View Full Version : Help with wire saw
Lee_shanahan
25-02-2007, 19:16
I was recently in my local army surplus store and seen a commando wire saw on the shelf, this look to me to be a useful bit of kit. is it werth getting, thanks.
nope, they don't last very long. If you want a compact felxible saw, get a manual chainsaw.
Brocktor
25-02-2007, 19:26
if it is a small one (i think they all are) then no they are hard to use and dont cut much
Longstrider
25-02-2007, 20:12
Wire saws tend to be too short to be of much use. The "teeth" on them are so small that cutting green or even dead wood very quickly clogs them up and they become hot and then they break. The only time I saw one that did what it was meant to was a far more expensive, braided version that was used for cutting bones on large animal carcasses.
The Pocket Chainsaw is in another league altogether. Great for green and dead wood, with decent sized teeth that actually cut. They can also be useful for cutting branches that you cannot reach. By attaching the saw to a length of paracord or rope which is thrown over the branch, you can pull the saw up and over the branch then make the cut by pulling on the two dangling ends alternately. Just make sure to stand off to one side when doing this !
I have also been able in the past to knock up a crude bucksaw in the field, using the Pocket Chainsaw as the blade. This can be more user-friendly around camp for cutting up firewood.
anthonyyy
25-02-2007, 20:17
I think the saw on a Swiss Army knife cuts as well and lasts much longer.
British Red
25-02-2007, 21:01
I agree - for a folding saw, a Laplander or Silky pocket boy will cost £15 - £25 and actually work!
BushTucker
25-02-2007, 21:04
I aggree with all above comments but, it makes a good addition to an emergency kit if you are making your own.
I agree with all above comments but, it makes a good addition to an emergency kit if you are making your own.
Your right that is what they were designed for - to be small enough to be folded into you survival tin!
They are not designed to tackle long term cutting/sawing duties. Emergency use only!!
The 'Sabre Saw' from ultimate survival is a pocket chainsaw that is very effective and can tackle green and dead wood very well!
I have a wire saw. I used it once, put it im a draw and its there to this day! Coiling it up all the time so that it doesnt knot is too much of a faff! Even when you do coil it up you are always gonna get knotts! :(
So i use a £3 hand saw that i bought from Aldi about 3 years ago and its still good and sharp!! And i use it all the time!
I returned to Aldi last year to buy 3 more because they were so good but i discovered that they had changed the design of the blade and it kept getting stuck all the time!! Annoying!
Lee_shanahan
25-02-2007, 22:23
Thanks alot for the advice, i'll take it all on board. The other option i like is the gerber folding saw is this any different from the laplander?
I bought one of the deluxe ultimate survival kits with blast match and sabre hand chain saw. Cut brilliantly through wood, but the webbing handles also did a good job on my hands.
Now I use some thickish stick through the handles and it works a treat. For all the smaller stuff I would the laplander, and to be honest it gets used the most. A truly excellent tool.
Hope this helps!
Lee_shanahan
25-02-2007, 22:52
yer i seen those ultimate survial kits, they look awsome fairplay, they much value for money then? last year i bought a folding saw, pretty much the same design as the laplander from wilkos for abot £3-99 and it fell apart on me the first time i used it.
Hello Lee_shanahan
firstly this is not an impartial post, I did a few years ago have a link to the company which invented the original commando wire saw (the new version with the black plastic covered loops and wrist straps was my design) however I think this would be informative with regards to the topic of this thread and I have asked the Moderators permission to post it
The wire saw is not particularly good for use on live or green wood and I certainly wouldn’t recommend it for that function, it binds quickly and snaps easily under these conditions, but it’s important to remember that this is not what it was originally designed for.
it is intended to be hidden in your clothing (sewn into the hem of your jacket or concealed in the sole of a commando boot which is how it was originally stored) and utilised in an escape and evasion scenario to cut the sort of wooden fence posts that surround a temporary POW camp, giving POWs the opportunity to escape early on before they are transferred to a more secure prison facility.
it will normally cut though more than 15 cured fence posts (4" X 4" thick) before it dulls and no longer cuts efficiently anymore, which, hopefully would be enough to see them free and running.
I believe that misguided marketing has lead to the myth that this is an efficient tool for cutting green wood and the subsequently poor reputation of the wire saw.
The other myth about the wire saw is that is breaks because of heat build up and/or wear because of the soft composition of the wire strands this is not normally the case, if it were the wire saw would be unable to cut mild steel as in this video and picture of it cutting 2mm thick angle iron
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/diabolik/th_P2250003.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v174/diabolik/?action=view¤t=P2250003.flv)
The cut is 8mm long, at this point the saw dulled to the point that it became difficult to maintain a sawing action without it sticking.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/diabolik/angleiron.jpg
Here is some important info about wire saws:
• they were originally designed for cutting cured wood such as fence posts, not green tree boughs. It will cut a standard size 4” by 4” fence post around over 15 times before it dulls, under these conditions it is very unlikely to break.
• Whilst it will cut mild steel its slow going and you cant cut very far before you dull the saw
• The wire saw is a disposable item, it is design to be used once under E & E circumstances and disposed of. Durability is sacrificed for concealablity because if you can’t hide it, you can’t use it!
