View Full Version : Tell Me About Guy Ropes...
I picked up my new basha on the way home from work today and picked up some bungees for guys at the same time. It then occured to me that the bungees would double the weight/bulk of the basha!
So I thought I would try using guy ropes instead. I was just going to use some odd lengths of paracord but wondered if I am missing anything here.
Is the cheap immitation paracord ok, or is there something better out there? How long do people generally leave the guys on a basha? What about the ridge cord? I noticed on a different thread some folks are using 5mm or 6mm light rope...Is that usual? It seems a bit of over kill ...
Regards,
Pete
Squidders
13-12-2004, 21:29
I have psudo paracord for mine... 4 x 5m lengths of 4mm and 1 x 10m length of 6 (or is it 7)mm and that seems to work fine. I'm not sure of the benefits with the larger cord for the ridge, it was discussed previously with no real resolution.
I will be ordering some bungees soon though because i'm lazy basically. the basic benefit of only using paracord or similar is that you can use it for other things like bow drills or laces or whatever where as bungees can only be used to errr... bungee things together.
My 2p's worth.
Joe
I like to use climbing accessory cord as it doesn't have any of the uncertainties over quality that you get with paracord. It's always decently made, and strength goes according to diameter. Buy from a climbing shop off the roll. The maker should be one of the same names as on the ropes themselves, beal, mammut, cousin, millet (the proper french firm), edelrid, etc.
Anything 3mm and up is strong enough for a ridge, even tiny 2mm cord will hold 70 kilo's so it's strong enough for tie outs at minimal weight but tends to tangle.
I'm using 550 paracord for the tie outs (I bought the "good stuff" but actually it's nowhere near as good as climbing cord) and a long length of 6mm for the ridge. That's overkill for the basha, but it's rated 750kg minimum breaking and 15 metres is only the size of a malt loaf so it doubles as an emergency cord for river crossings and such like.
Squidders
13-12-2004, 22:32
my climbing ropes are in nice subdued colours that blend in with the environment... bright orange, blue and pink :yikes:
good idea though, the only thing you have to watch is the outer sheath seperating from the core and bunching up from lots of small knots and abraision. I prefer a cord I know I can't trust because i'll never try it on and have it fail on me.
rapidboy
13-12-2004, 23:14
I got some blackhawk cord from Joe at ODS and it's pretty nice.
Doesn't tangle easily and has a "quality" feel and look to it that you don't get with the cheap stuff.
I use a British Army Basha and always just tie the cord to the eyelets but i was looking at a few pics of the Australian Hootchi and it was suspended below a ridge line which makes adjustment much better so im going to try mine like that.
I also thought about using a second line inside the tarp to hang kit on like in my Hennessy.
I always set mine up with one side and the ends pegged to the ground to stop the wind whistling through but i see many pics with the basha up off the ground on all sides which looks like the wind chill would make it most unpleasant.
How do you guy's set yours up.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v76/rapidboy1/mournes052_1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v76/rapidboy1/mournes055_1.jpg
rb
bambodoggy
13-12-2004, 23:17
I once and once only tried to belay on para cord....it held my partner but it ripped my hands apart.... I'd rather be swept down stream than use it for river crossing again!!!! :o):
For my basha...I'm lazy like Squidders and use bungee's!
Squidders
13-12-2004, 23:23
I've tried mine with the loops at the top but they are oriented wrong for it to work well so I tied little paracord loops along the top. It worked ok I guess but I was unimpressed. On the british ones, there's webbing everywhere that takes ages to dry out and there are what look like huge handles everywhere, I hope they're useful because they tick me right off. Any thoughts?
With regards to the pitching, I tend to have mine from the ground as a single flat sheet as this is the easiest way to pitch it. I agree with the windy bit but I try to pitch in naturally shaded areas.
Squidders
13-12-2004, 23:25
For my basha...I'm lazy like Squidders and use bungee's!
