View Full Version : Where to go...
Squidders
03-08-2004, 21:56
I have been trying to get information on where I can go and practice my caveman skills in the UK in either Dartmoor or the Peak District or wherever really... but I have no idea where I can go legally or acceptably to do this. I have tried the National park authorities but they just shrug.
Can anyone help me out?
:yikes:
It really depends on what skills you want ot practice..... you may be allowed fires in certain places, but as for hunting and trapping, you'll need permission on private land..... and probably insurance..... game license.... Many of the trapping skills (like alot of traps) are now illegal in the uk and you just wont be able to do it anywhere legally.
What sorts of things were you thinking of doing?
:-)
Ed
Squidders
03-08-2004, 23:00
I just wanted to roam the land, maybe set up a bivvy, practice some friction fire lighting... eat some meals in a bag and some berries and be alone to survive. no hunting or trapping would be involved, just the camping side of it.
I just wanted to roam the land, maybe set up a bivvy, practice some friction fire lighting... eat some meals in a bag and some berries and be alone to survive. no hunting or trapping would be involved, just the camping side of it.
Yep, me too.
But where can you go ? :?:
The unrestricted national park sort of places are all above the treeline. Anywhere below the treeline, and surely bushcraft is about being in the woods, is owned and fenced.
Most of my bushcraft seems to get done on the patio. Well, she won't let me do it inside. :-)
Squidders
03-08-2004, 23:26
I'm a patio cavemen too... it's just not the same... swelling with pride about your latest ignition when the cooker is 15 feet away.
I'm a patio cavemen too... it's just not the same... swelling with pride about your latest ignition when the cooker is 15 feet away.
I know exactly what you mean. My one and only ever success with a fire bow was greeted with a "thats nice dear, tea's ready".
patio caveman sounds better than usual name I get, "Twisted Fire Starter".
Jon.
its when the neigbors are peering disaprovingy out of the window at you and calling there childeren inside as you practive your fire by friction that makes the patio cavemans life so hard
Squidders
05-08-2004, 11:56
Ok... so out of the 90 people who have seen this thread... there are two types of individual:
1. Like myself and the others that have posted in this thread, you have no idea where you can go "in the wild"... that isn't your happy-go-lucky next door farmers spare field.
2. You do know but you're keeping it a secret for some reason...
Either way, I still have no idea if I can go to any of the national parks in the UK and do what this entire site is dedicated to doing... I would have thought that this is pretty fundamental information... it's like being a rock climber but only being able to climb at home...
Can't anyone help???
All the places that i use for practicing bushcraft are privately owned land on which i have permision
its the same with many of the people i know who practice bushcraft, its a very difficult passtime to undertake in public areas and there are many laws and restrictions
Most national parks do not allow you to have fires, though some have campsites where you are allowed BBQ style fires... ie a fire in a foil tray. You will need to contact the relavant park authoratory for more info on this.
Private land is the best way to go, but very hard to come by.... and getting a land owners permission can be a right pain.... there have been a few threads on this some time back.
Your other option is scout campsites.... some of these will let you hire a pitch when not in use, and out of season they are deserted, many will let you wildcamp. Again you will have to contact the relavant warden as each has its own rules.
There was a link posted sometime ago of an online database of scout sites and the relavant warden details.... does anyone have it to hand?
Ed
I may just have an answer for you. If you want to be a CAVEman then the area surrounding Crickhowell has the largest caveing complex of europe, but that may be a bit cavey.
I promised to find information on the usk resevoir (location) to Maddave, as i have forgotten exactly where it is and i still havent given it to him. Sorry Dave. It is a real area of beauty. Myself and my Dad went down there in april and it was absolutely brilliant. you could walk from your car anywhere you wanted, the further you walk, the less likely the odds you will come into contact with humans. Anyways, there are fantastic walks, its a *real* beauty spot.
Will find out where it is when i next see my dad.
Cheers,
Jake
Also check out the meetups and scoial chat and bushcraft blog forums and see where other people go, pm them to get opinions and clarify any info you need.
