View Full Version : Recommendations for Starter Kit
webmuppet
10-12-2008, 14:01
I was wondering what peeps would suggest for starter kit for variable weather general backwoods hiking and camping on a budget - the general gear that you think someone would need. Makes and ballpark prices would be handy. With so many companies producing seemingly quality stuff but with huge variations on price it's hard to decide what's a reliable bargain and avoid the cheap dross.
The things that come to mind are
Rucksack
Sleeping bag
Bivi
Tent
Tarp
Hammock
Knife
Hobo stove
Cooking equipment
Fire starting
Boots
Jacket
Warm light type clothes for under jacket
Lighting (head torch / lamp)
First aid kit
Navigation equipment
Feel free to add any that you think are necessary
Cheers for the help
subedarmajor
10-12-2008, 14:22
For the knife you can't go far wrong with a Frosts Clipper.
Yes I know it's what everyone says but it's cheap as chips and will do about anything you want it to. You'd probably want to file the back of the blade flat for using with a fire flash though.
Which brings me on to fire lighting; get a fire flash or a flint and steel. These are both simple and reliable.
Tent: I have a Gelert Solo I think it cost me about £25. It's small and light with just enough space for you and a little bit of kit. It's also quite easy to put up.
Be prepared to spend money on your boots. I have a pair of Peter Storm boots that cost about £50 in a sale at Millets.
I hope this helps,
Alan.
Start simple would be my advise.
For example do you really NEED all these...
Bivi
Tent
Tarp
Hammock
I started with an MOD issue bivvy bag and shelter sheet (tarp) as did most on here I would imagine.
Personally, I never take a tent to the woods - a tarp does fine.
Don't spend lots of money on gear until you are sure it is the item / spec / manufacturer for you. You can see a wide range of gear at the meets, and most (all?) of us enjoy talking about our kit.
Ex Army kit is cheap and relatively robust and is a good starting point for most items IMHO.
HTH
Simon
subedarmajor
10-12-2008, 14:31
Ex Army kit is cheap and relatively robust and is a good starting point for most items IMHO.
HTH
Simon
That's a very good point Simon, I forgot about that.
I must admit that I do own some ex-army kit; i.e. A full set of '58 Pattern webbing and a swedish army rucksack from the late forties early fifties.
It's good robust kit.
I must admit to being a bit of a kit junky. If I see something "shiny" I can usually think of half a dozen reasons the spot why I "need" it! :)
Cheers, Alan.
As an after thought...
Two items of kit that are probably worth spending more on are your boots and sleeping bag. You are wearing / using one or the other all the time and need to be up to the job!
Simon
Bivi
Tent
Tarp
Hammock
I'd agree that this is over the top. I started with The tent (because I had one anyway) but now use my tarp/bivi combination in the woods much more often. I tend to use the tent on campsites where a little propriety is needed. I've yet to go down the hammock route and can't really see myself doing it. I guess I'm just built to be a ground dweller.
HillBill
10-12-2008, 16:18
Whats your budget? How long you planning on staying out for? These 2 questions will influence your choice more with regards to Rucksack( 1or 2 nights 30 to 45 litres more go for 45+), sleeping bag and boots.
Are you camping in woodland( Tarp, bivvi OR hammock) or open land ( tent)?
Knife -- Frosts Clipper ( cant go wrong on a budget)
Cooking -- Billy cans are generally favoured due to versatility
Utensils -- spork ( cheap tough light, all you need)
Hobo stove-- Make your own ( good on a budget, fuel available anywhere, do a search on here)
Fire starting -- Take whatever you can use (matches/lighter are reliable, firesteel if you know how)
Folding saw-- most will do ( Bahco laplander if you want quality and durability)
First aid kit -- make your own( for blisters burns and cuts and some painkillers)
Navigation -- map and a decent compass ( silva)
Torch -- headtorches offer more versatility (Petzl Tikka xp are very good)
Clothing is a personal choice. Military kit is tough and cheap as has been said.
webmuppet
10-12-2008, 16:25
Whats your budget? How long you planning on staying out for? These 2 questions will influence your choice more with regards to Rucksack( 1or 2 nights 30 to 45 litres more go for 45+), sleeping bag and boots.