Hey I said I was about to order them... i'm not lazy yet :wink: i'm a wannabe lazy bloke!
rapidboy
13-12-2004, 23:44
.....they are oriented wrong for it to work well so I tied little paracord loops along the top. It worked ok I guess but I was unimpressed..........there are what look like huge handles everywhere, I hope they're useful because they tick me right off. Any thoughts?
I had thought of using split rings so they would slide easily.
The handles are apparently so it can be used as a stretcher .
rb
Squidders
13-12-2004, 23:51
A stretcher... d'oh! why didn't I think of that?!?
Split rings sound like a good idea... or the little mini carabiners, they would also work and you could use them for securing stuff while in transit too... I may give that a go.
[QUOTE=rapidboy]
How do you guy's set yours up.
I,ve just put a picture up of the winter set-up I use with a hammock (theres another in my gallery of a winter ground dwelling set-up too). I use para type cord for the suspension line, but do not attach cord to any other part of the basha, instead I carry six wooden toggles with very thin nylon cord attached to deploy as and where I need. Each toggle has 2.5mtrs of cord attached.This system means no trying to untangle yards of cord in the dark :nono:
I know two bashas seems a bit "over-the-top" :roll: but one is used as a heat reflector for my fire :lol: I like being toasty.
Neil
bambodoggy
14-12-2004, 10:46
My deepest apologies Squidders....you aren't lazy yet true....but the thought is there and it's only a doze and a snooze away matey! :nana:
Actually, just to be difficult I'm going to say that I'm not lazy to use bungee's, I'm praticle as follows:
1) I can have my basha up and down in less time than you guys spend tying and untying knots (work out how long each knot takes, times it by the number of knots you have on your basha, times that by the numer of times you use your basha in a year and that's how long you waste with knots!)
As eficiency is all in bushcraft my bungee's win :o):
2) True you can use cordage for other purposes BUT most of us can make cordage and so don't need to use the paracord. Also while we're using this cord, we have no shelter....if the shelter stays up without that bit of paracord then why is it there? You're just carrying cordarge in the disgise of a guy rope.
3) my bungee's can be pressed into service as a catapult, part of a spring snare, as a binding, the metal hooks used to hold pots over fires or fashioned into fishing hooks (obviously off the rubber). The outer cord can be used for lashings. The rubber makes perfect wet weather fire starters and so the list goes on....
4) I can set up and take down my basha at night without removing my gloves to tie knots.
5) If times get hard I can barter with locals with bungee's which they may not have seen much better than with a bit of green string...."mmmm, shiney stretchy thingy with hooks or manky old bit of green string"? (I'm talking primative peoples here - the lady in the Red Cow just south of the Brecon Beacons was having none of it and I even offered her my most stretchy one :lol: !).
They may be a little more heavy and at first sight look more lazy but they are far more useful than just green string!!!!!
Well.....that's my story and I'm sticking to it! :nana:
See Squidders, we're not lazy.....but by using bungee's we have time to sit under our basha thinking of excuses for them while we watch the rest struggling to do their knots with cold numb fingers!!! :wink:
The only thing I have against bungees is that they can be dangerous if you are pegging them to the ground. Even if you aren't pegging them in under great tension wind can pick up and give them extra power. Having said that, I've used bungees in association with twizelpegs often and I still got both eyes!
Just to add my tuppence worth to Adi's warning...
Pursonally I don't recommend the use of bungees. For various reasons:
The can over tension your tarp.
If the knot pulls through the hook it can be extremely dangerous (I have a cracked bone in my hand from this happening on a cold winters carp fishing trip a few years ago).
On a cheap one the hook can straighten and whip-crack dangerously.
trying to tension them with cold hands/gloves/mittens it can be too easily lost from your hand and whip-crack dangerously.
I used to use them all the time for tarps, attaching things to my bike/pack/etc., but had a ceremonial destruction event and destroyed the lot of them.
