View Full Version : Poncho
Blankfisherman
03-12-2004, 11:01
Im thinking of buying a poncho and liner after Christmas.
Does anyone use a poncho?
Any comments on the pros and cons of it and the liner would be very useful.
If they are good for shelters why are bashas / hootchies so highly thought of?
Any advice would be very much appreciated.
Tom
I use one - used to use one a lot when I was younger, then moved onto fancy Gore-Tex before rediscovering them again.
They are light, low cost, low hassle. Vapour is dispersed by movement and condensation isn't a huge problems. They are cheap enough that if you get a rip in one it's not going to make you cry.
They are also handy as an emergency shelter but I like a basha too because if you use your poncho as a basha too, remember it can only serve one purpose at a time.
The liners are handy but add bulk, weight and cost, although the liner can serve as a sleeping bag liner at other times.
Practical item in my opinion, far better for rugged use than Gore-Tex and other hi-tech breathables that are prone to damage.
bambodoggy
03-12-2004, 11:14
I used poncho's for years but can only ever think of once wearing it as a poncho (it worked rather well actually as it covered my bergan too and this was before the days of gortex so it let air in better than normal waterproofs of that time...was a slight issue with wind catching it though as it's a bit flappy). Now that I have gortex jackets and trousers etc I find I have no need to wear the poncho so I got a basha sheet as it packs a little smaller and weighs a little less...
I still have a poncho though and to be honest for using either as a basha there is no difference at all.
I've never used a liner as I can't see the point...the poncho is a rain stopper and my dossbag (sleeping bag) keeps me warm....why carry a liner too?
While doing Outdoor Ed at college I splashed out with my student loan and bought a double hooped gortex bivvi, used it for about 6 months, then decided it was not as nice as a basha and so went back to them.
Hope that's of use to you Mate...
RAPPLEBY2000
03-12-2004, 11:38
same again,
i've used 3 types, the old British army 58 style(green), a german rubberised one, and the one i assume you're looking at the US army version.
i am about 5'11-6ft and have always found the poncho a little short as a shelter, but when used with a liner as a sleeping bag, it's fine.
you can get a thinsulate liner rather than the standard item, which is far superior!
as for a clothing item, only in the backwoods would i wear it, especially a camo one!
you can adapt the liner by adding a head hole so it can be worn like a ....what's the word....a poncho!
also you can add a zip around the liner which helps it stay warm.
but.....
i am considering chucking mine, for a few reasons:
1. i haven't used it either as a coat or shelter for years.
(there are much better systems)
2. it is a very overtly military which is an image i don't want.
(though you can get green and black US ponchos.
3. as i said, it is a bit small to lie under, i prefer the British army basha.
4. so you have your shelter set up to keep your kit dry, but it's raining hard and your poncho is also your coat how do you keep dry?
5. the pocho /liner system for sleeping was designed designed around the Veitnam war era, thus the system is designed for tropical conditions, not temperate!
the liner is worth prehaps 1 season(in sleeping bag terms).
6. because the poncho isn't breathable, you will sweat in coat mode and sleeping bag mode.
like many others i have used my trusty poncho for years but take a good look around before buying, there are alot of good systems out there!
i shall try to find some interesting links for you!
RAPPLEBY2000
03-12-2004, 11:53
http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/Quarters/2116/lwsb.htm
this is a new design of light weight sleeping bag/liner aimed at the US army, which as you will see can be used like a poncho liner.
http://www.geocities.com/ecotat/ecotatTMP.htm
ecotat poncho/shelter, this is the new design shelter far more than the humble poncho! and goretex no less!
http://www.actiongear.com/cgi-bin/tame.exe/agcatalog/level4c.tam?&M5COPY%2Ectx=8030&siteID=Y0UhrVXTi9Q-KZRAnIjm84l%2AsEAQWvcv%2FQ
the afore mentioned thinsulate poncho liner
bambodoggy
03-12-2004, 12:01
That's some guchi looking kit you found there....but the prices look a little guchi too!!!!
