View Full Version : How does Joe Public perceive bushcrafters?
Jules and I took the dog out to Alderley Edge on saturday for a walk and whilst Jules was in the Ladies "freshening up" I was outside minding my own business. However there were hawthorn bushes just outside the loo's so I set about eating some of the new leaves. A couple and their 2 kids walked past and looked at me with complete disbelief, and when I said "would you like to try some" they quickly hearded their bemused offspring away looking furtively over their shoulders as they did.... I felt like shouting after them "The Beech leaves are even tastier" but thought better of it. I think a lot of City folk (or big 4x4 driving North Cheshire Nuveau Riche) have no idea what bounty they walk past in their rush to get to the nearest "Henrys Table" lol :-D
qweeg500
25-04-2004, 19:43
I'm not sure about the public in general but my work colleagues seem to think I'm some sort of special forces wannabe, which I have to say almost annoys me when the mickey taking gets out of hand.
Alas, some people will never quite get the point.
Matt
I have two great loves, both of which in my mind are linked - one is re-enactment, the other bushcraft.
While I was on Woodlores payroll I was once asked, "Why do you do re-enactment? Its just a bunch of no life saddo's pretending to live a different life!"
"Odd," I replied, "All my mates in re-enactment think all bushcrafters are no life saddo's prentending too!"
Ray wasn't impressed.
But thats the truth of it - its all a matter of prospective. Like re-enactment we all do it for a different reason and get out of it different things VIVE LE DIFFERENCE!.
As for the public, well LIKE Dave, I think if you can only try to teach them something in the hope that they might just grasp the idea. Although I too often get 'the look' but hey, as with any minority thing I guess you just gotta learn to live with it.
RAPPLEBY2000
25-04-2004, 21:44
did you really need to ask the question? :-(
:cry:
woe betied anyone that actually advertises them self as a bushcrafter!
let me tell you about the course i just finished.
as a short history, in past years i used to wear camo, and evrything i had was military issue or camo/green! i have "grown up" and now I'm far more "ray mears looking (equipment wise)"
on my recent course i made a !00% effort to use only civilian gear, and not discuss "survival", ownly pice of army gear being the a Camo PLCE rucksack, which i bought because of it's simularity to the "berghuas cyclops" which i know to be good, also cos it's cheep and strong!
so what happens if you wear an army rucksack?
wait for it......hang on...... here it is....
"are you in the army then?" :shock: :-(
on one occasion my group was packing gear, i used my PLCE sack but with the pockets empty, a house mate used a 40l bag, he was addament that mine was heavier to the extent he tried to weigh them, they were just about equal, but he insisted i was carrying too much.
another time after a climb i was wearing grey rohan trousers, a green buffalo jacket and a black hat, with my rucksack and heard jokes from my friends they could not see me, infering that i was actually trying to hide.
several other occasions though i only wore camo trousers for casual reasons in class 2x in 8 months, it would always be assumed i would wear camo.
all this cos i have an army bag and have an interest in bushcraft.
sorry but joe public isn't ready to accept bushcraft yet! :-?
RAPPLEBY2000
25-04-2004, 22:02
:-D cheers, we'll find out in 4 weeks!
everything's going to plan!
bigjackbrass
25-04-2004, 22:06
However there were hawthorn bushes just outside the loo's so I set about eating some of the new leaves.
How have we managed to get this far through the topic without anyone posting an "Eats, shoots and leaves" comment?
People are always afraid of thing that they don´t have any knowledge of, in some countrys in the worls people get killed because they are diffrent. Here people shake their head and mumble something about stupid and crazy. But I don´t care what people think.
You should see the faces of my neighbours when i come walking in full military uniform, rucksack and an automatic rifle in my hand. I wonder what they think of me then :lol:
well i`ve been reliablly informed that i wear a swanni to atract attention cos i want people to look at me , this was by the same bloke who took the mick out of my footwear until it was all of a sudden trendy to wear the following year, i really try not to let joe public get on my chest but they seem to ge the better of me , but then we all live in a stressed out world of sorts so maybe they`re just venting ? i dont know but the man and his woman down the woods the other day were impressed as my daughter needed a swing to be made for the rope swing in the wood so daddy got his knife out and battoned some hazel and hey presto swing, oh yeah and mum warmed her hands on a cramp ball that i sparked for her, they looked on with big smiles but before that i`d wrongly marked them up as "joe public"
You think bushcraft comes with baggage? - Knife collecting has a fair bit of luggage too. :lol:
Like Gary says, vive la difference!