Your much better getting a set of tarp lines like Gary sells or making up your own. At least that way you know you won't suffer potential loss of eyes, cracked knuckles and the ropes will be long enough.
bambodoggy
14-12-2004, 12:28
Hey Jakunen, you're TOPS :o): I've heard all the horror stories about bungee's pinging off all over the place and taking out eyes left, right and centre but I'd always put it down to being an Urban Legend as it always happened to a mate of a mate etc and I've never known anyone that's had it happen to them! You are my first live specimen...lol...congratulatio ns! :You_Rock_
Can't disagree too much with all your negatives except to say that as with all things you get what you pay for, buy cheap bungee's and they'll break....buy cheap string and it'll snap.
I tend to use twizel pegs with mine too...so I'm either a scaredy lazy boy or I just like shiney new kit.....or both! :shock:
I also have to say that what with axes and knives to play with and odd plants to eat and all the rest of the risk involved in bushcraft while it's something else to be aware of I don't think it's as dangerous as can be made out and it's certainly nothing I worry about.....yes yes, easy to say when I've never known an accident I know.
Think I'll still keep using mine though. Doesn't hurt to have a warning though..thanks all :lol:
Oh, and if you see me at the ashdown meet with a pirates eye patch on them I'm wrong....I know I'm worng and I don't need reminding I was wrong!!! :shade: :zip: :bandit: :sulkoff:
Bamboodogy, erm, thanx, I think...
I only bought good quality ones (generally military spec ones) but had to borrow some off a mate as I lost some of mine, usual story "I know I put them back in here last time...", probably left them in the woods/on the lake bank.
If you like them, by all means carry one using them, just don't expect me to be anywhere near your basha unless I'm wearing my kevlar!:o):
bambodoggy
14-12-2004, 12:42
Lol....that sounds fair to me.... so I'll be the one basha'd up and all alone... :wink: nothing new there then!
Back to being serious for a second, I've also seen it happen to others several times.
The worst one I had was I had a cadet get his cheek ripped by one. Was rather nasty as it was old one he'd borrowed from his father who did a lot of carp fishing and the rubber/plastic coating on the hook had worn off and the hook was rusty. One inch higher...
The cadet force CO banned the use of them.
bambodoggy
14-12-2004, 13:19
Fair enough, as I said you're totally right to highlight the possible problems with bungee's.
I'll still use them but to be fair after hearing the horror stories start to circulate a few years back (even though I thought they might be urban legends) I've still been more careful with them.
Even in the TA we were warned about them but not banned so I'd guessed there must be something in it...but as I said you're the first I've actually known it happen to.
In the Terriers (respect for that mate!) or the Regs, you have to assume a certain amount of responsibility for yourself.
When you're dealing with Little Johnny in the school ACF/CCF, and mummy know's the address of the school's governors you have to be a bit more careful.
I'm not ordering everybody to stop using them, if you like them, keep on using them, but personally I don't like them and wouldn't personally recommend using and find cord much safer and useful. But that's just me.
Twang away mate.:rolmao: :rolmao: :rolmao:
Oh, and if you see me at the ashdown meet with a pirates eye patch on them I'm wrong....I know I'm worng and I don't need reminding I was wrong!!! :shade: :zip: :bandit: :sulkoff:
So is this you Bamboodoggy?? :yikes:
http://gadgetdon.smugmug.com/photos/1814713-S-1.jpg
Yarrr Haaarrrrrr !! Yo ho ho and a bottle of rum !!
Think MDs signature says it all really...<shakes head pityingly>:nana: :o):
bambodoggy
14-12-2004, 13:33
I didn't see you about with your camera Dave!!!! Must have been looking with the other eye! :o):
...but as I said you're the first I've actually known it happen to.
Hmm, you said that you'd assumed that this was just an urban legend...does that mean that I'm...Legendary? <Adi we need a 'swelling head' smiley here LOL>
Where's all those Rep points then???:?:
Squidders
14-12-2004, 13:49
I have used bungees for the past 12 years to attach things to motorbikes, usually things that stretch the bungee beyond it's reasonable limits and never had one snap or break on me.
