Endicott's Modified Dutch Bivi Bag Review [Archive]

View Full Version : Endicott's Modified Dutch Bivi Bag Review

littlebiglane

29-06-2008, 09:39

Endicott's have bought in a batch of centre and side opening Dutch issue 'Goretex' Bivy Bags in excellent condition. They are modifying these (to order) at the moment with heavy duty YKK zips.

The bags weigh 1300 grammes. This is due to the heavy duty construction, quality of the materials and also because of the rather useful kip-mat holders (more of which later). However the whole package feels robust and reliable. The few extra grams I'll just have to shave off somewhere else. However - for those ultra-light freaks out there this modest weight will probably have you shaking your heads.

The modified bag costs £49 and the link is 'ere

http://www.endicotts.co.uk/product_info.php?cPath=95&products_id=720&osCsid=c22a23de7433312ae2d1312 bd087712a

The side opening one is 'ere http://www.endicotts.co.uk/product_info.php?cPath=95&products_id=721&osCsid=c22a23de7433312ae2d1312 bd087712a

Here is the bag being tested and modelled by my VERY understanding wife (!).

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1521.jpg
You will see that it has a large protection flap over the zip area.

It is a roomy bag (my wife is 5' 8" and I am 6ft) and there is plenty of spare foot room for longer framed people. I am 16 stone and find the space more than ample.

The sleeping bag was a down one and the loft was not affected much by the weight of the fabric. The round bulls-eye foot area helped this lofting.

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1617.jpg

The fabric is PTFE backed with a brushed face to it. Inside has the usual micro-mesh-facing over the membrane and the sealed seams to help movement in the bag (membranes are notorious for clinging to your sleeping bag material) and create a more comfortable environment.

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1628.jpg

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1618.jpg

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1615.jpg

The face-hood area has a draw-cord

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1612.jpg

This is the inside view of the modified Zip (YKK):

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1627.jpg

This is an outside view of the zip which is under the sizeable storm flap:

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1543.jpg

The underside of the bag has a pair of kip-mat holders. I have found these very useful as I tend to 'migrate' off my matt in the night. It has also been useful in a hammock as it has secured my matt (for extra warmth) underneath me - otherwise the matt tends to shift during the night. The kip matt holders are quite narrow so I would look to use either the narrower models of self-inflating matts or a cut down closed cell one. If you do not want this feature or want to strip a few grammes off the package then you could cut these holders off. But I quite like the option and the few extra grammes.

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1611.jpg

Now to the testing:

I filled the test area with a hosepipe (well my 2-year old did) to a depth of 1 - 1.5 inches.

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1522.jpg

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1528.jpg

Covering the bag directly with water and spraying it

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1525.jpg

The water beaded off well

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1526.jpg

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1527.jpg

Of course this amount of water under pressure did 'wet out' the surface of the bag eventually!

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1532.jpg

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1530.jpg

The weight of the water did affect the loft of the bag. But this would affect all bags and it would be unusual for such a puddle to remain on a bag in such a way (unless you lay very still all night!)

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1531.jpg

I had my 'model' roll from one side to the other to ensure the sides of the bag got wet and also to simulate natural rolling in the night. Of course if you rolled right over on your front then the zip and the storm flap (and your face opening) would be in the water!

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1534.jpg

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1535.jpg

The end result: a very wet test area and wet outer to the bag - all over.

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1536.jpg

Underneath the storm flap the zip was dry:

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1540.jpg

With no sign of water ingress due to spray or direct application of water to the flap area at the mid-point of the zip.

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1541.jpg

This was the same for the bottom of the zip but managed to flick some water under the flap as I opened it to take the photo. Even if this was not the case - this was the area that had the most water poured onto it. It remained dry.

