View Full Version : new, big cat sightings!
RAPPLEBY2000
02-12-2004, 01:39
weird link this but when i visit the in-laws i do a bit of bushcraft stuff or try new bits of kit on their farm land in the fens.
last time(2 weeks ago) my father in law was being very protective about me and asked me not to go out in the dark, i though they saw some strangers, or had locals playing up, no, they were concerned about a big cat that was seen the day before!
their plot is on a desolate main road inbetween march and wisbech often drivers walk to their gate for assistance (no fuel ect).
aparently some guy did this the night before saw a big black "puma" type cat tried to take pictures with his phone camera (7X) but it was too dark, he said he didn't want to be linked with the sighting!
my father inlaw went on to say three old women also saw the cat, later claiming they were drunk.
also there were recent reports of foals being attacked in the local area!
again he went on to say his son(my brother in law) had seen it sit on a mound of sand, near their land, he also saw it another time.
again he said another time they followed said cat at a distance in their car all the way through their land till it hopped over the fence!
and finally he mentioned a time in the middle of the night when the dogs were barking and they heard huge bangs on their roof, the banging went one side of the house (bungalow)to the other then onto farm buildings, then dissapeared.
possibly the sound of a large cat bounding onto and over the building, a fox would have been much quieter.
my father in law keeps goats, turkeys, ducks geese, ect so there is pleanty of reason for a big cat to be interested!
though the farm is in the fens, a vast flat open area of mostly crop farming there are small patches of woodland, and i personally have seen muntjack deer only half a mile from the farm.
by the way the surrounding land is mostly fields , most being privately owned, plus some huge estates, never open to public a big cat could easily survive, out of sight, hardly ever seeing a human.
it has deer, farm animals, horses, sheep, all easily in reach, then tens of square miles to dissapear into without being seen!
make your own mind up but it does seem possible! :shock:
i have not made my mind up yet, i believe my father in law, but i want proof!
i went out the next day to try to see tracks but i haven't seen any yet!
i'm fairly sure he won't let me camp overnight on his land because of all the recent sightings..... :rant: well what can you do :?:
well what can you do :?:
Video Camera + Fillet stake.. :?:
RAPPLEBY2000
02-12-2004, 02:02
right so i'll hold the steak and get my wife to film?
but seriously, if it is as real as it seems i don't want to mess with a big furry killing machine! that's if it got that close!
i don't want to reveal the location for obvious reasons but it might seem the ideal place to "stake out" (pardon the pun :roll: ) to see what happens!
sightings seem to be getting more common.
ok i was being partly serious.. i was thinking more tripod etc.. but what would be best would be if you could pick up traks and find a place it frequents or a place it i forced to go.. such as a gap in a hedge.. you get the idea..
RAPPLEBY2000
02-12-2004, 02:41
yeah....i just don't know when or where it will show up. could be a long wait! :?:
i do hava an infra red night vision system, and an automatic infra red sensor switch to record, thing so theoretically i could just leave the camera somewhere and it would film anything that moved in front of the camera!
still have to be very very lucky! :wink:
RovingArcher
02-12-2004, 05:37
Big cats are amazingly quiet. Their stealth has to compensate for their size when stalking their prey. As an example, a friend and I were hunting, actually, we were scouting in the afternoon and we happened on a cougar resting on the far side of a deadfall. My friend had passed on one side of the tree and me on the other. The cat scared us chitless when it jumped uphill 18 of our paces with one leap and disappered over a rise at a full run. The only sound we heard was the cats growl and the loose dirt spraying as he launched. We heard no footfalls what-so-ever. I have been close to or encountered 4 lions in the years I've been in bush. I've seen twice that from a distance and two were paralleling my movements. A very unsettling situation to be in, but I've yet to come close to being eaten, so I guess they were just practicing. :shock: :o):
If the cat was there, tracks will be hard to miss and trust me, there will be tracks if it was in the area. If the cat is staying in the area and not traveling, it should be just a matter of looking and you should be able to find some sign of it's existence.