With all things, check them regularly for signs of fatigue, wear and tear and.
If they're showing signs of rust, replace them.
If they are significantly less springy than they should be, replace them.
If that make a funny noise, replace them.
If you're unsure about their condition, replace them.
it's all common sense, very rarely indeed will something snap without warning. They are, I agree a potential hazard and should be treated appropriately as with knives, saws, big sticks, water and fire.
Justin Time
14-12-2004, 22:51
1) I can have my basha up and down in less time than you guys spend tying and untying knots (work out how long each knot takes, times it by the number of knots you have on your basha, times that by the numer of times you use your basha in a year and that's how long you waste with knots!)
As eficiency is all in bushcraft my bungee's win :o):
4) I can set up and take down my basha at night without removing my gloves to tie knots.
Having paid attention on my Woodsmoke course, I keep my guy ropes attached to my hoochi so no need to tie or untie knots. Can't remember the name of the knot you use to make a sliding loop on the end of the guy rope but it works just like those plastic sliders you get on tent guy ropes. And as for the ridge line, well the knots you need to attach that to the trees work fine with gloves on... IIRC Ray Mears learned them from the Evenc tribe in Siberia. Still, I'm not sure I'd want to get in a race with bungee users but that's because of lack of practice.
What I need to work on is being able to wrap the hoochi altogether without tangling the cords when I pack it away.
Squidders
14-12-2004, 22:57
I wrap the cord around my fingers on my left hand and put an elastic band around it until its tight.
Works an absolute treat and everything's ready next time I take it out of the bag.
Justin Time
14-12-2004, 23:02
must be a bit of a pain having a bag, cord and elastic bands round your left hand between camp sites though? :naughty:
beachlover
14-12-2004, 23:04
[QUOTE=
What I need to work on is being able to wrap the hoochi altogether without tangling the cords when I pack it away.[/QUOTE]
It's not the putting the thing up with line, it's definitely putting it away.
That said, whilst we may not have paracord or similar in the wild, we may need knots to tie natural cordage and that will leave the "bungee boys" unsuspended
I can see either me or Roger will need to cover this at the Ashdown get together.
The evenk knot is actually a different form of the falconers knot and is used for one end of the ridig line - the taut line knot is the sliding one used on the lines from the corners.
There have been a couple of threads about this one here some where (a while ago) so I'll not go over it again. :roll:
Bungees are used by soldiers for use and for speedy bug outs - leaving your cordage attached is good on a hootchie but not so wise on a poncho if its your waterproof layer too! :nana:
Justin Time
15-12-2004, 07:43
taut line knot
thaks Gary
It's always good to know the name of things.
No worries mate. names are not as important as being able to tie em!!
There was me about to say "Ask Gary, he showed me and its not that difficult. Well it can't be if he can dot it:nana: " and blow me if he doesn't beat me to it himself!:lol:
Whats the reason for using the evenk knot for the ridge line?
Regards,
Pete
iirc, because its quite easy to do (once you've learnt how to do it) and whilst being secure is quite quick to undo as well.
bambodoggy
15-12-2004, 12:48
[QUOTE=That said, whilst we may not have paracord or similar in the wild, we may need knots to tie natural cordage and that will leave the "bungee boys" unsuspended
To be fair there is a vast difference in being able to tie knots and needing to tie knots. I'm an SPSA qualified climbing instructor and an RYA Level three dingy sailor and so have a pretty good knowledge of knots and their uses but I still choose to use bungee's for my basha.
Almost in the same way that I'm quite capable of climbing safely without any metal work whatsoever, I can use an Italian hitch for belaying/abseiling etc, I can tie on instead of clipping into things, I can tie turks heads and use them as gear chocks and so the list goes on....however, for ease and speed I use stitch plates, fig8's, nuts, tricams and friends etc..... it's the same for bungee's, I use them for speed and ease.
Having started using basha's in the cadets (where it was a poncho and used as a waterproof) and then used them the whole time I was in the TA I think there's an awful lot in what Gary says about the military using them for speedy bug-outs and I think that and the fact that it's "how I've always done it" is a lot of the reason why I use them.
I'm not anti cordage on basha's, I just choose to use bungee's.
Each to their own though! :super:
iirc, because its quite easy to do (once you've learnt how to do it) and whilst being secure is quite quick to undo as well.
Jakunens right, but we also only use qiuck release knots.
Those who mention the problem of putting bashas away and the strings tangling - the trick here is to correctly coil your cordage - there is a technique but I cant even begin to try and write it.
I will show you sometime.
Great Pebble
15-12-2004, 13:04
Has anyone seen the proper peg/pole things for a basha anywhere?
They're like a long spike with a U shaped thingy at the top. When the basha is pegged out with them it's nearly flat and about 18" of the ground.
Anyone here fly traction kites? Keeping the lines clear on a big traction kite sounds comparable to a basha (I've never used a basha). With a big four liner you have say 4 lengths of 2mm 300KG Dyneema anything up to 50m long each, the bridle could then consist of 36 lengths of very fine line several metres long each. To make it easier to set up the lines are often left attached and the simplest way to prevent tangles (it takes hours to untangle one of these) is to attach the end of each line together at a common point with a small crab, then attach the crab to a loop somwhere on the kite, I prefer to bundle the lines on a figure 8 winder but with the heavier lines used on basha you could just as well coil them on your hand and secure with rubber band.
Dont know if this approach would be practical on a basha?
With flysheets I always coil each guy individualy and tie it up, takes a minute or two but makes life easy.
Jason
'With flysheets I always coil each guy individualy and tie it up, takes a minute or two but makes life easy.'
Thats the idea Jason01, but the technique we teach is designed to ensure they easily feed out too - no snagging next time you put it up as you might be doing so in the dark or a really cats and dogs down pour ect.
'With flysheets I always coil each guy individualy and tie it up, takes a minute or two but makes life easy.'
Thats the idea Jason01, but the technique we teach is designed to ensure they easily feed out too - no snagging next time you put it up as you might be doing so in the dark or a really cats and dogs down pour ect.
Sorry, not very clear as usual, I was trying to explain two completly different methods one for multi line kites that might work on a basha amd another that I use on flysheets with only a few short guylines. The idea with kites is also to unwind the line quickly with no snags (some people do fly them in the dark too with lights attached ;)
Unhook the crab with all the lines attached unwind the lines and they should all be free, then just take them off the crab, generally they wont tangle up if the ends are kept together.
Jason
bambodoggy
15-12-2004, 13:42
Has anyone seen the proper peg/pole things for a basha anywhere?
They're like a long spike with a U shaped thingy at the top. When the basha is pegged out with them it's nearly flat and about 18" of the ground.
If these are what I think they are (Gary might know better) then they are occasionally used as Basha poles (only seen cadets do it and very rarely) but their actual use/purpose is for trip flares.
You stick the pole in the ground, slip the flare onto the upright bit of the "U" and then run the cable out to whatever you're tying it too.
Certainly that's the only reason we were shown them and there was no mention from our DS about using them as poles for basha's.
Also they are steal so weigh a fair bit....better to buy a cheap set of tent poles. I've used the three part wooden poles from my two man pup tent and that works well.
Or you can just cut poles you find out there on the trail.
bambodoggy
15-12-2004, 13:56
SASS sell a rather natty set of basha poles for £12.99
http://www.sasskit.co.uk/ then go to "products", then "foul weather" and there they are on the right hand side.....next to the OG basha.
Or there's these one's from bunkersomething at £24.99
http://www.thebunkerdirect.com/detail_664_3_6.cfm
I also found this while mooching about the net....might interest some: The user name and password to see the pics better is "mm".
http://www.militarymorons.com/equipment/kifaru/kifaru3.html
Great Pebble
15-12-2004, 14:12
That could be they...
Mind you I've a piccy of about a hundred or so "temporary residences" pegged out in similar fashion. Most useful when there are no trees available.