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1542.jpg

However the zip itself is not water-resistant (I would argue that it does not need to be under this highly effective storm flap and under normal usuage). But as you can see when I poured some water directly onto the zip it went through:

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1624.jpg

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/IMGP1623.jpg

In conclusion I would give this bag my thumbs up with a 3.5 - 4 out of 5

Pros:
Quality of construction and materials
A good quality YKK Zip modification
Massive Storm Flap
Kip Mat holders
Centre opening - great for hammock use - a doddle to get in and out of (even with a side opening sleeping bag)
Good price for condition of bag and modification.
Endy's Customer Service

Cons:
A slightly more weighty package than many - by around 300gms.
Kip mat holders could be a cm or two wider (very minor niggle) but do the job well
If you sleep in rivers then any opening (zip, flap or otherwise) on the bag will not do!

Simon H

29-06-2008, 10:08

Very good review. I have wondered about those.

I've got an old British army one and I always have my mat in the bivi bag in an effort to stay on the thing (still doesn't work), having those mat holders would probably save a fair bit of wear and tear on the bottom of the bag too.

SimonM

29-06-2008, 11:22

Good review, thanks :You_Rock_ .

I can only imagine the answer I would get off my SWMBO if I asked her to do that modelling job! :censored: :nutkick: :slap:

Simon

Jedadiah

29-06-2008, 14:18

Rep deserved for such a comprehensive trail and review. Bordering on extreme testing, you (and the family) went that little bit further than any before. Well done LBL, no flannel, just facts (and a great deal of plastic and water)! :)

littlebiglane

29-06-2008, 20:30

Thanks Jedadiah, Simon H and SimonM for the appreciation. Always good to get feedback after a review :D:headbang:

My wife scowled furiously when she saw that I was posting a picture of her on the Internet (even if she was in a bag). I said it could have been ALOT worse and could root around for some less clad ones :D ;)

At that point she :nutkick: :buttkick: :twak: :sulkoff:

And I said :sad6:

hiraeth

29-06-2008, 20:45

Great review, its convinced me to get hold of one.

steveo

30-06-2008, 09:20

Great review ! thanks for that...:)

andy_e

30-06-2008, 10:00

I've already got one of these and I mod'ed it myself a while back. Many thanks for the review, it's good to see it fares well under your comprehensive testing, usually I'll be using it under a tarp so I'm glad to know it'll hold up to much worse than I've subjected it to :D

p.s. Kudos to Mrs. Littlebiglane :D

verloc

30-06-2008, 10:12

These caught my eye the other day when I was browsing Endi's website. They look really good. I actually called Kevin at Endicotts and unfortunately he isn't taking any more orders for this at the moment as his seamstress who does the mod is off sick with a poorly back at the moment and he needs to fulfil the orders he already has.

Hopefully this will change soon cos they look awesome!

Cheers for the review - that's some serious hardcore testing.

malente

30-06-2008, 11:38

Thanks for this great review!

Now it's time to buy your SWMBO some flowers for an excellent modelling job!

Mine would probably :argue: :censored: :sulkoff: :eek: :swordfigh :tapedshut :rant: :rant: :rant:

Regarding the weight of the whole bivy bag, I've got a tent that comes to 1450g including poles & pegs.. I think I stick with that for the moment. But if I had the money I'd go for one!

:D

Mike

bushscout1

01-07-2008, 00:23

LBL

Great review, it's firmed up my decision to get one, as I've been interested in them for ages - just got to sort out the finances.

One quick question, I may have missed it but if not, you mention the water repellency in your review, I take it that there were not wet patches inside the bag after the test (apart from what went through the zip)?

Well done to you and the family for a top job :You_Rock_

littlebiglane

01-07-2008, 18:16

VIRULENT SALAMANDER

14-07-2008, 12:58

.... ..
***** Bivi Bag Review
beholden!

Rebel

14-07-2008, 17:10

Good review, thanks. I've been looking at bivvy bags and this one might be a good choice.

Nelis

10-09-2008, 15:46

Hi folks,

Like the review as I have an dutch army bivy bag myself (actually the complete set with the sleeping bag and sheets).