Ed
Squidders,
the best way I have found is to find an area of ground that suits your needs, find out who the land owner is and pay him a wee visit. Discuss what you would like to do and offer to help maintain the site - use your bushcraft skills to clear dead wood, rubbish etc and repair fencing/walls.
Most reasonable landowners are willing to let you have a go - it means their land is maintained and has its own security staff at no cost to themselves. Always be responsible and advise the owner of any problems you may encounter - dead stock animals, vandalism, it keeps you in the clear and earns you more respect.
Hope this is useful
Cheers
JFW
I'd say that that is the best advice, you usually hit the jackpot using that method.
SquirrelBoy
05-08-2004, 19:33
If youve got a spare £30,000 odd, you could buy yourself a woodland !!
... I`ll get me coat :sulk:
Squidders
20-08-2004, 21:07
I think I've found the right land... http://www.viviun.com/AD-15615/ now all I need to is find 499,999 partners to buy it with :nana:
Squidders pm me - locations ect I might be able to help in the short term!
What experience do you have?
I've gone a bit Stig too, I could use some suggestions - preferably places I can get to via public transport & a long walk - I can't drive.
The neighours rush to get the laundry out before I can fire up the kiln and they really don't like it when I run the smoker. Anglers get really upset when you start bashing things on the head and eating them. Can't we have some sort Mesolithic reserve we could charge people to come and look at the cavemen.
Realgar
Great Pebble
21-08-2004, 00:08
Would I be likely to get in trouble if I said.....
"Anywhere you like as long as you don't get caught and don't leave any evidence that you've been there when you leave"
?
SquirrelBoy
21-08-2004, 10:36
Would I be likely to get in trouble if I said.....
"Anywhere you like as long as you don't get caught and don't leave any evidence that you've been there when you leave"
?
Im affraid this is the style I have to use too.
Although I dont light fires very much, if I want to I will take the materials (dry sticks/twigs) home with me and set one up there. The last thing I want to do is start a forest fire :nono:
bushwacker bob
22-08-2004, 00:35
If you do find somewhere,dont give up on the patio!
I have a semi-permanent fire site I use (in the corner of our horses field) Although its not camping out or bushcraft its an extention of my patio cavemanism and the place where I can hone my limited skills before using them in earnest.Much experimentation with tinders and other pyro related stuff is done there.
wannabefree
22-08-2004, 20:42
Hi All,
Just joined the community today and have similar probs on locations. I'm into totally isolated places where I can camp, fish, shoot (air weapons), light fires and just be self sufficient. Outer Hebrides is NOT an option!! South East is preferred. Lots of experience of rough camping, I am what is euphemistically referred to as of advancing years but I don't intend to peg out just yet!
Anyone got any (printable) ideas or want to discuss?
bushwacker bob
23-08-2004, 01:05
Hi All,
Just joined the community today and have similar probs on locations. I'm into totally isolated places where I can camp, fish, shoot (air weapons), light fires and just be self sufficient. Outer Hebrides is NOT an option!! South East is preferred. Lots of experience of rough camping, I am what is euphemistically referred to as of advancing years but I don't intend to peg out just yet!
Anyone got any (printable) ideas or want to discuss?
The place you seek is Nirvana.Unless you can find a generous landowner you wont find it in the U.K. :-)
If you read back over this thread there are a few suggestions to approach landowners when you find a potential spot
masongary44
23-08-2004, 14:10
I recently found a spot in the Yorkshire peaks, I was out walking with a friend, intending on doing some wild camping.
It was late when we arrived in the area, so there was no-one around (gone 8pm), coupled with the fact it was quite misty, and a good few miles from the nearest habitation (with some hills in the way to boot) we were able to go in un-noticed.
Don't get me wrong, i would not endorse doing these things without permission, but how the hell do i find out who owns the land..??
Anyway, the woodland was in a state of sorry repair, a lot of fallen and half fallen trees on the periphery, but a bit deeper in, and we found a cracking spot, with a reasonable fast flowing river (which was welcome as we had just about run out of water).