Gary - what's the best way to wrap the lines so the whole thing doesn't bird's nest? I have a system where I start from the basha end and wrap it around my thumb and little finger and loop the rest around the body of the coil and tuck the free end under the coil.
bambodoggy
15-12-2004, 14:22
Yer, that makes sence Mate.....maybe they were used for that too.... I seem to remember there being a seperate pouchy bit on the old 58 pattern poncho roll for carrying them so maybe they were intended for that.
We were advised to use our bergans to prop up our shelters if there was no tree's, poles, fence lines etc but that always struck me as daft as they always demo'd it with a full bergan...by the time I'd taken the dossbag out the stupid thing was empty and useless....maybe you could use the internal poles but that wouldn't be good in a fast bug-out situation.....also, if you're doing all that then why bother with the bivvi bags they issued us???? Madness.....everwhere there is Madness!!!!
Are you looking to get hokd of the "U" shaped poles Pebbles? I occationally find them while walking the dog over in the MoD land near me....I'll keep an eye out for you if you like?
Ah, Bambodoggy that brought back memories!
Fair brought a smile to me face. Yeah they did demo it that way and it never worked in the field when you tried it. I ended up cheating and getting an old shock corded tent pole and cuttign it down to the size I wanted and re-cording it.
Happy days...
Great Pebble
15-12-2004, 15:22
Probably superflous these day, I'm almost always around trees :)
It just struck me that I'd seen Bashas put together like that so many times and never noted anyone on here mentioning it.
Gary - what's the best way to wrap the lines so the whole thing doesn't bird's nest? I have a system where I start from the basha end and wrap it around my thumb and little finger and loop the rest around the body of the coil and tuck the free end under the coil.
Adi that the way to do it mate - as you coil it use a figure 8 and then they wont tangle as you run them out.
When you take down - do you figure 8 coils with the basha still up on the ridge line. Then gather the basha in the centre of the ridge line (concertina fashion) Lower this to the ground and tuck the coiled guys in before folding and rolling the ridge around the outside.
Then when you come to erect you tie your Evenk knot one end of the ridge line, tie a tentioning knot the other to make sure your ridge is ... ridged...... and then run out your corner guys after spreading the basha out.
Sounds a little long winded but do it a few times and it'll be second nature and eventually you can have home up in literally a minute or two.
Does that make sense - or is it as clear as mud!?
Adi that the way to do it mate - as you coil it use a figure 8 and then they wont tangle as you run them out.
When you take down - do you figure 8 coils with the basha still up on the ridge line. Then gather the basha in the centre of the ridge line (concertina fashion) Lower this to the ground and tuck the coiled guys in before folding and rolling the ridge around the outside.
Then when you come to erect you tie your Evenk knot one end of the ridge line, tie a tentioning knot the other to make sure your ridge is ... ridged...... and then run out your corner guys after spreading the basha out.
Sounds a little long winded but do it a few times and it'll be second nature and eventually you can have home up in literally a minute or two.
Does that make sense - or is it as clear as mud!?
That's the way ... works out very well indeed. Whne you store it away in thsi fashion is makes sense to have the thinner rope for the basha - having it all as paracord would make a huge bundle!
Someone mentioned kite lines earlier in the thread - they make excellent guy ropes, incredibly strong, very thin - so little bulk, no stretch and very lightweight. Need to watch out what kind of knots you use though.
George
... I've heard all the horror stories about bungee's pinging off all over the place and taking out eyes left, right and centre but I'd always put it down to being an Urban Legend as it always happened to a mate of a mate etc ....
Nope, it's not urban myth. Happened to me too many years back. Used a bungee to hold the lid on my motorcyle top box closed when the catch broke. Graunching it tight shut one cold winters day, i lost my grip on the end and it whipped - finding its way into the front of my helmet and smacking me right about the eye. It was a mighty crack and I just clenched my eyelid shut thinking "f**k, what have I done. Legged it back to my sisters flat and asked her to look at it - her reaction :yikes: started me worrying but as my vision clouded over and went out on that side I was bricking it to say the least.