yeah but knife collectors are all wierdos man :wink:
Just dont tell em, cos when your backs turned, they'll gralloch your children - or so I've heard. :roll:
mojofilter
26-04-2004, 06:33
you should see the looks i get from the familys with 100+ grand boats at loch lomond when they see me huddled round a small fire with bits of bacon draped over one stick and spirals of dough wrapped round another.
best of it is, anyone who has been brave enough to try a bit has been well impressed! :mrgreen:
Justin Time
26-04-2004, 08:21
With "Joe Public" I've found the best disguise is my camera with a longish lens. My patch is just behind the housing estate I live in so have to walk though a few streets to get there. Neighbours etc know I'm into wildlife and I tell them about the foxes and badgers I see and try and photograph. This helps explain the camo and green stuff.
Of course the kids who found my debris shelter wanted to talk about a whole bunch of other stuff, so I ended up showing them how to make feather sticks and how to use the fire-steel.
At work it's different, although I don't tend to use a name for what I do, some of my colleagues talk about me doing the " Ray Mears" stuff. I tend to just talk about what I did, what I ate, what I saw. Did get some funny looks from the secretaries when I was talking about skinning a rabbit with stone tools I'd made by bashing rocks together.....
unfortunatly to the public in general bushcraft means running around in the woods dressed in camo, hiding from an imaginary enemy and carrying and huge bowie
its an image given to the public by movies and survivalists
hopfully now that bushcraft is on TV and at the NEC etc the public will become more educated
can you imagine the day people ask you what you do as a passtime and you can say "bushcraft" with out having to explain what bushcraft is and then convince them your not a nutter :-D
Great Pebble
26-04-2004, 09:38
:evil: This is a topic which upsets me somewhat, it's the whole "attitude" thing that gets up my nose.
Not, I hasten to add, the attitude of Joe Public. I couldn't give a stuff what he thinks. What bugs me is people who should know better thinking about how they can go about disguising their lifestyle so Joe Public isn't offended or amused.
You can go ond and on "diluting" the way you do things. toning down your image and activities so people don't think you're weird.... They'll still think you're an oddball, right up until the point that you've "diluted" so much that you look and act exactly like they do.......
Wear what you want, do what you want (within the law) and if what you want to do is illegal, campaign loudly but constitutionally to make it legal.
Me, I think it's funny that people should be interested in who a sportsman sends text messages to or that they should have to consult a magazine before going shopping for clothes.
Justin Time
26-04-2004, 10:53
:evil: This is a topic which upsets me somewhat, it's the whole "attitude" thing that gets up my nose.
Not, I hasten to add, the attitude of Joe Public. I couldn't give a stuff what he thinks. What bugs me is people who should know better thinking about how they can go about disguising their lifestyle so Joe Public isn't offended or amused.
You can go ond and on "diluting" the way you do things. toning down your image and activities so people don't think you're weird.... They'll still think you're an oddball, right up until the point that you've "diluted" so much that you look and act exactly like they do.......
I guess we all live our life according to what we value, and that makes it awful hard to tell other people how they should behave, well, for me anyway. One of the problems/advantages of small village life is that everyone knows your business and that can have a powerful social effect which is not easy to ignore. Even though I now live in a housing estate in a small town that effect is still an issue especially since I don't do my bushcrafting by jumping in the car...I'm the guy with the Flectarn trousers, swannie/ventile and rocket pack walking past their front windows.
The camera gives a starting point to talk with people about what I do when I'm out and about, especially if I meet them in the fields and forests. I've often been surprised at how anxious people ( particularly women) can be at meeting a stranger in the forests, and I have to say that my clothing does contribute to that. Sure, they're responsible for their own emotions but I can make a difference with that by appearing less threatening. First impressions do count but once we start talking about what you can eat and use from the forest, what you can see there then people go away with a better understanding.
I'm guilty of "hiding" as well. It's just for an easy life. I think lots of people don't share their activities with others if they think it's not going to be well accepted. (ie Gary and his re-enactments) I actually discovered that one of my friends also frequents BCUK but since then we don't really talk about bushcraft in front of other friends, or if we do it's said in a slightly cryptic way.
can you imagine the day people ask you what you do as a passtime and you can say "bushcraft" with out having to explain what bushcraft is and then convince them your not a nutter
I'm sure one day it'll be widely accepted but not for a few years yet. I can't wait!!