We got a small fire going in a small, but hidden clearing taking care not to light it near any surfaced roots , stumps etc, and all was well. The below cloud meant that there was little risk of smoke being seen (that and it was fast approaching dusk) and being what appeared to be an un-managed section of the wood, there was loads of standing dead, well seasoned, easily accessible spruce, so there was not much smoke anyway.
If it was not for a local farmer out with his shotgun the night would have been somewhat idyllic.
And if I can find out the name of the owner / farm field next door, there was some good rabbit hunting to be done too :)
Now, where as I would love to share the location.. as I did not have permission to be there, I would rather keep its location shtum, but by spending 20 minutes looking at the OS map it was easy to spot a number of similar areas all within half a days.
Again, the difficult thing for me would be identifying who owns the land... How exactly do i go about doing this... any ideas??
(Here is a clue though, at its closes point, the Pennine Way is less than 100 meters from the forrest edge....)
:super:
Again, the difficult thing for me would be identifying who owns the land... How exactly do i go about doing this... any ideas??
Try the local land registery.... or ask the locals.... go to the local pub and ask the landlord... they will probably know everything including the local gossip.
Please do not use the land without permisson..... Farmers and gamekeepers go out shooting at night quite a bit and you may end up in a serious accident.... and how do you think the farmer (and his family) would feel if he was charged with manslaughter or taken to court for compensation just because some *@#!! didn't let him know they were there.....
Play safe guys and gals and get permission.... you have been warned ;-)
Ed
Hi All,
Just joined the community today and have similar probs on locations. I'm into totally isolated places where I can camp, fish, shoot (air weapons), light fires and just be self sufficient. Outer Hebrides is NOT an option!! South East is preferred. Lots of experience of rough camping, I am what is euphemistically referred to as of advancing years but I don't intend to peg out just yet!
Anyone got any (printable) ideas or want to discuss?
Go Shopping ..... start here :lol:
http://www.woodlandstewardship.com/SouthEast.htm
So what about we buy some woodland as a syndicate in a reasonably central or reasonably accessible (to us) location?
As I can't afford to buy a house and don't want to pretend that I can do it by becoming slave to one work location while I paid off a huge, multi-decade mortgage, I'd been thinking about simply buying some woodland instead!
And hey, if I needed a permanent place to live, I could build a leaf shelter on it! ;-)
So I'd already looked around http://www.woodlands.co.uk/north.htm and noted Red Gap Wood and Long Wold Wood. I'd prefer more acreage and more water access for the money but since when could a bushcrafter have everything laid out on a plate? :-)
OK, supposing we just play with the idea.... let's just consider some questions....
How much money would members have to stump up?
Could some members pay a small fee to use such a site in order to pay off bigger contributions made by other members?
Could some members shovel up some money for some of it and a syndicate take out a mortgage on the remaining? (is this something the Ecology Building Society would look at?)
Or better yet, how about assessing how much member cash is available, and how much extra could be borrowed from relatives and the loans paid back to relatives with a better-than-bank-but-much-less-than-mortgage-lender interest rate? (I don't need to borrow money from my folks but I wish I did because I could pay them a better rate on their savings than they get at the bank and still pay less interest than I would have to pay a bank or building society)
Or making it available to woodcraft schools for a fee (again to help pay back any loan required to cover a differential between what we could raise and what we would have to pay)
What rules would a syndicate site need?
One I would propose is that no animals be taken using commercially made means (in order to protect the wildlife and the interests of other members)
I think many other rules could be summed up in the basic principles of bushcraft: no litter! (duh), no forest fires (duh), no ghetto-blasters (duh), no wild parties (well, maybe wild parties but not religious worship stuff).