I just made a permanent wink, jumped back on the bike and belted off to the nearest casualty department.
Verdict - the real impact was on my eyebrow but still burst a capilliary in my eye. Internal bleeding was the reason my sight went out. I was very very lucky that it wasn't any worse and they just kept me in overnight while the eye fixed itself and natural replacement of the aqueous humour as it's called cleared my sight in a couple of days.
Moral - its not a myth. Bungees are OK, but keep your face out of the line of fire when you pull them up tight :o):
Gary,
What sort of lengths are do you normally use for the guys and how much ridge line at either end? I know this is litterally a "how long is a bit of string" question but I figured you guys must have the system pretty much worked out now.
Always used bungees before and never bothered with a ridge line, but will give it a go this way.
Regards,
Pete
I think Gary's way is about the best to stop guylines tangling - the figure 8 stops the twists
but two other ways to avoid the twist you get when coiling rope are
(i) to hank the rope the way cavers do, first folding it in half a time or two then forming a chain of half tied thumb knots (it's dead easy but I'll have to find a picture to explain) to make a short thick hank of cord that unravels with a single pull.
(ii) to bag longer / larger cords - if you just feed the cord into a bag starting from one end, it will pull out with no tangles (this is how to do throwbags for water rescue and how moutain rescue teams carry 100m plus ropes for stretcher work each just fed into it's own rucksack).
I've used the second trick to chuck a length of paracord right over the roof of my house and down the other side (so that I could pull over a rope for securing the top of a ladder) so it definately works.
Cheers :biggthump
What sort of lengths are do you normally use for the guys and how much ridge line at either end?
Description of Woodlore's hootchie guyline set :
"Hootchie guy lines consist of: 4 x 4m thin (2mm) and 1 x 7m thick (5mm) ridgeline olive green cord."
I'm not that daring yet, I take a longer ridge and six tie outs :o):
(i) to hank the rope the way cavers do, first folding it in half a time or two then forming a chain of half tied thumb knots (it's dead easy but I'll have to find a picture to explain) to make a short thick hank of cord that unravels with a single pull.
You can get a surprising length of rope into a small length doing this.
Gary,
What sort of lengths are do you normally use for the guys and how much ridge line at either end? I know this is litterally a "how long is a bit of string" question but I figured you guys must have the system pretty much worked out now.
Always used bungees before and never bothered with a ridge line, but will give it a go this way.
Regards,
Pete
As Alick points out the Woodlore quoted lengths are about right and the same as I use (i got my original set when I worked for them .........) once point however the ridge line runs from tree to tree and thus the whole length of the tarp (its not tied on the ends) this offers the tarp a little protect from falling twigs ect as well as aiding in ridgedity and thus water shed.
Alick !!
Found some good pics of rope chainlinking here in 4 easy steps here.
http://sobering.terracom.net/iceboating/BraidedDnMainsheet/
You can double the cord up too and still chainlink it :biggthump
http://sobering.terracom.net/iceboating/BraidedDnMainsheet/Step4.jpeg
Squidders
16-12-2004, 13:56
I chainlink my climbing ropes when I can be bothered... it's handy but quite time consuming.
That's exactly what I meant Dave - well spotted. :biggthump
You're right about doubling the rope up before starting the chain of knots, do in half, half again, even 3 times before you start to make the knots otherwise it would take ages. You're only looking to make half a dozen knots to hank the whole length and as it's just to keep the cord tidy, the loops can all be left pretty loose too.
On a climbing rope there's a lot more cord to take up so even repeated halving you'll still need a dozen odd loops.
Cheers
Squidders
16-12-2004, 21:33
I just ended up getting a rope bag and accepting the 5 minutes of de-snarling my ropes as part of the climbing experience ;o)
I also use this process to check the rope for any kinks or signs of damage, I don't want to be falling off an E6 only to find that my rope is dead because something fell on it previously :yikes: