View Full Version : Should kit be subdued or bright?
Ok, ws just reading an old e-mail from a friend discussing the merits of colours for outdoor kit.
There are three schools of thought as far as I can ascertain:
Bright colours.
Subdued colours.
Military style.
The various arguments seem to be:
Bright colours are best as you can be seen in an emergency and when walkign along roads you can be seen easily. But you can't do anything at all stealthy like furtive wild camping or stalking.
Subdued colours are best as you can still be found but don't stand out like a cherry on the cake.
Military style colours are best as they blend you into the environment, but you can get mistaken for a survival nut, a paramilitary freak or likely to be asked to 'Just step this way please sir!'.
Views?
bambodoggy
19-01-2005, 18:06
Wups...I ticked the "blend me in baby" but I meant the "subdued" instead....can I change?
tenbears10
19-01-2005, 18:10
It all depends what for, if you are doing a bit of stalking to catch your supper then blending in is the way forward even if you look like you want to be in the sas. If you are hiking or winter climbing then standing out is very useful if you get stuck.
I suppose general bushcraft is best with subdued (which is why I ticked it)
Bill
I think, Jakunen, you summed up the arguements pretty well.
Personal preference is subdued with a hi-vis vest in the pack. Weighs next to nothing, cost couple of quid from the market and dissapears into any nook in your bag. I wear one over the rucksack when walking along roads, 'coz sometimes I want to be seen. :drive: :yikes:
Does check count as bright or subdued? Bright colours, but dissappears into the bush surprisingly quickly.
I'll justadjust the results unless a Mod can swap your choice??
Subdued, i don't want to look all camo, but i don't like bright colours on me anyway...
I think it depends on what you are up to, and what kit you are applying the rules to.
If I am out in the woods, I will no doubt be wearing something subdued.
Somewhere in the pack will be a high viz vest - which weighs next to nothing, but can always be put on if I have to travel down a section of road or make sure that I am noticed.
I tend to carry an emergency whistle, which is brightly coloured. If I need it, I expect that I will be in some stage of panic, and dont want to drop it on the floor and not be able to see it.
If I am putting on an event, the need for having some high viz kit to hand is more important and forms part of the emergency plan. The same if I am well off the beaten track, as it could be used by me, or left on or near a casualty in the even of me having to leave someone and go for help.
I would tend to steer away from an all forces look, as sometimes it gives out the wrong message.
Ok, maybe I should clear up my thinking here a little...
Clothing manufacturers tend to go through phases where they have a propensity to ONLY make and sell jackets in lurid green and orange (and yes I think it was Berghaus who decided on that particular colour scheme some years ago), so that you don't have any choice in the matter. You buy what they decided and didn't get a choice like say Jack Wolfskin does for a lot of their jackets.
Should we be dictated too by the suppliers or should they be more in touch with the needs of the bloke who ends up having to look like kids sweet and ask us for our input in deciding what we'd actually like to be able to buy?
arctic hobo
19-01-2005, 18:24
I'm not a bright colours man, I hate to stand out in the mountains. As a best of both of the other two, you could have clothes like the Fjellduken (www.jerven.no), which are very much camoflaged but certainly not Rambo-esque
tenbears10
19-01-2005, 18:26
Ahh well now you are talking. Why don't more suppliers make equipment and outdoor cloting in general in green and brown? Go to Blacks on the weekend (as an example) and I bet you will find one green or brown jacket in the whole shop if at all.
Yet look how popular karrimor sabres are and Narrona recon jackets are almost unique outside army surplus. When a supplier does do subdued colours they charge extra for it.
Subdued for me. I carry one of those flashing LED bike lights to pop on my pack for road walking but I really should get one of those vests.
I like subdued not only to blend in for wildlife watching/stalking but so I don't intrude on others enjoyment of stunning views. It annoys the heck out of me to look out on a beautiful landscape and see lots of bright red and yellow blobs of other outdoor users.
Celtic Dragon
19-01-2005, 19:15
I have to admit here I am a supporter of the subdued colours and the blend me in camps. If I'm out and about, I don't want to be seen easily, most of my kit is ex-military and used for shooting as well as bushcraft so the green, brown and blacks work well for me. But out of choice, I will buy brown, green and black kit, and yes, I do object violently to paying extra for it. But at the end of the day its not everyones taste, and they will buy what is.
Jak as you know I am very much a subdued clothing character, I do know one of the reasons for bright outdoor clothing is normally claimed as a safety aspect and as such I can appreciate it, but I still don't appreciate the extra cost of buying anything that is subdued of nature. :o):
A quick observation regarding the blend versus vivid options, it should be noted that this is dependent on perpective. Whilst we see a varied colour range, herbivores are generally seeing stuff in shades of grey and carnivores in shades of green.
Thus it is more down to the pattern whether or not you stand out of the background when viewed by an animal. My trousers (http://www.notquite.free-online.co.uk/Vince%20skins%20rabbit_web.JPG ) for example are plain to the human eye [good for rescue if needed] but probably register about the same as army DPM to animals.
RovingArcher
19-01-2005, 20:06
Because hunting/stalking is a big part of who I am, I'm a "blend me in" kind of guy, but I do it with subdued colors and patterns. Camo is only good in certain areas that they are meant for and around these parts, I can walk 50 paces and be in need of another camo, because the terrain will change dramatically. So, I use subdued Earth tones and plaids to blend me in. Most importantly for me is to keep my hands and face covered, so lite gloves and a beard work wonders.
My trousers (http://www.notquite.free-online.co.uk/Vince%20skins%20rabbit_web.JPG ) for example are plain to the human eye [good for rescue if needed] but probably register about the same as army DPM to animals.
That is very interesting zambezi. :biggthump
I think the clothing manufacturers aim their jackets at mountain walkers and alot of it may be because it is safer. If a jacket is brightly coloured and an inexperienced walker is caught out in bad weather he will (hopefully :roll: ) be wearing his jacket and a rescue will be easier.
When I was younger and not as confident and experienced as I am now, out moorland walking in winter, I wore a red waterproof purely for that reason. Seeing a few of the previous posts a hi-vis vest is a good idea. :super:
I'm a subdued man myself :biggthump
Hootch
OK - my take is this: Litter stands out in a natural environment because it is a ****ing eyesore, and doesn't look like it belongs there. (Leaf litter is exempt) I would rather look like I belong there - although I tend to only use DPM when I *really* don't want to be seen.
My view is brightly coloured clothes in the hills are colour pollution although I can understand why mountaineers use bright coloured kit on the more remote and higher mountains around the would.
Bright colours can not been used in the safety argument because most casualties and lost people are found lying down or tucked up in a sheltered area and are only found by almost stumbling over them or with a dog, that’s in good visibility. Join a Mountain Rescue Team in the dead of a winter’s night on the Beacons and try and find a walker dressed in yellow and red.
Orange and practically the orange that survival bags are coloured with is a very effective camouflage on a green foliage background, especially from a search and rescue helicopter.
Paganwolf
19-01-2005, 21:51
Im just a Green person, the room my kit lives in has a green aura about it :lol: most of my kit is olive green,its nice and descreet and i like the colour, if im going shooting DPM is what i choose, and if using roads i use a high viz vest as mentioned above..
I agree that there's very little color choice in any given season and fashion plays a massive part in manufacturers thinking these days - anything to try and push up the sales and try to reinforce the difference between this season and last (with the corresponding price increase).
The color of my kit has changed quite a bit since I got interested specifically in bushcraft rather than general outdoor sports. Lots of green / brown / khaki where in the past I wasn't hung up about it and just bought whatever appealed at the time (except tents - always green).
I spend more time wearing my kit around home / town than I get to spend in the woods so that factors in - and I imagine that's the case for the majority of people.
For blend in I won't buy DPM for all the usual reasons but have started to pick up some cheap Realtree / Advantage type kit which I think is more "huntin" than "rambo".
Bob Hurley
20-01-2005, 01:39
I usually wear mostly greys and medium browns, they blend in here even in the spring (doesn't match the leaves, but you can't see through the leaves, can you?). I've been thinking about going back to camoflage especially for hunting. There isn't really a stigma about military camo here (I used to hunt in US issue camo, ALICE suspenders and buttpack), and you see a lot of all types of camo in everyday dress. I don't think you'd raise any eyebrows unless you were in full military issue right down to the boots and beret ...
Carcajou Garou
20-01-2005, 03:24
Subdued certainly, I get eyesore from some of that dayglo neon that is worn by some. I go into the bush to return to nature can do without the bright stess, but that's just me. Blend with my surroundings.
just a thought
over here we call those hikers "human signal flares, or h.s.f.'s", nothing I like less than a great piece of backwoods doted with gaerish colored h.s.f.'s, only good thing about them is if the systems ever fll they'll draw all the small arms fire!
Orange and practically the orange that survival bags are coloured with is a very effective camouflage on a green foliage background, especially from a search and rescue helicopter.
I have always preferred to carry one of the foil emergency bags for this reason, and the fact that they have superior thermal properties and are lighter and less bulky. Slightly more expensive than the pvc option but, should you ever get to deploy one, you will probably think it money well spent!
Some very good points and insights so far guys, which seem to back up my own personal thoughts. Keep'em coming. HSF...like it:wink:
dave750gixer
20-01-2005, 13:41
begining to spot a pattern here. I seem to be with the majority - subdued clothing worn but carry a high vis vest for emergencies or walking along roads.
Well, it just shows that we all like our privacy in the woods, try not to stand out too much, but also act sensibly...
Hmm, bit scary that!:rolmao:
ChrisKavanaugh
21-01-2005, 05:36
http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/01/12/flooded.backwoods.ap/index.html
I am definetely in the subdued category. I like to stealth camp in areas that aren't exactly open to camping. Here in Brazil hiking in full camo can get you in trouble. I try not to look military. I do like ot blend in.
I usually carry a bright T-shirt to make myself look really civilian when I have to. Mac
Most of my gear is plain olive green. I don't have a problem with camo but some places abroad you can be in real trouble if you're wearing it and not in the military. Better to appear more civvy with a liking for green than go yomping thru the mountains with full ALICE kit , chest rig and beanie hat IMO
Subdued. I dont want to impose myself on the landscape and it shows dirt less easily.
http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/01/12/flooded.backwoods.ap/index.html
Lipscomb had been in the flooded timberland near Hollowell Reservoir for about 12 hours when he was rescued. To survive, he drank dirty bayou water and ate a raw duck breast.
I don't know about you lot but I think I could manage 12 hours without resorting to that. Although I did drink Skol once which was probably the same.
Oh and definatly subdued colours.
bambodoggy
21-01-2005, 17:42
I don't know about you lot but I think I could manage 12 hours without resorting to that. Although I did drink Skol once which was probably the same.
Oh and definatly subdued colours.
Yer me too....I know some people think I'm a tiny bit tubby....I'm not, it's simply a survival thing...gives me greater reserves to use up if I can't eat for any length of time lol. I'd definately have managed more than 12 hours before drinking unclean water and eating raw duck!!!!
Edit: In fact, I wouldn't have drank unclean water and eaten raw duck....ever!
Sounds like another score for the evil media hypers to me!!!
Raw duck? Duck carpaccio... Mmmm...
Raw duck? Duck carpaccio... Mmmm...
Could have sworn I set this thread up tp discuss kit and clothing colours...:?:
RovingArcher
21-01-2005, 18:09
:roll: Oh Brother. After helping people that were going through a vision quest without food and water for (4) days and coming out of ceremony without harm, I've gained much more respect for the human body. I wouldn't want to do it under duress/stress, but a couple of days should be a piece of cake for those that aren't diabetic.
Yep, I apologize for continuing the wandering word. But felt compelled to offer up what I know about the bodies ability to do without. You'd be amazed at how well a naked body blends. :o):
Awright...
I think most pieces of the kit should be BRIGHT and obnoxious. Even then, you still tend to lose them in the real world of dead leaves and twigs and mud. Just last week I lost a 4 feet long bright orange sandwik saw in a 20 square feet radius (around the tree I was bucking)... Took me about 20 minutes to find it. I had buried it in leaves not taking care about it (bah! it's orange I'll find it no problem).
For a second, I seriously thought some gremlin had stalked me and stole my saw...
Anyways :D
I wear subdued clothing, though. I'm not yet crazy enough to lose my pants in the bush... (well, you never know these days...). Subdued colors blend in the forest, and they blend in socially as well : browns, greens, greys etc.
Cheers,
David
Moine makes a good point about gear. I personally won't buy a Bic Lighter unless it's yellow. The same goes for medical kits and whistles etc. The last thing I want is for a piece of fallen kit to blend in witht he forest floor.
Often I will cache my pack and go off for a short hike without it. In such times it is nice to have a pack that blends in as I'm usually not SO far out that people couldn't stumble across my stuff. I leave it well hidden and make sure I have compass directions back to it writtn down, paces counted etc. The fact that the pack is a natural color and blending in gives me peace of mind that it will be there when I get back. Mac
TheViking
22-01-2005, 11:44
Have a look here mate. :D http://www.bushcraftuk.net/community/showthread.php?t=2985&page=1&pp=15
brucemacdonald
22-01-2005, 21:27
At last year's wilderness gathering the chap from Cambrian Survival (sorry', can't remember his name) mentioned parachute drop markers, which are pieces of dayglo silky/satin cloth used to mark drop zones. Highly visible from a distance, take up next to no weight or bulk in a pack and can be used in emergencies.
The consensus is for subdued, but not military clothing. I agree. I do wear some ex-military kit but I have tried to find anything that is not DPM - not only for the usual reasons but because I also see it at work everyday! So it is plain olive green or flecktarn which to my eyes does not look as militaristic as DPM (and more importantly to most of the public here in the UK).
Best wishes
Bruce
Motorbike Man
22-01-2005, 22:45
Subdued definately for me. Over the years in various Cadet, Venture Scout and T.A. organisations, I've kind of gotten used to not standing out. However, in the current political / security climate, I don't think out and out camouflage is always a good idea. It's a difficult question sometimes as camo gear can be bought so cheap these days. I don't like to stand out outdoors, I think it's hard on the eyes and in my experiance at least being subdued makes it easier to see wildlife.
Olive drab is just right i think for bushcraft outdoorsy type stuff,blends in just right with out making you look like a paramilitary nutter.I've said/mentioned before in a previous thread about the civilian hunting type of camo patterns,they are camo but do not mark you out as an special forces nut,What do you all think of those.Maybe those would be perfect.
Rhapsody
22-01-2005, 23:04
I prefer subdued kit, but because most of my stuff is ex-army, a lot of it is camo.
TheViking
23-01-2005, 11:41
Subdued clothes for me too. Plain green, black or brown. :wave:
Native Nathan
23-01-2010, 14:43
Time to revive an old thread..
I think subdued wins every time even though most of my kit is DPM.
but that's mainly due to it been what I had when I was in the army, and there's no point replacing it when its in good working order.
I like greens for my clothing,
However some items I like in bright colours , peg bag , head torch bag , guy line bag ,
just makes it easier to find the little critters when your a bit tired ...lol
Twodogs
Yeah, I agree, and things like reflective guy lines when camping with other folks are such a good idea. I've taken to putting one of the glow in the dark beads onto bag pull cords too. Lets me see them in the gloom of the tent / half light in the middle of the night need out to piddle occasions.
cheers,
Toddy
Subdued. Not really sure why. I am sure a lot of us on here have Ray Mears Syndrome - family photo on holiday, wife/husband and kids dressed in normal holiday clothes, bright blues, reds, yellows etc, and standing with them someone in olive green and brown with the essential merino wool beanie....Admit it you've got a photo like that, I certainly have.
I just like subdued browns and greens and always have and they don't show the dirt in the forest. My family are used to it now but my teenage daughter finds it a bit embarrassing sometimes
NS
Subdued. Not really sure why. I am sure a lot of us on here have Ray Mears Syndrome - family photo on holiday, wife/husband and kids dressed in normal holiday clothes, bright blues, reds, yellows etc, and standing with them someone in olive green and brown with the essential merino wool beanie....Admit it you've got a photo like that, I certainly have.
I just like subdued browns and greens and always have and they don't show the dirt in the forest. My family are used to it now but my teenage daughter finds it a bit embarrassing sometimes
NS
Ditto...especially the bit about the embarrassed daughter:rolleyes:
Simon
Laurentius
23-01-2010, 19:44
Well put it this way, I am keen on photography, the other day whilst out and about I had to wait forever for a couple of bright red clad walkers to get out of my picture.
The only time I will wear anything bright is when I am cycling, and that is for survival. I like to be inconspicous otherwise.
LordRose
23-01-2010, 23:32
Well put it this way, I am keen on photography, the other day whilst out and about I had to wait forever for a couple of bright red clad walkers to get out of my picture.
The only time I will wear anything bright is when I am cycling, and that is for survival. I like to be inconspicous otherwise.
Oh im in the same situation. For getting wildlife shots I also like to blend in! As sad as it sounds I even use my airsoft/paintball assault chest rig to put essentials in whilst walking.
Black.
Im just that way.
Id wear cammo but DPM is so ugly
Usually subdued, semi-military - except when winter mountaineering or climbing when being easily spotted can be a (life-saving) advantage!:)
Always earth colours in the forest, in the usual Ray Mears clone bushcraft style:lmao:
In the 80's and early 90's DPM jackets had replaced Donkey jackets for site work. I used to go hunting in DPM.
It helped certainly. Although, I'm sure all the rabbits I shot were simply confused. "What's a bricklayer doing out here?". Bang!!..
Subdued clothes for me mainly, but I have to admit wearing a hi vis jacket when shooting has had it's advantages too.
You "look" like you're meant to be there, e.g., forestry, estate or council worker etc. And you don't suddenly appear, to daydreaming walkers etc.
calibanzwei
25-01-2010, 13:19
Black.
Im just that way.
Id wear cammo but DPM is so ugly
Plenty more out there :D
http://www.kamouflage.net/thumbnail.php
I'm a subdued-color guy. I like to blend-in, both in the woods and in town, something neither bright colors nor camo can do. Overly bright colors just offend my sensibilities in the outdoors somehow. Having said that, I like little things like pocket knives to stand out from the leaves or I lose them. And I've scared myself a couple times when I've not been able to find my tent for a while.
bushcraftsman
25-01-2010, 16:40
Subdued all the way for me, like Oblio said bright colours stand out, but the camo ones dont tend to do their job very well in woodland that isn't that dense, so I prefer to have subdued colours, most of my kit is olive/dark green.