As I said below I used a double hooped gortex bivvi while at college but I still prefer the basha...I can see more and chat to my mates from a basha and get heat from a camp fire etc that you can't when you're cocooned in a bivvi or tent. On the plus side, when camping in mine at the LLangolen canoe Tour a few years back there was some major wind and in the camp site (normal drive on camp site) I'd say about 70% of the tents blow away or had somesort of damage from the wind....my little bivvi was totally untouched due to it's low profile and shape...
I think in really really really extream cld/wet whether the bivvi tent is better though....I'm just being stubbon in sticking to my basha! :o):
The difference between a poncho and a basha when used as a shelter is a poncho is shorter in length. Not a major problem is you use a bivvi bag as the army does of course.
Pro's for a poncho - it is also a waterproof top which is breathable and covers your pack. I carry one as a waterproof and as an emergency shelter ect.
Con's - its about two inches shorter than a basha and you need to tie the hood closed when used as a shelter.
Courses for horses really one thing to be aware of is 'high tech' high cost poncho's - due to centruies old design it doesnt need to be gore-tex ect ect.
As for the liner, use a compatable poncho i.e us army, and you have a great lightweight summer sleep system for for xtreme bushcraft!
TheViking
03-12-2004, 15:56
Having never tried a decent 'basha' i can only comment on a poncho.
I have an army issue one in dark green colour. It's not 'plastic', but rubber which makes it heavier, but more waterproof. It has eyes and the measures 200 x 165 cm. :biggthump
I have a hootchi and its great. I think its better than a poncho because it is specially designed for the job; longer, eyelets, guys and as adi said you will still need a coat.
I vaguely remember seeing them somewhere in different lengths but cant remember where! I am 6'2" and can fit under my standard hootchi so I dont know how tall you need to be to need a XLong one?
bigjackbrass
03-12-2004, 19:24
Nomad Travel make a pretty good poncho and liner; I bought mine in a sale at the old YHA store. The main advantages over some of the military ones available are that it's olive green instead of camo and the liner has a Velcro-fastened head slit for conversion from worn liner to blanket. It's a useful piece of kit, but actually mine gets used mostly as a blanket on the bed at home (and nicely toasty it is, too).
Nomad Travel make a pretty good poncho and liner; I bought mine in a sale at the old YHA store. The main advantages over some of the military ones available are that it's olive green instead of camo and the liner has a Velcro-fastened head slit for conversion from worn liner to blanket. It's a useful piece of kit, but actually mine gets used mostly as a blanket on the bed at home (and nicely toasty it is, too).
Ya haven't got a link for Nomad have you Jack ??
www.nomadtravel.co.uk ;-)
:biggthump
Ed
RovingArcher
05-12-2004, 17:17
I've been using the US issue poncho and liner. Actually, I carry two poncho's in my larger ruck. They work great together as a shelter and gives me a few more use options.
I have several poncho's and swore by them for years. but for the last few years been using surplus army east german rain capes. does everything poncho does and more. sportsmans guide new cat. has a czech. one, ordering one soon.
I can still remember when the only time that you would be issued with a Basha was the jungle. At this time the armed forces were issued with ponchos and they were your primary shelter when in most places on the planet, they worked well enough then, they haven't changed. :wink:
Im thinking of buying a poncho and liner after Christmas.
Does anyone use a poncho?
Any comments on the pros and cons of it and the liner would be very useful.
If they are good for shelters why are bashas / hootchies so highly thought of?
Any advice would be very much appreciated.
Tom
Hi Tom
You can pick up a poncho for less than a tenner at Ironclad Surplus. Looky here http://www.bushcraftuk.net/community/showthread.php?t=4820 :biggthump
I like the 58 pattern poncho - served me well in my TA days but is a bit heavy.
I saw a very compact poncho in olive ripstop nylon by 'Highlander' - folded up in a tiny neat bag and about 16 quid. I wasn't sure if it had eyelets in the corners (kind of essential) though. Does anyone know?
I like the 58 pattern poncho - served me well in my TA days but is a bit heavy.