C_Claycomb
02-12-2004, 09:02
Forget steak...go out and make noises like a tortured bunny :rolmao:
RAPPLEBY2000
02-12-2004, 10:35
the general opinion of my father in law seems to be that the cat may use his land as an out post rather than a regular hunting ground so much because of the dogs, and presence of my in-laws which seems sensible.
paw prints should be pretty easy to spot in the area due to all the mud in the fields.
i shall keep a look out!
Paganwolf
02-12-2004, 10:40
the general opinion of my father in law seems to be that the cat may use his land as an out post rather than a regular hunting ground so much because of the dogs, and presence of my in-laws which seems sensible.
paw prints should be pretty easy to spot in the area due to all the mud in the fields.
i shall keep a look out!
Take a digi camera when you look just in case :biggthump
the general opinion of my father in law seems to be that the cat may use his land as an out post rather than a regular hunting ground so much because of the dogs, and presence of my in-laws which seems sensible.
paw prints should be pretty easy to spot in the area due to all the mud in the fields.
i shall keep a look out!
thanks for the thread.. keep us posted :-)
bigjackbrass
02-12-2004, 14:07
Fortean Times magazine do an annual round-up of ABC (Alien Big Cat) sightings and reports, which is well worth reading next time you're camping out and fancy scaring the willies out of yourself.
I've seen one twice - nothing to be afraid of - they're just big puddy cats right? the worst they'll do is bat you around a bit and pretend you're a mouse.....
I've seen one twice - nothing to be afraid of - they're just big puddy cats right? the worst they'll do is bat you around a bit and pretend you're a mouse.....
So you didn't here about the mountain lion attack in California, two women out mountainbiking, lion jumps one of them, the other woman proceeds to have a tug of war with the cat using her friend as the rope, lion has head she has feet. Her cries for help attract a bunch of guys who manage to drive the lion off. The authorities then find that the lion had already killed another person.
I'm not saying that they are bloodthirsty killing machines but they are very efficient predators worthy of a great deal of respect. And I'd love to see one in the wilds of Norfolk!
RovingArcher
02-12-2004, 15:52
Forget steak...go out and make noises like a tortured bunny :rolmao:
LOL, as funny as that is, it really is true. I've never used a distress call for big cats, but have called in Coyote, Fox and Bobcat with a small glass bottle and cork.
Do have a digicam with you when you go out. Getting a photo of the cat or it's tracks and sign would be awesome.
How big do these cats get?
C_Claycomb
02-12-2004, 16:52
If you feel a little reticent about sitting in the dark making dying rabbit squeals, you could always buy the cassette! You can get recordings for predator calling. It could be a way of getting a photo opportunity without such a chance of a face to face meeting.
I have read about one guy getting a very close, unplanned, look at a cougar when using a distress call in the US, so it will work.
RovingArcher, the cats here are all things that have been let loose, so they run the range from bobcat/lynx all the way to African lion (though I think the police got on that tabby fast :lol: ). The ones that people worry about are puma and leopard. There are a LOT of reports of black cats. Since these critters have been brought in as pets and so on it isn't too much of a stretch to believe someone could have let a melanistic leopard out.
The number of cougar attacks on people has gone up in recent years in the US and Canada, but there are a lot more cats around (greater chance of meeting one, and more competition for territories), and a lot more people using trails through relatively remote wild areas. Joggers and cyclists do seem to be favoured.
Someone on here wrote about thumping a tiger through the bottom of their hammock when it bumped into them at night, and I read a nice account of a guy in South America being stuck in his hammock for quite a time because a jaguar was enjoying watching him swing back and forth! :rolmao:
It would be cool if a member here were to get a really good picture of a cat...it would be something of a first :biggthump
So you didn't here about the mountain lion attack in California, two women out mountainbiking, lion jumps one of them, the other woman proceeds to have a tug of war with the cat using her friend as the rope, lion has head she has feet. Her cries for help attract a bunch of guys who manage to drive the lion off. The authorities then find that the lion had already killed another person.
I'm not saying that they are bloodthirsty killing machines but they are very efficient predators worthy of a great deal of respect. And I'd love to see one in the wilds of Norfolk!
If there are many around it'll only be a matter of time before someone's killed over here and then we'll have the public screaming for their elimination.
Should we remove them? They're hardly native and they are downright dangerous but somehow it seems fair to leave them in place. I'm suprised given the bizzare things breeding in various corners of the country that there are no loose primates around Britain yet.
Any porcupines still around?
Realgar
Buckshot
03-12-2004, 09:58
There are some poeple who have been trying to catch/shoot them full time for many years, without success. And some of these poeple are good. :shock:
If they do kill someone, it's not going to be easy to track them down.
Cheers
Mark
by the way the surrounding land is mostly fields , most being privately owned, plus some huge estates, never open to public a big cat could easily survive, out of sight, hardly ever seeing a human.
you have your possible source there... it's far from unknown that the odd eccentric rich movie/pop/other star with an estate should own such animals that have subsequently escaped or been released.
Wasn't it in the 70's that they changed the law on keeping exotic pets?, If they are still around there must be a breeding population, or interbreeding, mountain lion/black panther hybrids. I am suprised that there hasn't been an attack on a person yet but it probably is only a matter of time.
I know one person who, unable to rehome them when the DWA came in, released a pair of puma up at snake pass.
As far as I know there have been a couple of attacks on people - none of them serious. The most recent - the kid swiped across the face - was apparently a hoax though.
The DWA really needs sorting out - anything that bans the keeping of three toed sloths as 'dangerous' but still allows the keeping of giant snakes is a bit messed up. Ok so no deaths in this country from keeping giant snakes yet but the US has had a few.
How's our wallaby population coming along these days? I haven't seen one for years.
Realgar
Plenty of Wallabies here, up on the downs :?: is that English, they escaped from Wipsenade Zoo and have been breeding on the Downs for years.
Has any one been to one of the talks Quentin Rose used to give on this subject? He was an ex Zoo keeper who specialised in capturing escaped zoo animals all across Europe also in capturing and moving "probleme" animals in zoos and safari parks ect.
He was probably one of the most knowledgeable persons on feral big cats in the UK. He was respected enough that many local police forces would call him in to investiagte sightings.
From his lectures, I recall him saying that about 95% of sighting/incidents he has investiagted personally or has enough evidence to draw a conclusion, were not cats. In however many years he had been examining "kills" only two or three were conclusively belonging to a big cat and he determined that be the presence and pattern of claw marks on the kill. If I remember correctly he thought there was probably under a dozen Leopard/puma size cats in the country at that time, but with an unknown number of Lynx as well. He really believed that unless something was done by DEFRA, we would have a major problem a few years down the line as numbers increased.
With regards the danger to the public, unless one is wounded or injured in some way, I think its pretty remote. Even in California where this the start of a problem, and where they have a very large and growing population of puma, I would bet statistically, more people die of bees stings. The danger in California could be reduced considerably if the local authorities allowed the hunting puma with hounds to start again, but sadly, I think you will need to see a few joggers or kids killed before that is likely to happen. For more info on known recorded attacks in North America take a lok at:
http://www.cougarinfo.com/attacks3.htm
Finally, just to show what might turn up if if you start using a fox call, see the pic below:
http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/member_images//353581-Cougar1.jpeg
The chap in the picture is an American hunter/guide called JJHack and he called the puma in for a friend and fellow hunter to shoot. The cat went to about 200lbs as I recall and JJ is not a small guy by any stretch. The photo is not doctored in any way, but the same photo has been circulating the Net and the story has "mutated" or morphed to the point its now mentioned in the urban legends website Snoops! JJ is actually a net buddy of mine and I recall him posting the pictures originally.
Regards,
Pete
The danger in California could be reduced considerably if the local authorities allowed the hunting puma with hounds to start again, but
There's a few hunts round here that I'd be happy to export to California, seeing as they serve no purpose here at all !! (If they ever did)
cheers,
Martin
hobbitboy
05-12-2004, 15:48
The "official" verdict on wallabies on Staffs moors is that they are extinct....but apparently (accordin to my ecology lecturer) thats more to stop people hunting for them and there may be some left....somewhere....
CM Burns
18-12-2004, 12:37
i've always been very interested in ABCs in the UK - i've had a long range siting of a Puma near Uxbridge (i have exceptionally good eyesight and know for certain what i saw!) plus friends near Lightwater have had a close encounter with a black panther on two occasions in the last 12 months...
Fortean Times (FT) have all their previous ABC articles in the archive section of their site for those who may be interested... it's a great read as sightings include lions and tigers :yikes:
In the current issue of FT there is mention of 2 occasions in 1974 when a total of 100 BABOONS escaped in Shropshire and Co Durham - note that not all of the latter were recaptured :yikes:
Last year 2 pumas escaped from animal parks in Northern Ireland - they were never recaptured
many of you will recall the story of the tigers kept in a New york apartment - well a spin off articl from that one explained that many US states have no laws controlling dangerous animals - it is estimated (cause there are no official figures) that there are 10,000 tigers in the US!!!!
thers is an organisation here in Scotland,called the wild beasts trust,who claim(and I hope its true) to have realised breeding population of lynx in the border forests.more power to them.
10,000 tigers in the US? Not a chance! You only have to know something about hunting in the States and the various State wildlife bodies to realise that a population 1/10th of that would be known and being monitored.
The so called "Florida Panther" is a good example of this that has a population a tiny fraction of that at probably only 30 to 50 individuals...
With regards the Lynx in Scotland, I hope it has not been re introduced through the "back door" as to become established it I suspect it will need legal protection.
I don't see a problem with re introducing it as it poses no danger to humans although it might pose a problem to people with live stock. The European lynx is quite a bit bigger than its American cousin and would have no problem taking animals the size of a large calf or even a pony...People say that they will live off deer ect but in reality they will take the easiest prey they can catch which in a lot of cases will be farm stock...
Regards,
Pete
CM Burns
19-12-2004, 09:22
10,000 tigers in the US? Not a chance! You only have to know something about hunting in the States and the various State wildlife bodies to realise that a population 1/10th of that would be known and being monitored.
The so called "Florida Panther" is a good example of this that has a population a tiny fraction of that at probably only 30 to 50 individuals...
With regards the Lynx in Scotland, I hope it has not been re introduced through the "back door" as to become established it I suspect it will need legal protection.
I don't see a problem with re introducing it as it poses no danger to humans although it might pose a problem to people with live stock. The European lynx is quite a bit bigger than its American cousin and would have no problem taking animals the size of a large calf or even a pony...People say that they will live off deer ect but in reality they will take the easiest prey they can catch which in a lot of cases will be farm stock...
Regards,
Pete
sorry Pete - i didn't make it clear - these 10,000 tigers are not in the wild in the US, they're being kept as pets, private animal sanctuaries etc - do a web search you will find sites selling these animals!
R-Bowskill
02-01-2005, 14:37
Back in 1973 / 4 I found a Scottish wildcat that had been run over on the lane going past the farmworkers cottage I lived in at the time in Nottinghamshire. They were supposed to be extinct in England for a long time back then. Plus there have been another couple of road kills to prove that there are big cats in the UK. I'm not sure of the status of the 'Kellas cat' from Scotland, whether it's a hybrid or whatever but some of these are well known.
Unfortunately the usual sighting is made by people with little experience of the kind of wildlife observation and track interpritation that bushcrafters might have.
last year two suspected killers hid in the forests of nottinghamshire for a few weeks and the police knew it was useless to try to find them so an animal that is wary of people is going to be much harder to find.