Are you camping in woodland( Tarp, bivvi OR hammock) or open land ( tent)?
Knife -- Frosts Clipper ( cant go wrong on a budget)
Cooking -- Billy cans are generally favoured due to versatility
Utensils -- spork ( cheap tough light, all you need)
Hobo stove-- Make your own ( good on a budget, fuel available anywhere, do a search on here)
Fire starting -- Take whatever you can use (matches/lighter are reliable, firesteel if you know how)
Folding saw-- most will do ( Bahco laplander if you want quality and durability)
First aid kit -- make your own( for blisters burns and cuts and some painkillers)
Navigation -- map and a decent compass ( silva)
Torch -- headtorches offer more versatility (Petzl Tikka xp are very good)
Clothing is a personal choice. Military kit is tough and cheap as has been said.
I was thinking general but short trips. So only 1 or 2 nights but possibly woodland or mountain/moor.
Natural shelters sound fine but I'd want a tent and tarp/hammock until I was super confident that it wouldn't go amusingly wrong :D
HillBill
10-12-2008, 16:33
A tarp/bivvi combo can be used anywhere. It just requires a different set up to woodlands. Rather than tying it to trees you either make a couple of poles from branches or carry telescopic poles with you and set it up more like a tent.
webmuppet
10-12-2008, 16:40
I don't want to sound like a big jessie but I'm wondering how comfy a hammock really is (for someone who doesn't sleep well at the best of times). It looks fun but the position you sleep in looks like your bum is way lower than your feet and head. I'd probably spend the night waiting to fall on my head :)
Wilderbeast
10-12-2008, 17:07
I don't want to sound like a big jessie but I'm wondering how comfy a hammock really is (for someone who doesn't sleep well at the best of times). It looks fun but the position you sleep in looks like your bum is way lower than your feet and head. I'd probably spend the night waiting to fall on my head :)
Surprisingly if you rig up a hammock well they are soooooooo comfortable, just make sure you wack a sleeping matt in the bottom of the hammock to keep yourself warm, otherwise you get a cold bum!
PJMCBear
10-12-2008, 17:32
I don't want to sound like a big jessie but I'm wondering how comfy a hammock really is (for someone who doesn't sleep well at the best of times). It looks fun but the position you sleep in looks like your bum is way lower than your feet and head. I'd probably spend the night waiting to fall on my head :)
I rarely sleep in a tent or on the ground these days. I just find the hammock so comfortable. I always have a better night sleep in the hammock. Even better than the KS bed at home. Although that could have something to do with a wee dram or two extra I have whilst out. :D
I don't want to sound like a big jessie but I'm wondering how comfy a hammock really is (for someone who doesn't sleep well at the best of times). It looks fun but the position you sleep in looks like your bum is way lower than your feet and head. I'd probably spend the night waiting to fall on my head :)
Like others, I sleep better in my hammock than I do my bed at home.
Although that could have something to do with a wee dram or two extra I have whilst out.
You do need insulation below you tho; either a roll mat, half inflated thermarest or an underblanket. (My choice is an underblanket.)
If you can get to a meet, I'm sure someone would let you try one out...
Simon
Well you already have an old rucksack so you already have something to carry your kit in, which is a start.
Clothing.
Don't spend huge amounts getting all the gear - wait a bit and see what works for you. Trousers- old army lightwieghts are tough, fast drying and cheap (in bushcraft you spend a lot of time grubbing around on your knees, so trousers get a lot of wear). Cheap woolen jumpers (charity shop jobs) are warm and you can get lots of thin ones (always dress loose and in layers). A good woollen hat. A weather proof jacket, again from a surplus store or charity shop. Garden gloves to protect your hands from the environment and hot pans.
Boots - if you have the money get good ones - if not army surplus assault boots, keep painting them with veg oil until the leather won't take any more. This makes them supple and very waterproof.
A frosts knife, cheap, reliable, etc.
A fire steel or a couple of throw away lighters (which ever your confident using)
A reliable torch - Alpkit do a very good headtorch for £12 or so.
A Small first aid kit.
A folding saw (Laplander -£20)
The rest of your kit comes under four headings:
SHELTER, WARMTH, WATER, FOOD
Shelter - get yourself a basha or poncho and some strong cordage (£25-£30)
Kip mat and a sleeping bag (Endicotts in Exeter do a bagcalled the Phantom for about £30 which is very good indeed and warm enough for year ruond UK use). A bivi bag - they are nice - but we never used to have them and I don't remember too many cold wet miserable nights.
Warmth - few of those charity shop jumpers and a scarf or headover.
Food - a good cooking pot with a bail handle (so it can be suspended over a fire) and a reliable cooker (for when you can't get a fire) - try the swedish army mess kit - complete with all you need (£10)
Water - any plastic pop bottle can be used, just wrap it in duct tape. Or go for a couple from the surplus store. Get yourself a millbank bag for filtering and get in the habit of boiling all your water.
That should get you started
Neil
Sussex Man
11-12-2008, 10:56
Rucksack - Swedish army rucksack/ eabay £6-£10
Sleeping bag - Issue sleeping system or arctic sleeping bag (very good quality) £5-£50 pending on age.
Bivi - eaby again issue are good olive green ones still available/ £10-£30
Tent- don't need one now as you have just gor a bivi.
Tarp- I got a great one from Katmandu (don't know if they still exist) look at a new army issue poncho, this also doubles as a waterproof/ £20 new.
Hammock- I prefer sleeping on the ground, but DD hammocks are very good and cheap/£20 ish
Knife- mmm the moras are good , and very cheap £5-£10, or a second hand fjallkniven F1.
Hobo stove- as said before, either make it or go for the swedish army trangia, they are excellent, got my Stainless steel version for £9/eaby
Cooking equipment- forks can be made, sporks are ok , take one of your mums wooden spoons, till you work out how to make one.
Fire starting- lighter as a backup, ferous rod is better, however learn to light fire by friction its the basis of bushcraft, look into char cloth etc.
Boots- you can now get new army pro boots for about £50- they are very good, just don't stand on any nails.
Jacket- flecktarn smock (less rambo looking) i got one from a bootsale for £3.
Warm light type clothes for under jacket- as said before charity shops, stick to wool, a local one to me had a very new looking barbour woolen jumper for £5!!!
Lighting (head torch / lamp) head torch it has to be- tikka is one of the best. very good for camp, I have now got used to walking in the woods with no torch, i love it - so peachfull and you can hear alot more for some reason.
First aid kit- plasters, pain killers, a bandage (field dressing) whiskey.
Navigation equipment a cheap silva base plate compass £5/ebay.
Dont believe the hype of modern fabrics and over engineered gadgets. The time you will realy need bushcraft, you'll have nothing on you !
Cheap clothing from the army-shop:
used US-Army ECWCS-Parka+Trouser. It's a 3-layer GoreTex-suit. Soemtimes you find very cheap ones (look for the original army issue). Very good for foul weather.
Wool as thermal layer.
Head torch - Alpkit Gamma, £12.50 inclusive of batteries and shipping
Thermal Mat - Alpkit Airic / Slim Airic at £25 (it's more expensive than a foam one, but they are a better item).
Bivvy Bag - Alpkit Hunka £30 (generally they are cheaper and lighter and pack smaller than military issue).
Boots are very much a personal thing, Assault boots will be cheaper and if you get on with them they could save you a lot of money in the long term.
The knife, I think everyone will tell you go for the a frosts, either the clipper or the old wooden handled ones are the beastie to go for. Prices vary.
Mess set - you could do a lot worse than a £12.99 gelert trek1 cook set (http://www.gelert.com/products/Trek_1_Cook_Set.aspx)
A folding saw - there are a few out there, either the Opinel or the laplander would work well.
DD Hammocks - they are one of the cheaper hammocks to buy, but they are pretty good.
Someone mentioned that you should spend more on certain bits of kit, this I agree with, a decent sleeping bag / system is a must. You need to decide if you are gonna be out year round and where you maybe out. That will give you an idea on the type of bag you will require. After that people should be ablle to give informed advice.
sasquatch
11-12-2008, 12:30
I agree with pretty much all of this advice, the only thing I've spent much money on is a US Modular Sleep System by Tennier. £100 delivered off Ebay and worth every penny! It has 2 sleeping bags that snap together that can be snapped into the Bivvi bag that comes with it. Just make sure not to get a cheap Milsim one! They're the only sleep system you'll need and it's not going to get to -40 in the UK so you shouldn't need all 3 unless you sleep really cold. Now you can camp all year round.
I started hammock camping a year ago and I'll never go back to tents unless I'm with my family. I'm making my 3 year old son one for this spring as he loves them too. In my opinion they're far more comfortable than sleeping on the ground! A DD Travel hammock is a good start, you'll soon be making your own I'm sure.
I have loads of surplus gear and clothing as I don't have lots to spend but as people have said it's cheaper and just as effective as a lot of brand name stuff. Homemade gear will soon follow as you figure out what works for you and what you want to do. The main thing is to get out there and enjoy yourself and surroundings!
You may as well resign yourself to the fact that you will buy things that don't work for you and spend their life in the cupboard or get bined as useless.
What you expect from gear and how you use it changes as your interests change so what suits you now probably won't seem as useful in 5 years time and then will change again 5 years after that.
Having been brought up by parents who never seemed to throw anything away I'd say don't rush to spend lots of money until you're clear where your interests really are and don't throw anything away - you just never know when you might find it's just the bit of kit you need. In addition you'll have the delight in years to come to be able to look at a bit of gear pulled from the back of the shed and think "what on earth possessed me to buy that". Any one want a pair of pink wellies?
Spikey DaPikey
11-12-2008, 15:11
http://www.bushcraftuk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=18667
A good thread started by Maddave :)
John Fenna
11-12-2008, 15:35
If you are a real cheapskate - make some of your own kit!
There is a little booklet on this some where on this site......:rolleyes: :D
And - -ofcourse - there are lots of great tutorials dotted around as well!
The advise given sounds sound to me as a starter kit. What i have found though is that most of it is to do with weight. The lighter you want to go, the more expensive your kit will be.
You can spend hundreds on the latest fancy smanshy light kit but if you add a dutch oven one day all that weight saving and extra money has gone out the window.
I would say that a fair few people settle on 2 types of kit. The pack your van, bring everything and a carryable weight kit for overnighters on foot.
If you are going to use a car to get there and only have a few hundred meters to your site from the car it's not worth being an ounce counter. However if you are hiking for more than a few miles you will curse every extra ounce you have on your back.
People don't stray too far either side of issue kit ( weightwise ) imho for general use kit.
The group buy hammock is excellent but in order to get remotely comfortable i have to sleep width ways with a fully blown up thermorest.
Woolen undies and a warm beanie will keep you warmer than £300 worth of expensive jackets.
Use the kit you have for now. You don't want to spend a few hundred quid on fancy smanshy and then get interested in going primitive or finding a passion for wrought iron tripods, cauldrons and blanket coats.
If you are going to buy a tent make sure it is easy to put up and take down...in the rain ...or when the kids won't help. After many purchases i have settled on the single pole design of the bison lavvu.
The knife and fork in the kitchen drawer are just as good as the latest alpine mountaineering ultra light 20 quid ones. Forget to shave or just have a good belch and you've wasted £20!
Most of all, have fun. One of the things i like about bushcraft is window shopping all the latest gear and maybe having a bit of retail therapy every once in a while just for the hell of it.:)
I don’t know how comfortable you would be with my setup, but here is what I use:
Shelter:
Tarp-DD Hammock Tarp 3x3m-about $60.00 (sorry, all the prices are in dollars)
Bivi/Sleeping Bag-US Modular Sleep System-$300.00 new (it includes two sleeping bags, one rated to 30F the other to -10F which clip together and go down to -30F. A Gore-Tex Bivi is also included and clips to the bags-not a fancy bivi, but works great)
Sleeping Mat-closed cell foam mat-US army surplus-$20.00
Water:
Canteen-1Qt US Army canteen with the canteen cup and holder-$15.00
MSR 6L reinforced water bladder-$30.00?