I inclined to say that membership rights and access should be equal among all who put up cash over a certain amount (say, [pounds]1,000), regardless of how much they put up individually. If I put up [pounds]6,000 and found a bunch of other bushcrafters were always there more than I am then I don't care - they can teach me what they learned! They pay a [pounds]10 fee or a [pounds]20 annual membership fee for the right to go there whenever they want. Don't worry about the numbers - I'm merely chucking them out there to get a perspective into play.
Also, just to get a base level number for a contribution out there, I could put 4,000 into this idea and possibly a couple of thousand more. How much more would depend on when, how things are going with work, etc.
Maybe this idea should be given a thread. Maybe there already is one for this idea - I haven't checked yet! :-)
Would I be likely to get in trouble if I said.....
"Anywhere you like as long as you don't get caught and don't leave any evidence that you've been there when you leave"
?
I'm thinking that is exactly the reason most people go quiet when this question gets asked. ;) :D :D
Hi Ginger.
It might be an idea to start a new thread about possibly buying land. the one main difficulty i see apart from my own lack of cash is location. The ideal woodland space would have running water toilet facilites etc. It would need to be fairly central so that most members could get there in say 1.5 drive. that would put it somewhere in the midlands. I'm not sure what land prices are in that neck of the woods.
Midlands (http://www.woodlandstewardship.com/midlands.htm)
:wave:
Squidders
24-08-2004, 10:23
Somehow I think the only not sold site available is a little out of our budgets:
Coldborough Park - Nr Ross-on-Wye, Herefordshire - 73.9 ha. - £310,000 - Lot 1: 26.9 ha., £105,000, Lot 2: 47 ha, £205,000
What we need is a huge part of dartmoor that's completely wild. You apply for a permit from the park authority, they check liability insurance and make you take a test on basic safety, consideration to the environment and others and send you on your way. By issuing a fairly small number of permits on a monthly first come first served basis it makes it fair.
Now, who do we kidnap to get something like this???
Hi folks
I stumbled upon your forum today and so far it has made good reading.
I've been practiving bushcraft for a few years now and love it.
The reason I have joined this thread is I have some land that I use to practice on - unfortunetly in France! It is only a few acres but is surrounded by other private woodland that I have never seen anyone on. So feels bigger. maybe we could come to some arrangement where people pay a fee to stay there alone for a week, or whatever. It doesn't have showers and toilets as requested by an earlier poster, but surely that is part of bushcraft???
I have also looked at the Woodlands for sale websites. I have recently been made redundent and I was thinking how I could buy a chunk of woodland with the money that I could obviously use myself, but also get some form of income from it. Would any of you guys be interested in paying for an official wild camp with hunting rights?
TheViking
24-08-2004, 15:53
You can create a thread, Tedders in the introductions and welcomes (http://www.bushcraftuk.net/community/newthread.php?do=newthread&f=28). :D :D
Squidders
24-08-2004, 16:09
You can create a thread, Tedders in the introductions and welcomes (http://www.bushcraftuk.net/community/newthread.php?do=newthread&f=28). :D :D
I actually think this comes under the where to go topic nicely...
I would be interested if the land were in the UK... I travel to france regularly to go to Fontainebleau. but i'd be interested in paying a reasonable fee to use land... not too bothered about the hunting though.
Welcome by the way Tedders! :o)
TheViking
24-08-2004, 17:05
I actually think this comes under the where to go topic nicely...
Oh yes, but I meant that he could introduce himself in the introductions forum... :wink: :-)
bushwacker bob
24-08-2004, 18:31
Hello and welcome Tedders,
France sounds fine to me for the odd jaunt. I suspect you'd be fairly well booked for that one :wave:
To find out who owns land I tend to pop into the nearest farmhouse. Farmers generally know a lot about the local landowners and how to get hold of them!
I'm lucky to be in the job I am as I get to use the site that we use for courses if I want to. I also regularly go to a small woodland which I happen to know that the owner lives abroad and is not bothered what goes on there. Its all about information gathering - ask some questions and I'm sure you'll find somewhere.
I also volunteer for the national trust and spend 2 days a week helping to manage some woodland which has given me a foot in the door resulting in permission to camp on the campsite that the scouts etc use there. Volunteering to help manage the woods is a great way to win the landowner over!
