc
I figure a 15-20kg load however it was being carried for a good few hours per day in terrain like this....
http://i128.photobucket.com/albums/p200/johnsnz/DSCF0166.jpg
Davey569
27-02-2010, 15:35
Any pictures of you and the pack from the trip johnboy? :)
Any pictures of you and the pack from the trip johnboy? :)
Not that I know about..
Here's one of the pack itself from when it got sold on...
http://i128.photobucket.com/albums/p200/johnsnz/81965531_full.jpg
HTH
keen-edge
28-02-2010, 14:53
Hi i am looking for a alice pack kidney belt if any one as one kicking about:);)
nolightweight
28-02-2010, 15:00
If you aren't after an original one but want a comfortable pad:
http://www.nightgear.co.uk/p/1141/Blackhawk-Pads/BlackHawk-Pads-BlackHawk-Enhanced-Mail-ALICE-Ruck-Kidney-Pad-Olive-Drab.htm
Got one myself. Much better than the original.
HTH.
keen-edge
28-02-2010, 15:12
If you aren't after an original one but want a comfortable pad:
http://www.nightgear.co.uk/p/1141/Blackhawk-Pads/BlackHawk-Pads-BlackHawk-Enhanced-Mail-ALICE-Ruck-Kidney-Pad-Olive-Drab.htm
Got one myself. Much better than the original.
HTH.They look great buddy but at £36.00 it seems alot :eek::)just looking for a standard one for now thanks for the link though buddy ;)
nolightweight
28-02-2010, 15:15
No dramas mate :)
Hi i am looking for a alice pack kidney belt if any one as one kicking about:);)
Squires do some aftermarket ones...... postage to the UK might be expensive however
http://www.squires.co.nz/pages/bakery/alice-pack-straps43.php
keen-edge
28-02-2010, 21:49
Squires do some aftermarket ones...... postage to the UK might be expensive however
http://www.squires.co.nz/pages/bakery/alice-pack-straps43.php
Thanks for the link Johnboy ;)there must be some in the uk some were :);)