View Full Version : What Pans?
Green Dweller Beloved
30-05-2007, 11:01
Hi,
I'm in the market for some new pans as my aluminum billie cans are so warped now and the lids don't fit. I may buy a trangia set (27-6 poss) or maybe some Zebra Billy cans. :bluThinki
A friend has however said he's sure he heard that I shouldn't be using Aluminum on an open fire as its too hot and it may give of toxic fumes. Is this correct? I reckon the heat is responsible for warping them, but not sure abuot any fumes?
Also, if I by the Zebra Billy cans, does anyone know if they fit inside each other?
And if an open fire is not available what do you guys use for a heat source?
Cheers Guys, any help appreciated.
GDB
Green Dweller Beloved
30-05-2007, 11:16
PS. Are Trangia copies any good ?
Thanks
Squidders
30-05-2007, 11:59
Well, I have tried a trangia and didn't like it... it is good and indestrictible but I didn't like it.
I use a zebra billy can and after trying a number of things, I still keep coming back to it.
I just fitted a stainless rope bail arm and it's now fully lush. I cook on either an open fire or an Primus gravity stove and it's fast. I opt for the 16cm billy because I can get everything inside it... stove, gas, brew kit, noggin, washing stuff etc.
They will nest together if you take the inner bowl bit out and pimp the bail arm as I have.
Anyway, I've had mine pretty hot and no sign of warping at all - love 'em!
gregorach
30-05-2007, 13:13
A friend has however said he's sure he heard that I shouldn't be using Aluminum on an open fire as its too hot and it may give of toxic fumes. Is this correct? I reckon the heat is responsible for warping them, but not sure abuot any fumes?
Hmmm.... Sounds highly questionable to me. I've never heard of aluminum giving off toxic fumes, and I can't imagine how it could.
Now, teflon coated cookware might be a different matter - than can give off toxic fumes at high temperatures. Whether you can achieve high enough temperatures on a camp fire, and whether the fumes would be dense enough to cause illness (or death) might be debatable, but teflon (PTFE) can definitely give off extremely poisonous fumes if heated enough.
I suspect your friend has gotten confused between the now-debunked theory that aluminium cookware influences the development of Altzheimer's and the toxic potential of teflon.
Stainless is probably about the best option for camping cookware, unless you have a pack mule (in which case cast iron becomes possible) or a lot of money (in which case titanium might be worth considering).
I don't use billy's at the moment except for the one provided with the Swedish army Trangia, which work fine over fires as well as on the meths burner. It is a bit heavy though. What I can say is that the 27-6 Trangia pans don't have lids or bail arms, making them useless for anything except the meths burner system they're designed for.
Hope this helps
Pablo
How about these?
http://www.survival-school.org/Default.aspx?tabid=246&CategoryID=2&Category2ID=18&List=1&Level=2&ProductID=110&gclid=CLH98LzXsYwCFRo6EAodTUCf KA
No experience of them, just found them.
PS. Are Trangia copies any good ?
Thanks
I've got a couple of Trangia 25 clones, these are the bigger Trangia. The clone is made of lighter aluminium, but the burner and simmer ring is fine and the whole setup works well
I tend to use aluminium 'Bulldog' brands nesting billy cans, they work really well and are light, here are some that look the same
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320118317891&ssPageName=MERC_VIC_RSCC_Pr12_ PcY_BIN_Stores_IT&refitem=320115477361&itemcount=12&refwidgetloc=closed_view_item&usedrule1=StoreCatToStoreCat&refwidgettype=cross_promot_wid get
Three cans with lids and bales for the price of one Zebra :cool:
I use and like the zebra billys. Also like the msr alpine pans http://www.fieldandtrek.com/product-MSR-Alpine-Cookset-22046.htm They are not suitable for hanging over a fire, but are well designed and also made by zebra. If a fire is not available, I use an msr whisperlite or various gas stoves
There is a thread using Stainless biscuit tins from Morrisons as billys
http://www.bushcraftuk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=21729
Does anybody have Zebra cans in stock at the moment? Outdoorcode seem to have been out of stock for months.
>>What I can say is that the 27-6 Trangia pans don't have lids or bail arms, making them useless for anything except the meths burner system they're designed for.
I carry some bulldog clips and a bit of string. You can clip them to the rim of the pan and thread the string through the bulldog clip arms. It acts like a bail arm.
I quite like the trangia 25/27/round sets, esp the stainless steel ones which even allow a certain amount of baking. The nice thing about the trangia is that there are enough vessels that you can reserve the kettle for boiling water, and use the two round pans for rice/pasta and sauce. The frying pan is pants though, at least in frying pan mode, but makes a handy serving dish. If you're on your own then it's a bit overkill, but for groups of 2+ it pays its' weight.
I tend to go to my local recycling centre and get saucepans etc there, cut handle off if needed and wire on a loop. Replace as required.....
I've got a set of the ones Pablo showed, and they a very good. Used them all over the place on open fires and on my msr. A bit dented now but they are still goin strong.
Baggins
I know galvanised steel is highlt toxic when heating (welding etc) not heard the same about ally, although i do prefer stainles cookware, esy to keep clean etc, the downside being the weight.
I use a zebra billy can and after trying a number of things, I still keep coming back to it.
I just fitted a stainless rope bail arm and it's now fully lush.
i have a 12 cm billy ans some wire but am finding it hard to remove the old handle, can you shed any light ?
leon
Squidders
31-05-2007, 11:22
Dremmel mate ;)
I also used the dremmel to cut the stainless wire for the handle... the tube I did with a hacksaw.
I guess, if you centrepunch the rivet holding the arm on, you could drill it out... 5mm drill should also make the hole a little bigger which was handy for me.
Cheers,
Joe
dont have a dremel so will drill it out, thanks mate
leon
well i found it hard to centre punch it so i used a bench grinder instead, i have one side off and now for the other
leon
well ive finished it but the handle seems to make the bily sit lop sided and wont let the lid sit properly :(
leon
Squidders
31-05-2007, 12:40
Did you take Pics Leon? maybe start a new thread and a bit of a how-to... save really hijacking this one :D
yes good idea, s.orry GDB
leon
Green Dweller Beloved
02-06-2007, 11:59
Some top tips guys.
Cheers
Still haven't made my mind up!
Green Dweller Beloved
02-06-2007, 19:30
Now, teflon coated cookware might be a different matter - than can give off toxic fumes at high temperatures. Whether you can achieve high enough temperatures on a camp fire, and whether the fumes would be dense enough to cause illness (or death) might be debatable, but teflon (PTFE) can definitely give off extremely poisonous fumes if heated enough.
Really? Has anyone else heard this or does anyone currently use PTFE on fire?
I was thinking of getting a Crusander mug with cooker from eBay, but it's PTFE coated and I'm not sure now.
Cheers
GDB
david1317
02-06-2007, 20:02
hi GDB iv heard that the ptfe coating comes of easily i have a stainless steal one and am very happy with it you can get a plastic lid for them now i got one off ebay cost about £2 speeds up the boil time a bit it has a small hole at one side so you can drink from the mug with the lid on
gregorach
04-06-2007, 21:18
Really? Has anyone else heard this or does anyone currently use PTFE on fire?
I was thinking of getting a Crusander mug with cooker from eBay, but it's PTFE coated and I'm not sure now.
Cheers
GDB
Well, I use my PTFE Crusader on the fire... And I don't seem to have died yet. ;)