The quickest way to find out who owns the land, is to start up a chainsaw................you will find out within 3 minutes, guaranteed. It has always worked for me! :naughty:
The quickest way to find out who owns the land, is to start up a chainsaw................you will find out within 3 minutes, guaranteed. It has always worked for me! :naughty: :o): :rolmao: :o):
Squidders
24-08-2004, 19:47
The quickest way to find out who owns the land, is to start up a chainsaw................you will find out within 3 minutes, guaranteed. It has always worked for me! :naughty:
How positive are your negotiations post chainsaw revving?
:rolmao: :rolmao: :rolmao: :rolmao: :rolmao:
just do it!!
-) if you are found in the evening, you are simply asked to move on
-) if you are found in the morning, you are moving on anyway. not much to say!
-) if you find somebody a bit pedantic, what can happen? you may be fined! how much? 50 quid! I have been in worst hotels for those money!
However, leave the place clean etc etc
enjoy :wave:
Beer Monster
31-08-2004, 12:51
Has anybody tried the MOD estates? :?:
I know that on most MOD training areas camping/fires aren't allowed (although on some there are designated bivi areas for the soldiers) but I've had a quick scan of the website and from the look of it there seems to be the possibility that when the areas aren't being used for miliary purposes "many other activities can take place" they might make exceptions i.e. maybe a small group/individuals go to a set grid reference on a set date???
I've done army survival courses on MOD land in Dorset with open fires etc and during training on the Sandhurst area the Gurkhas regularly spark up fires at night! ....... rules can be bent or "adjusted" ...... the question is will they do it for civilians?!?
Info at the bottom of this page:- http://www.defence-estates.mod.uk/access/access.htm
Here is a list of training areas and ranges with the wardens telephone number:- http://www.defence-estates.mod.uk/access/contacts.htm
I'm sure that if you contact the wardens, especially the ones at the smaller training areas that don't get used as often, they maybe able to help (although from past experience you may get the occasional grumpy old man!). Worth a go anyway ........ if you don't ask you don't get!
Good luck. :biggthump
gillmacca
16-09-2004, 17:59
About the only place i can think of you being able to have a fire, is in snowdonia (possible? in the remote parts) and up in the highlands
Hi all, I'm new to the site (this is my first post) and to bushcraft (in that I haven't done any yet). I know it's a hell of a long shot, but have any of you done any, heard of any, or read of any bushcraft in China? I'm moving there in february, and promised myself after my first trip there that I'd get out deeper into the countryside and see some serious wilderness. I've got locations in mind, like beside the great wall, the forests of Sichuan and a neighbouring province that's full of ethnic minorities in small villages, where visitors are liable to get invited in as guests. I know that most of what western bushcrafters learn for pure satisfaction still survives over there for subsistence, but only in outlying areas where they won't even speak mandarin, let alone English, and communication could be glacially slow. The moral of the story IS, if you know anything, even the title of a good, relevant book, please share. Once I'm over there I should have plenty of succulent information to give back.
Here are a couple of pictures of the kind of place I'm talking about: http://www.paulnoll.com/China/Excursions/Banna-Dai-houses.html
Phil
About the only place i can think of you being able to have a fire, is in snowdonia (possible? in the remote parts) and up in the highlands
this is one which i regularly over looked.. but below the high tide mark you can light a fire.. as you are technically sitting on the bottom of the sea no one can tell you other wise :nana:
course you dont really want to hukker down there as the tide has a nasty habit of coming in :rolmao:
bushwacker bob
30-11-2004, 18:52
Hi all, I'm new to the site (this is my first post) and to bushcraft (in that I haven't done any yet). I know it's a hell of a long shot, but have any of you done any, heard of any, or read of any bushcraft in China? I'm moving there in february, and promised myself after my first trip there that I'd get out deeper into the countryside and see some serious wilderness. I've got locations in mind, like beside the great wall, the forests of Sichuan and a neighbouring province that's full of ethnic minorities in small villages, where visitors are liable to get invited in as guests. I know that most of what western bushcrafters learn for pure satisfaction still survives over there for subsistence, but only in outlying areas where they won't even speak mandarin, let alone English, and communication could be glacially slow. The moral of the story IS, if you know anything, even the title of a good, relevant book, please share. Once I'm over there I should have plenty of succulent information to give back.