• It does not normally break because of heat build-up or wear whilst cutting cured wood or mild steel, it will however break easily if used on green wood due to binding caused by the moisture content of green wood
• Like all tools there is some element of correct technique in its use
• Its probably not much use for bushcraft unless you foresee yourselves being captured and held by “zee Nazis” :BlueTeamE
for bushcraft you are much better off with a bucksaw blade and the knowleadge to build a bucksaw frame.
Unless you have one of these which was designed for SOE to cut down Telegraph poles with!:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/diabolik/SOE2.jpg
those are large floor tiles instead of standard wall tiles if thats throwing your size perspective off and this a pocket chain saw in the middle for size comparision:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/diabolik/soesaw.jpg
its razor sharp too!
but seriously, unless your a 'super secret laser guided ninja' in your spare time, your still better of with a bucksaw for bushcraft :D
Please note that these are my opinions and views, which are not necessarily those of the manufacturers or resellers of wire saws.
Lee_shanahan
25-02-2007, 23:10
Thanks alot stuart, i found that information extremely useful. That saw looks lethal, bet it gets the job done tho. I think its fair to say invest in a good saw and i carn't go wrong. Are there any sites that sell decent saws at a reasonable price?
Silverback
26-02-2007, 15:12
Amazon probably offer the best price on the Laplander (around £19 delivered I think). Frost's High Carbon Mora, Gransfors Small Forest Axe and Bahco Laplander are a lethal trio to tackle just about anything and all for about a quarter of the price of a Woodlore these days :rolleyes: (under £80 the lot :) )
Was a time when we had those hand chain saws in the G10 stores, along with billhooks. Alas, some eedjit decided they were not needed anymore and they dissapeared. A shame really because the army had Husqvarna chainsaws that aren't to be used anymore due to health and safety and the fact that the chain bar is about five miles long! They bought a new Makita chainsaw but what with current legislation it is very difficult to find a soldier who can legally use a chainsaw! The hand chainsaw could have filled the role there.
Silverback
26-02-2007, 17:01
They bought a new Makita chainsaw but what with current legislation it is very difficult to find a soldier who can legally use a chainsaw! Unless presumably for battle :eek: now theres a sight that would chill the enemy to the marrow :D
The Ultimate Survival kit? Is it worth it? It cost me £55 a couple of years back. The Blast Match is great as you can use it one handed if you only have one hand available for any reason. There are lots of variations on the chain saw now. The case is strong and you can just fit a small 2 inches folder in. Basically it looks good, but Silverback is right, a Mora, Laplander and Gransfors SFA will do.
I can sympathize with the Wilko specials. At the end of the day, if you get the right quality tool to start with, it may cost a bit extra, but will definitely save you time and money if you look after them.
Unless presumably for battle :eek: now theres a sight that would chill the enemy to the marrow :D
You ever seen a Ghurka with a kukri running at you and screaming like a banshee, now thats awsomely scary!!:eek:
Hey Stuart, that is a cool post you certainly know your stuff don't you!!
Longstrider
26-02-2007, 23:32
Blimey, that old SOE designed job is the very model that introduced me to the usefulness of the design ! My old mentor (Ex-SOE himself ;) ) had one of what was probably the original issue ones and taught me how useful it was when I was a kid. I had ( still have in the shed somewhere?) one of those years ago. I picked it up, already pretty rusty and battered, at a Steam Rally on a stall of junk. I think it cost me 50 pence and it earned it's keep for years.
Anyone know where I could get another? Pretty please?
Longstrider
26-02-2007, 23:39
Blimey, that old SOE designed job is the very model that introduced me to the usefulness of the design ! My old mentor (Ex-SOE himself ;) ) had one of what was probably the original issue ones and taught me how useful it was when I was a kid. I had ( still have in the shed somewhere?) one of those years ago. I picked it up, already pretty rusty and battered, at a Steam Rally on a stall of junk. I think it cost me 50 pence and it earned it's keep for years.
Anyone know where I could get another? Pretty please?
Is there any reason why you could put one of those pocket chain saw blades into a frame like a bucksaw?
Blimey, that old SOE designed job is the very model that introduced me to the usefulness of the design ! My old mentor (Ex-SOE himself ;) ) had one of what was probably the original issue ones and taught me how useful it was when I was a kid. I had ( still have in the shed somewhere?) one of those years ago. I picked it up, already pretty rusty and battered, at a Steam Rally on a stall of junk. I think it cost me 50 pence and it earned it's keep for years.
Anyone know where I could get another? Pretty please?
Alas I cannot help, I dont know where you would find one anymore, I dont think anyone has manufactured them for quite a while and the were a specialist item even then.
Is there any reason why you could put one of those pocket chain saw blades into a frame like a bucksaw?
you can, but it requires a lot of tension because unlike a bowsaw blade the pocket chainsaw wants to arc when cutting and its not really worth the trouble because the teeth on modern pocket chainsaws are pretty poor. you can safely grab a pocket chainsaw anywhere along the blade and even run your hands down it without any harm (in its new out of the packet condition, you can improve it quite a bit if you take a file to it) unlike the old SOE saw which would draw blood if you grabbed it by the blade (it would make a mess of your pockets though, which is why you need the leather case for it)