Might be usefull to put a zip in though.

Just one question, how do you close the storm flap properly when you are alone, after the zipper has been closed (The flap should be very tight shouldn't it) ?

Celt_Ginger

10-09-2008, 16:11

I guess you could roll over on it.

addo

10-09-2008, 20:03

I put a zip in my dutch bivi and took it to the arctic. Fantasic bit of kit.

redandshane

10-09-2008, 21:06

I have one
only complaint is the weight if hiking
otherwise bombproof

Mastino

10-09-2008, 21:34

Here as well, great bag & did the mod myself. Just to save some weight I removed all the stud fasteners using pliers. I also have the huge sleeping bag that goes with it (-300 rating a think;) ) but thats a bit of kit I will probably never use because you'll need a truck just to take it with you...

Mesquite

10-09-2008, 21:39

Does anyone know what the actual dimensions are of the bag?

ncarvajal

13-09-2008, 22:13

LittleBigLane -

Would a 60cm wide sleep mat fit in the matt holders? Does anyone else with this bag know?

Thanks,
NC

woodstock

13-09-2008, 22:40

Does anyone know what the actual dimensions are of the bag?

Hi Mesquite mine is the bog standard bought about 10years ago sizes are in inches

L=94
W=32
bottom sec.21
and the mat straps are 20

littlebiglane

14-09-2008, 07:28

LittleBigLane -

Would a 60cm wide sleep mat fit in the matt holders? Does anyone else with this bag know?

Thanks,
NC

Sorry - I gave the bivy bag back after I reviewed it. I must make it clear in my reviews which ones I have bought and which ones I have borrowed to review.

The dutch bivy and the smock were both borrowed. I stated that in the smock review but not the bivy one. Sorry. The other products I have review on BCUK have been bought by me.

Thanks to Woodstock for providing the dimensions. I found the kip-mat holders a little too narrow for a standard 'thermarest' of the older/square style. Though it did fit with a bit of jamming though :) . I expect you might have to narrow down a foam mat a bit too - which would not be a problem because once the matt was fitted you would not roll off it. I don't know if the new-style/mummy style thermarests would be a better fit because they are tapered top and bottom a bit. You can call Kev at Endicotts and he can try to fit some matts for you and then tell you which fit and which don't and what their dimensions are.

I found the bag quite roomy. As Woodstock has stated - I have no doubt that he is right that it is 32 inches across - or 64 inches round.

ncarvajal

14-09-2008, 23:49

littlebiglane

20-09-2008, 16:56

Thanks very much for the information mate. I will call Endicott's tomorrow in the hope that they are able to measure the kip mat holders for me. I'll post the info on here when I get it as it might be of use to someone else.

NC

Oh yes - I just spotted on their site that they have kip-mats (Artkis ones, flat/folding) that are 18inches wide and would fit nicely into the holders. I am thinking of one myself.

http://www.endicotts.co.uk/product_info.php?cPath=75&products_id=1221

Celt_Ginger

20-09-2008, 19:02

mmmmm, I have a German folding kip mat in OG. I guess it's much the same as the Artkis ones. It should fit the Dutch bivi ok

Sniper

11-10-2008, 23:47

littlebiglane

12-10-2008, 07:49

I noticed that on their website that they are providing these bags and the zips seperate at the moment because of a problem with the seamstress being off sick but Kevin at Endicott's is hoping to have the fully modified bags back in circulation in a couple of weeks time while they catch up on the backlog. Just for information folks if any of you were thinking of ordering one of them

I used a modified one last weekend for 3 nights. Very good. Robust and breathable. The kipmat holders are a real bonus - stopping you wandering off of it in the night and also reducing wear on the base of the bivy. Just one thing - I found it quite challenging doing the flap up and then zipping it up as the zip is not like one of those on sleeping bags that the head 'flips' over so you can do the zip up from the inside as well as the outside. I have contacted Kevin to see if this can be done (I am sure it can) and can be incorporated into future modifications. I keep you posted on this.