Here are a couple of pictures of the kind of place I'm talking about: http://www.paulnoll.com/China/Excursions/Banna-Dai-houses.html
Phil
If you have access to sky TV and available to view at about 12.30 am there is a program on called 'about China' and they often do rural reports from the provinces.Unfortunately unless the places are named after food like, Peking Duck, I can't remember them.The channel is about sky 560. Sorry to be so vague, but it gives you a starting point!
If you have access to sky TV and available to view at about 12.30 am there is a program on called 'about China' and they often do rural reports from the provinces.Unfortunately unless the places are named after food like, Peking Duck, I can't remember them.The channel is about sky 560. Sorry to be so vague, but it gives you a starting point!
Thanks Bob, I've watched that program a few times. They tend to go to (nice) touristy places, many of which I've been to before, but they've also given me a couple of good ideas. My wife (who's Chinese) is keen to go out into Sichuan with me, and says that we should be able to see a wild panda! Combine that with treks through forests and day trips to temples and you have a recipe for an unforgetable trip.
If youve got a spare £30,000 odd, you could buy yourself a woodland !!
... I`ll get me coat :sulk:
www.woodlands.co.uk (some woodland for £10k)
Hey everyone, check out "Land Access in Scotland" thread and see what you think!
£10,000 for a bit of woodland. As a kind of group timeshare, split between a load of bushcraftuk members it would be a good place for meets, and would cost little more than a goretex jacket and an alan wood knife for each person. Just a suggestion for the rest of you, if you haven't done it already, I'll be on my trip to China soon, and 5400 miles from scotland!
bambodoggy
02-12-2004, 12:45
Tomtom....if you're having fires on beaches it's often required and always polite to let the coast guard know before hand. I'm pretty sure I'm right in saying it's a by-law in the Isle of White and maybe other places too... They're always ok with you doing it below the high water mark and are often more than happy that you bothered to ask them first :o):
Saves them wasting a callout if they don't know what's going on.
I have, to date, never been denied permission from a coast guard in any UK area that I've asked them.
Tomtom....if you're having fires on beaches it's often required and always polite to let the coast guard know before hand.
i live in a fairly small community.. know all the coastguards around here.. and i will be when when i am around on a more perminant reason.. if i was to tell them they would probably say "why you tell in us :?: "..and i was told you are alowed to do farily well what you wish below the high tide line, with out having to tell anyone..??
bambodoggy
02-12-2004, 15:12
Hey if you know them all then I guess that's cool.... If you live in a place where you don't need to let them know then you're right they may think you mad for telling them... :-P
As I said they are by-laws but they are there to stop false call-outs etc...not to stop you doing what you want or enjoying yourself and I presume they change from place to place and some places won't have them so you can do what you like.
Everywhere is different and clearly we all know our own places but I'd hate for someone on here to (for example) get a grilling from the coast guard while on holiday on the Isle of White and only have "Tomtom said it was ok below the tide mark" as their defence!!! :o):
Certainly didn't mean to speak out of turn mate! :wave:
I worked on an Outdoor Centre in Bude in Cornwall a few years back and the coast guards there could get a bit funny about them but I think that was more to do with people getting plastered and leaving litter all over the beaches.
Certainly didn't mean to speak out of turn mate! :wave:
yu didnt.. i have to admit, i didnt know those by-laws, and was under a wong impression about what i was allowed to do, cheers :super: :biggthump
bambodoggy
02-12-2004, 15:40
No worries Matey :o): there may not be any by-laws by you so you may be fine and as you say if you know them all then it ain't no thing! :super: