View Full Version : what 4x4
quarterstaff
11-08-2004, 22:36
Hi all.
I am need of a new car and have always fancied a 4x4.I have narrowed it down to 3.
1 Land rover dicovery
2 daihatsu four track
3 jeep cherokee
as you can see i am not after a full on "off roader" but the best of both worlds(if this is possable).I've got around 4k to spend,must be diesel and reliable.
What do you guy's think,any and all advice greatlly recieved.
cheers
bushwacker bob
11-08-2004, 22:46
:yikes: forget the diatsu four track. :rolmao: :rolmao:
Disco mk2 is ok and for your money you can get a good deal on used jeeps,they tend to have even larger petrol engines than landies and the spares are not as easy to come by.
My personal choice would be the discovery with a td5 diesel lump to offer some sort of economy.
I would agree with bushwacker bob,
apart from the Td5 (the british army cant be wrong) stick to a 300Tdi.(wolf)
Mk2 series 1 disco or defender( bullet proof)
I think that you would be pushed to get a good disco for around 4k as they seem to be holding price well.
I used to have a petrol Jeep which was great apart from the 14 miles to the gallon :yikes: yes £10 for every 50 miles.
I would go for the diesel version for sure. you should be able to get a N, P plate if you look around.
Richie
bothyman
12-08-2004, 08:08
How about one of these??
>> http://www.2cv4x4.com/
And yes I do own a 2CV and this one is the ultimate offroader without paying silly money :wave:
One more to consider,
Suzuki Grand Vitara TD. Nice and comfy, proper ladder frame chassis so it does off road properly and ours does in the high 40s to the gallon.
Cheers
David
MartiniDave
12-08-2004, 08:48
I didn't know anyone other than Land Rover made 4x4's! :o):
Seriously though, I've heard of people getting Discoveries at amazing bargain prices, especially the earlier ones. My everyday cay is a Discovery 300TDi,bought with 42,000 miles on the clock that now has 135,000+ on the clock. Reliability has been pretty good, apart from a timing belt failure at 72k miles (just takes out the valve push rods) and a valve adjusting screw in the engine failing at 108k miles. The chassis is as good as the day it left the factory. Last year we had a weeks off roading holiday in southern France, the disco was hammered 900 miles on the motorway to the camp site, the only preparation it got for the off roading was to unload our gear and fill it with fuel. We drove some places I don't think I could even walk! The vehicle is factory standard (so far). I think I'll be keeping it for a few more years yet as I'm not too sure about the TD5 engine in the Mk2 Disco. I get about 30 mpg.
I've no real experience of the other 4x4's, apart from a good mate has a fourtrack, which he is chuffed with but I'm really not keen on, it seems very crude to me, and that's coming from a series 3 driver!
Try looking through the specialist magazines such as Land Rover Owner and Land Rover Enthusiast.
Dave
Get a Mitsubishi Delica !!
http://jnr-delica.hp.infoseek.co.jp/delica002.jpg
With all due respect The MOD have a LOAD of money and resources to throw at landrovers and they're a bit past it now. Disco's are renowned for failing bodywork, defenders for poor comfort and there are very few decent landies available (unless youre loaded). Go look at a few Deli's they're a 4x4 8 seater MPV with aircon , power steering excellent engines and bodywork (ours even came with a fridge and suede seats as standard all for £3200). They are basically a Shogun with an L200 body. Ask Andylaser what they're like!!
But each to their own..... Go check out landies too (I did) and the Jeeps and such. Happy hunting
bothyman
12-08-2004, 15:32
>>>>> Get a Mitsubishi Delica !!
The only thing I don't like about them is that they all seem to be automatics??
:?:
I have a MkII Disco TD5 with 34k on the clock, reliabilty has been good, and so it should be with that mileage, I get about 30 mpg. Only problem I've had is the case hardening failed on the rear disks, and a slight coming together with an unmarked police car :yikes: I won the argument on the road, they won the insurance claim. :cry:
I was not aware of any major problems with the bodywork though.
If you go down the Landrover road try and get one with as much service history as possible and take someone along who knows something about them. There are plenty of Disco's out there so don't rush and take your time selecting. Main dealer service costs can be high but that goes for most makes nowdays.
Tomorrow morning we are off to the Ardeche for two weeks which will be about a 1500 mile round trip, hope to spend time on the river but it may be packed with tourists !! unfortunatley forced to go at this time of year to tie in with the kids school holidays.
MartiniDave
12-08-2004, 16:29
MadDave,
Looks like you've got a replacement for you write off. Hope the insurers played fair with you and you keep this one straight. Enjoy!
Dave - also possibly a bit mad!