I saw a very compact poncho in olive ripstop nylon by 'Highlander' - folded up in a tiny neat bag and about 16 quid. I wasn't sure if it had eyelets in the corners (kind of essential) though. Does anyone know?
Why are eyelets essential? You can easily use a small stone as a anchor on each corner for shelter building just insert the stone and tie it off woth the guy line and run outyour line as normal.
More important would be the quality of the material - is it rip stop? Will it tear in the first wind? Is it shower proof or waterproof?
Just a thought.
ChrisKavanaugh
15-01-2005, 18:52
Multi use items suffer the flaw of being asked to do to many things well. A poncho is a lightwieght article of rain gear. Yes, it can make do as a shelter. yes, it can make a sleeping system of sorts with a liner. That liner itself just negated the poncho's main virtue- light wieght and portability. This is the same thinking that gave us the Bradley Fighting Vehicle. I carry a poncho and a tarp. A truly efficient set of raingear consists of a sou'wester hat, jacket, bib pants and rubber boots. I had a Norwegian surplus set in the Redwood Campaign. I looked like a U- Boat kapitan surrounded by poncho clad kids who resembled camoflaged mushrooms. I was drier than anybody. I also had to climb in and out of that stuff, pack it and moved a lot slower. Everything is a trade off. Few pieces of kit deliver 100% service 100% of the time.
Good tip about using a stone in the corners if no eyelets. I must be too conditioned to using bungees instead of cordage.
You can get very cheap (£2 or £3, new) green vinyl ponchos. Probably too flimsy for regular use but fold up very small (maybe size of a tobacco tin). Have yet to try it as a shelter.
RAPPLEBY2000
18-01-2005, 00:40
or even an IPK (Individual Protection Kit),
about a fiver it contains:
a large olive green tarpaulin
6 alloy tent pegs
and a heap load of white nylon cord.
and instructions on how to build your own bunker :roll:
I use a white nylon "snow" poncho I bought for a few dollars as unissued surplus. I think it's German army but I'm not certain. It's a little lighter than the U.S. Army model and mine was genuinely waterproof - some U.S. army ponchos that got into the system (and foreign copies) do not meet spec and leak water).
IPK sheets are water and tearproof. You will not rip one of these easily. I also saw somewhere those little clips from womens suspender belts being used to construct a shelter with those reflective foil blankets.
Paganwolf
27-02-2005, 17:30
IPK sheets are water and tearproof. You will not rip one of these easily. I also saw somewhere those little clips from womens suspender belts being used to construct a shelter with those reflective foil blankets.
Now where did i put that suspender belt :yikes: OOOPS!!!!!! Thats a top tip make sure the missus has her tackle on during bushcraft as an emergency shelter may be required, and if you ask her and she wallops you dont blame me :shock: ,Hey tell her it could save her life :naughty:
IPK sheets are water and tearproof. You will not rip one of these easily. I also saw somewhere those little clips from womens suspender belts being used to construct a shelter with those reflective foil blankets.
They come in RAF SURVIVAL KIT MARK 4 too - actually a really good idea for easy tear materials.
bambodoggy
28-02-2005, 12:22
IPK sheets are water and tearproof. You will not rip one of these easily. I also saw somewhere those little clips from womens suspender belts being used to construct a shelter with those reflective foil blankets.
Top Idea Mate :biggthump
The other two ways I can think of off hand are to twist the corner and tie a simple overhand knot in it, then tie you guyline round that or put a small pebble/pine cone etc in the corner, tie it into a sort of small sack and then tie your guyline round this....
When I improvise a basha with poly I use a hangmans noose (jack ketch knot)to tie on the corners, it seems to hold well and is easy to undo again after. Just fold back the corner a little and slide the pre tied knot over and pull tight, if you use a stone or similar to make a lump make sure it is smooth so it doesnt cut the material, or use something soft,moss or cloth.
I think this is the best poncho for our hobby/lifeform:
Ferrino Tomodo Poncho (http://outdoors-magazine.com/s_article.php?id_article=116)