LBL

littlebiglane

18-10-2008, 17:37

I used a modified one last weekend for 3 nights. Very good. Robust and breathable. The kipmat holders are a real bonus - stopping you wandering off of it in the night and also reducing wear on the base of the bivy. Just one thing - I found it quite challenging doing the flap up and then zipping it up as the zip is not like one of those on sleeping bags that the head 'flips' over so you can do the zip up from the inside as well as the outside. I have contacted Kevin to see if this can be done (I am sure it can) and can be incorporated into future modifications. I keep you posted on this.

LBL

The first bag I tested had a double zip so you could do it up on the inside. I think Kev did a few with just an outward facing zip (like the one I tested again at the weekend). This has now been rectified and all zips will be able to be done up from the inside as per usual specification. Sorted :)

LBL

ZDP-189

18-10-2008, 18:06

I have one but haven't used it. What can I do about ants?

Mistwalker

18-10-2008, 23:00

Great post thanks! Isn't it great having a wife who doesn't mind getting involved with these things

Nagual

17-11-2008, 18:30

I have one but haven't used it. What can I do about ants?

Tell them to get there own bag...:nana:

Nag.

littlebiglane

17-11-2008, 18:46

Tell them to get there own bag...:nana:

Nag.

Actually I think he has a point. I see that there are brass poppers (male) around the hood opening and down the zip on the inside. I am wondering if this is to mate it to some form of mosi-net. No idea - but they could come in useful.

But you are right. The ants should really get there own bag :lmao:

helixpteron

17-11-2008, 22:46

I have one but haven't used it. What can I do about ants?

Get an Anti-Social Behaviour Order out against 'em!

TeeDee

10-06-2009, 22:39

Bump for sake of a link. sorry!

Noddy

10-06-2009, 23:09

...............

TeeDee

11-06-2009, 03:26

Just my view , but go for a Top zip, makes getting in easier and the storm flap will cover the zip.

Pandabean

11-06-2009, 12:19

Thanks for bumping this back up.

My mate and I bought one of these each, last year without a zip as we didn't know they existed. My mate has just modified his to have a large velcro strap along the opening, however I have been trying to find a zip long enough for mine. Can anyone recommend a place to buy a decent zip for these bags?

Thanks,
Andy

Melonfish

11-06-2009, 13:05

habidashers should have zips litteraly on rolls, meters of the things. get along to your local and they can dish out as much as you need. the zips'll be loose extra's.

littlebiglane

11-06-2009, 19:49

I still think this is a good bivy bag. I last used it earlier in the year when there was quite a bit of snow on Dartmoor. Here is a rather poor picture of it (on the right, next to a posh rab ultralight bivy). The only thing it needed was a fresh DWR on the outside to stop it wetting out. This would have improved the breathability no end and stop the slight condensation I got around the foot area.

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj130/littlebiglane/DSC00871.jpg

Wild Thing

12-06-2009, 08:20

Hi Melonfish

Try contacting Endicotts. They will probably sell you one of the ones they use in their conversions.

Or you could try here... http://ukkitmonster.com/product_info.php?products_id=8 93&osCsid=ea3ec8aeb1093cc99f4b3e6 446599987. They sell zips that are used in British Army sleeping bags.

Regards

Phill

CLEM

25-05-2013, 10:03

Hey chaps a few years back when I was on here more regularly, when I had a PC I really fancied trying one of Endicotts modified bivi bags, do they still sell them???

CLEM

25-05-2013, 21:02

I'll give em/ Endicotts a call then!!!

northumbrian

26-05-2013, 15:15

http://forcesuniformandkit.com/collections/military-surplus-camping-equipment/products/gore-tex-military-bivi-bag-dutch-army-surplus

try these mate, they have a good rep too !

cheers andrew.

CLEM

01-06-2013, 11:40

Thank you friend :)