Get a Mitsubishi Delica !!
They're a bit (how to put this!) continental?
ANDYLASER
12-08-2004, 17:42
Big thumbs up for the Mitzi Delica. There are manual versions about, but not loads. Very comfy and easy to drive. Plus you get to look down on Range Rovers :lol:
They're a bit (how to put this!) continental?
:o): :rolmao:
You mean they look like a scooby doo bus !! lol :biggthump
bushwacker bob
14-08-2004, 01:58
Maddave improved his first one.
checkout this thread
http://www.bushcraftuk.net/community/showthread.php?t=2433
bushwacker bob
15-08-2004, 17:28
Sorted. should work now. :wink:
quarterstaff
18-08-2004, 19:27
Thanks for the reply's.
So far i am leaning to wards the jeep,looks good for the price,but i cant seem to stop looking at disco's.
I'm off on me hol's next week so the search starts proper when i get back.
Again thanks for the help.
cheers
Bizarrely (sp?) I saw my first ever Delica today!
Much better to look at in the metal.
Steve; does your Disco have a diesel engine? The 30mpg. sounds good. My Grand Cherokee falls way short at 18mpg. Not that it isn't a good 4x4 and I have had several different kinds over the years. I wish there were more diesels available here.
bushwacker bob
19-08-2004, 08:57
Quill,MPG is a very big consideration this side of the pond as fuel costs about £4 a gallon here($8)
(although our gallons are larger ;) )
Fuel cost are a consideration here also. Although it is less than you folks pay, I don't think it will long and it will be right up there. I travel long distances to see family. Just made a 3600 mi. round trip to see my mother and work around her place.
Quill, yes it's a 2.5 litre turbo diesel , just done a 1900 mile round trip and worked out the MPG as 34 mpg !!!! (wonder if i lost a fuel reciept), most of the miles were done on French Motorways which are a joy to drive on compared to the uk. Stick it in 5th at 70 mph all the way or very nearly
SleepyWeasel
27-08-2004, 20:20
Excuse the butting in here, If you have the time and enjoy tinkering and aren't going to be using the vehicle for everyday transport then a 90/110 LandRover could be for you, I've had a 110 n/a 2.5ltr Diesel since Jan and it's done everything I've asked it to so far, it goes anywhere, it's reasonably comfortable, noisy, thirsty, leaks, needed money throwing at it(still does) and gives me great pleasure whenever I drive it. I paid £1300 for it and have spent nearly a grand on it so far. The loadspace in the back means that you can have all the little luxuries with you when you decide to spend a couple of days out and you can sleep in it as well, but only if you're 5'10" or under.
Parts are cheap and it's easy enough to work on, even for someone like me(bit hamfisted where spanners are involved) Another thing is wherever you go in it someone will eventualy turn up and talk to you about it, oh and other LandRover drivers waver at you and more often than not stop and offer assistance at roadside emergencies.
You'll also find lots of friends want to borrow you for moving stuff around as well, being able to stick a ton of stuff into the rear comes in handy.
If you want car like comfort and driving go for one of the smaller 4X4 out there, if you want an experience, try a Landy!
:biggthump :biggthump :biggthump :biggthump :biggthump :biggthump
If you want Jeep fuel economy get an LR 101 (£3 - 5K).
Go anywhere, loads of room,excellent camper conservions and an experience - practicality mostly zero but what a vehicle. If only I had the spare cash.
If you want a cheap, easy to fix 4x4 to "play" in consider a Suzuki SJ ...(£500-1000 tops). Aaaarrgh cann't belive I just said that - thats it'll I'll disowned if it get out.
I've also got a mate with a very good condition Lada Cossak going for £550. Slower and heavier but will go most places and go on for ever.
joe.ford
22-09-2004, 17:31
How about an Isuzu Trooper I got an old H reg 2.8 td handles as well as a car on the road (with a bit of a lean on corners) and I've heard they can be as good as landys off road
check out this site for a video of a trooper in action
http://www.muddy4x4.com/videos.htm :super:
I tell ee what, forget all that other rubbish - get yerself a Hagglund (http://armyvehiclesbyssengineering.8b it.co.uk/) :biggthump
Land Rover, the best 4x4xfar, I love them and whilst I still have a choice that will be it (well maybe a Range Rover if I win the lottery). Jeeps, I think they are bit naff and I have never really liked them the mpg, suspension and steering being problems for me.
I think this one might be able to give Lurch's suggestion a run for the money, it can swim http://www.cobbatoncombat.co.uk/sales/vehicles.htm
MartiniDave
13-10-2004, 08:31
What Tyr said!
Dave
Ooo, I like the looks of that Stalwart.
Just the thing for the ultimate BOV!
Or for nipping down Sainsbury's.
Not wanting to turn this into complete silliness but I just can't resist posting this link http://www.roadsquadron.com/Cars/Hwing/
tenbears10
18-10-2004, 19:03
That man has far too much time on his hands, he needs a damn good hobby or a girlfriend. :o):
Bill
I think he has both in that car :wink:
arctic hobo
18-10-2004, 22:13
That man has far too much time on his hands, he needs a damn good hobby or a girlfriend. :o):
Bill
Or a swift death.
Cant recommend the lovely old Defender 110 enough
That's an odd mix of choices. I can't comment on the Daihatsu other than to say if they were brilliant more people would own them. Then again, the Nissan Patrol isn't all that popular but is an excellent offroader, so what do I know?
I had a 300 Tdi Discovery so can impart my experience there.
4k puts you in MK1 200Tdi territory, or touching early 300Tdi (stay away, there are timing issues until late P/R plate and the damage can permanently affect the engine unless it is repaired early enough or complete failure was experienced). Bear in mind your stopping distance is atrocious (drum brakes on the rear, but unladen weight is 2.5 metric tonnes) and the outer rear-door handle is a dust magnet and prone to seizing. Panel fit is laughable (impacting bodywork repairs) and overall finish is, at best, of sixties quality. These are hand-finished vehicles and no two are alike (look at the rear bumper on two side-by-side). The transfer box on domestic-use only vehicles will also have seized & require attention. Simmonites, among others, do facia upgrade kits so a 200 can be made to look like a 300 for very little money. I had an R plate 300 from new, & I both loved and hated it. No end of niggling faults, but the only really significant one was the EGR valve failure which killed my fuel economy & had me trailing smoke. Expensive to maintain unless you're a DIY mechanic, and if you don't get a mechanical timing belt fitted you're looking at a new one every 48k. The mechanical belt + fitting costs the same as a main dealer 48k service. Bear in mind also that it's a 6 month/6k miles service interval. One alternative is that if you can afford the fuel bill, the V8 is a stormer. Take a look at the landrover enthusast websites for a better picture of both the community spirit surrounding the owners, and of course you'll be able to read all the horror stories.
On the Jeep Wrangler front, this is the closest anyone can get to a 90 without having a 90. My colleague owns one as a weekender. Many argue that the 90 is better, & if you compare the diesels of both that would be true, but the petrol version paints a slightly different figure, and it's an absolute hoot when you give it gas. What is more attractive about the 90 is that it's a classless & timeless go-anywhere vehicle. What's not so attractive is that unmodified it won't go above 85, handles like a breezeblock at anything over 60 and is uncomfortable over long distances.
4K would also get you a v.high mileage freelander, but STAY AWAY FROM THE PETROL ONE!!!! We've got a 1.8 anniversary model, very pretty & my wife won't part with it, but the rover k-16 has a notable design flaw in the head-gasket that LR won't fix for free outside of normal warranty if the engine is anything other than vanilla (ours isn't), and will break between 40-60k miles (ours did). Ignore the offroad purists, this is a decent offroader compared to the same-class lifestyle offroaders & is a comfortable cruiser. Loadspace is disappointing, though. The only thing in it's class that comes close all-round is the nissan x-trail, which is still too new so out of budget.
The trooper is also an excellent workhorse vehicle, & generally more reliable than its competitor, the Discovery. It's not a good road-car though, the disco is marginally better handling though slower. The engine in the trooper has better towing power too. The only thing it doesn't have is the clubby ownership support of the LRs. I nearly bought one to replace my Disco after losing count of how many times I went back to the dealer over niggling faults that shouldn't exist on a £22k vehicle (in 1997).
You may even be within budget for a 3-door 3 litre nissan patrol (the newer shape, not the tonka), but the fuel economy is atrocious and if you tip it over the whole roof collapses unless you fit a rollcage. Also handles like a boat. Well equipped and a great offroader, though.
What am I in now? an 04 plate Discovery TD5 Commercial. No problems. None. If I could have a second 'play in the mud' toy, I'd have a 101.
Sorry for such a long post, & I know many will disagree with my opinions but I hope this helps - you can't have too much information & 4k is a lot of money to make an uninformed mistake with.
Lycanthrope
02-11-2004, 22:02
Second hand range rover's gotta be the one. I've got a 3.5ltr V8, E reg and she's far more comfortable than any Disco or Defender, I tried both of them before the Range Rover and at 6'5" it's the only one I can drive in comfort.
It's also LPG converted so I get about 200miles for about £20.
Also with the huge all terrain wheels there's pretty much no where in-accessable.