MSR Mini Works EX water filter-$60.00
Cooking:
MSR Whisperlite International-$70.00
Snowpeak titanium 1L pot or MSR titanium 2L pot if with my girlfriend-both cost way too much. Any billycan will do, although it will weigh more.
Knife/Tools:
Belt Knife-RAT 7-$90.00
Spoon Knife-Mora-$10.00
Saw-Kershaw folding saw-$20.00
Multi tool-Leatherman Charge TTI-$80.00
Fallkniven sharpening stone (3in)-$30.00
Light:
Main Light-NiteCore D10-$60.00
Pocket Light- Fenix E01-$10.00 (much, much better than the Maglite mini)
Lantern-CR123A Lithium Pack-Away Lantern-$60.00 (don’t use it that much because the batteries are so expensive)
First Aid Kit:
Homemade (the only thing you might want to spend money on is some Quick Cloth sponges-they work better than bandages for large cuts, and are much easier to carry-cost a lot through-about $10.00 per sponge)
Fire:
Light My Fire Army Model-$20.00
Disposable Lighter
Waterproof Matches
I also carry other small things like rope, soap, Purel, etc..
drewdunnrespect
19-01-2009, 22:27
well a starter kit i baught snugpack softie elite 5 season and also it ges down to minus 15 comfortable and - 25 live but a bit chilly ie uncomfortable T
Then baught my self a dd hammock a mosinet and underblanket a dd tarp which leaked. (now fixed but bust agian difrent problem please note it is not the tarp they sell now it is an old modle). Then i baught my self a kelly kettle love it but not used much due to campin with out car, (but that i due to change now i have a car).
boots all ready had they are kat workmens wear boots ausome is what they are
then baught my self a small tarp no make works mint then baught the daddy of all tarps the true north out doors big tarp.
and have a massed other gear as required it cheers drew
big_swede
19-01-2009, 23:13
Don't buy so much stuff. Try to limit it to bare essentials.
Coffe tin billy can.
Blanket or sleeping bag.
Tarp.
Knife.
Clothing you already have (otherwise you would be a very eccentric and frozen guy). Try to see what you need and what you can improvise in the bush. That way you will develop skill and confidence, and you will gain experience. After a few outings start to evaluate what your goals with wilderness living is, is it to gain more skills (if so what skills), getting closer to wildlife, bragging for your mates, getting in touch with your primitive side, or maybe something simple as impressing girls? After you have decided in what way you wanna improve and evolve try seeing what stuff you need to meet your goals. Buying stuff on the base that other people use it is kind of silly, unless you want to do exactly what they do.
A sewing machine and knitting needles are my best bushy investments, and my favourite outdoors shop is a charity shop.
Just a quick note on boots. I have a pair of £160 Meindle walking boots... sat in my cupboard at home! My favourite boots, are a pair of £15 British army issue, that I got from my local Army Surpluss store. They're really comfy, 100% waterproof and about half the weight of the Meindles.
As for my stove, that was free. I use a home made pop can stove (see youtube)
Get a decent sized metal mug you've got a complete cook system for the price of the mug.
You can buy perfectly serviceable tarpaulins from eBay or your local cheap shop for about £2 as long as you don't mind them being bright blue.
You can pick up a folding saw for about £4, not as good as the £20 bahco saws, but will do the job (don't go for the 'survival' wire saws, they're useless as they snap).
I have a couple of £45- £50 Hand forged axes (GB), but one of my favourites is a little second-hand hatchet I picked up on eBay for £1.99. It turned out to be made from really good steel, and (after a bit of TLC), it will happily hold a shaving edge all day long.
You don't need to spend a lot of money to get really good kit. I must admit, I get more satisfaction from the kit I've made/restored myself, or was a real bargain, than I do from kit that's ready to go straight out of the box.
Aussiepom
20-01-2009, 03:25
I'd go along with most of the above, and the advice of carefully considering which bits of kit to spend most of your money on is sound. The only difference of opinion I have is this: If you're just going to be knocking about in the woods why bother spending a fortune on expensive hiking boots? In fact why the need for boots at all?
Boots do have their place, but if you are carrying a light load and not hiking for miles and miles with a 50 lb pack then you don't need the ankle support of stiff boots, or the extra weight and cost that they incur.
For years now I've gone the route of taking a light load and just wearing trainers. Not the kind of latest fashion footwear that you see all the kids wearing up the high street, but the type that are used by adventure racers or as 'approach shoes' by climbers. They are light, comfortable, have good grip on the soles, and are far cheaper.
Just my thoughts on the matter.
A few quick ideas off the top of my head
Army Bergen £30
Mora knife £10
Set of army mess tins £5
Crusader mug £10 delivered or a cheap insulated mug £1.99
Thermarest clone £15 (Argos)
Army 95 sleeping bag, grade one, £29.50
Tent, small dome, take your pick £35
Cheap poly tarp off eBay to practise with £8 and use the tent until you know what you are doing with a tarp, forget the Hammock this year
Roll of paracord £5
Swedish Army Trangia £10, you can upgrade to a proper stove later
Head torch, Tesco, £3.99
Tesco Cree torch £7
Boots, maybe army type about £20 or trainers
Waterproof jacket, if you don't own an anorak use an army Gortex about £30
Use the clothes you use at home to start you off, jumpers etc
Thats come in around £200 and for that you have shelter, sleep kit, carry kit, cooking kit, so your up and running.
Upgrade as you gain experience and knowledge, try and find others to go camping with, and remember your better off spending £200 on basics and being able to afford to go out camping, than blowing your budget on some expensive bit of kit that has the right 'label' but means you don't have the money to actualy get out and use it.
Have fun:)
The guys here are right. Don't waste your money if you are not sure what way you want to go. Just be careful not to fall into the trap of spending alot on money on many cheap items. I remember when I was first starting out I decided to make my own stove in order to save money. I must have spent several hundred dollars making different cheap stoves. It would have cost less to just buy one at the beginning.
Also, I don't know how the water is where you live, but where I camp, there is very little water, and when you find it is will probably be in a swamp. If you are in a similar area, you need a good filter. If on the other hand you have access to clean water, just get some tabs.
big_swede
20-01-2009, 22:07
The guys here are right. Don't waste your money if you are not sure what way you want to go. Just be careful not to fall into the trap of spending alot on money on many cheap items. I remember when I was first starting out I decided to make my own stove in order to save money. I must have spent several hundred dollars making different cheap stoves. It would have cost less to just buy one at the beginning.
Also, I don't know how the water is where you live, but where I camp, there is very little water, and when you find it is will probably be in a swamp. If you are in a similar area, you need a good filter. If on the other hand you have access to clean water, just get some tabs.
If the water is clean, wouldn't it be enough to boil it? That's all I do at least. I guess there is a definition issue with the word clean. Hmm, do you mean clean as in 'not muddy' (small amount of humus particles) or as in not polluted (with chemicals) or as in not contaminated with bacteria (e.koli and others)?
If the water is clean, wouldn't it be enough to boil it? That's all I do at least. I guess there is a definition issue with the word clean. Hmm, do you mean clean as in 'not muddy' (small amount of humus particles) or as in not polluted (with chemicals) or as in not contaminated with bacteria (e.koli and others)?
Milbank bag it
Then boil it :)
In the UK though, if it a day or overnight trip I take 2litre bottles of spring water from Lidl, about 25 pence for the 2 litres
wildebassman
22-01-2009, 14:41
If you're going to do a lot of rambling don't compromize on boots.
I use Lowa Mountain boots, pretty darn expensive but reliable and comfortable,
cost about £125 at ROvs.
Cheers,
Dennis.
sandsnakes
23-01-2009, 10:47
Try this chap for boots. With warm dry feet everything becomes a joy!
I have tried both expensive and cheap, Greman Para boots (new ones) come out tops for comfort, support and softness IMHO.
http://stores.ebay.co.uk/Desert-Daves-ToolBOX
If the water has a lot of sediment it will be hard to drink, even if sterilized. If the water is clear, boiling it should be fine. The Milbank is a good idea. I never got into the boiling of my water because I don't always have the time to sit, start a fire and boil. It seems to me like that works best only when you are already in camp.