I must say that the image of people being shocked by maddave
http://www.yoxio.com/images.php?id=26845
munching on a bush did make me smile.
In fairness it's not what you normally see - they probably thought there had been a breakout from the local asylum! :-)
I think that a lot of people percieve all plants as poisonous. On the 15 minute walk to the shops I pass Dandelions, Hedge Garlic, Cleavers, Hawthorn, Birch, Beech, Red Dead Nettle - and those are only the ones that I know. I'm sure there's more!
I bet if i made a "normal" salad and wanted to make it look a bit more colourful by adding some dandelion flowers, most of my friends would either refuse to eat them or have convinced themselves that they don't like them before they do.
A lot of it's the way we're brought up.
It's like Gary's thread about the EC ruling on rabbits. Most people wouldn't even consider skinning their own.
In my house we eat a lot of poultry (curries, stir fries, etc). Chicken breasts are expensive compared to turkey so, as we're not too well off at the moment, we buy turkey steaks.
Now, I was in the supermarket at the weekend and I was getting more turkey when I noticed the whole chickens. The large ones were costing just over £4 for 2.25kg whereas 700g of turkey steaks are just under £3. I decided to buy a whole chicken and joint it myself - before that it wasn't somehting that I had ever considered before because we've always bought breast meat.
I managed to get 9 portions of chicken and 2 portions of stock for £4, compared to 4 portions of turkey for £3. (Admittedly I had to put in the time jointing it as well) Crazy! how many people do you know that would be prepared to joint there own chicken?
Sorry for going on a bit! :roll:
Great Pebble
26-04-2004, 12:59
can you imagine the day people ask you what you do as a passtime and you can say "bushcraft" with out having to explain what bushcraft is and then convince them your not a nutter
Honestly, no. Any more than I can imagine anyone ever being able to admit to being a train spotter without hearing jokes about anoraks, and look at the size of the industry serving them. :wink:
I've no particular wish to be an object of anyone's derision nor do I particularly revel in being seen as a weirdo, but I've even less inclination to modify my behaviour in any way because of someone else's perception problem.
unfortunatly to the public in general bushcraft means running around in the woods dressed in camo, hiding from an imaginary enemy and carrying and huge bowie
:rolmao: Yes it does seem to provoke that reaction. Karen (my other half) gets this all the time when trying to explian what I'm doing out in all weather catching rabbits and living from the land.... most of her work friends thought I was a big strapping shaven headed army bloke.... oooo there surprise when they met me ;-)
The image is slowly changing though. At college I have found alot of interest in the subject. Many mature students, especialy the parents among them, have a fairly open attitude. Most have heard of ray mears and seen the programmes, and these tend to think of us as grown up boy scouts who are very eco friendly..... I have been asked many times by parents if I teach children, they think it will be good for them.
:-)
Ed
C_Claycomb
26-04-2004, 13:48
I am not too worried about who at work hears that I am interested in bushcraft, but after years of experience with people's reaction to rabbit shooting, I am a bit careful about what I say to strangers.
Bushcrafters play with knives and axes, we make fires, we are generally not adverse to "natural" food, that can include killing and cleaning it ourselves. To a lot of people we could be aliens from another planet!!
Recently I have been on some walks with work mates through the local forest. They are happy to walk, they think that the woods are very scenic, but their interest pretty much stops there. They can't tell you the difference between an oak and an ash :shock: really! They look at the country as if it were scenery flashing by the car window.
They think me a little odd, but like me otherwise, so don't make much of my interests. At least they don't think bushcraft is "sad" :lol:
Yeah, it's a sad fact that most 'normal' people wouldn't know one tree or wild creature from another even if they had a big lable saying "This is a Linnet, not an LBJ (Little Brown Job)".
Some people have accused me of being an escapist who can't cope with the modern world, a fantasist. My answer is, "No, I can cope with the modern world, and it's going out into the woods that keeps me able to cope with it and not use my gollock on annoying wingeing...". I would say it keeps me 'normal' but to me, it's us lot that are normal, and the others who are weird.. :lol:
And one thing they forget, it US that are the guardians of the 'this green and pleasant land', :soapbox: even if we do end up using part of it to make a nice fire to roast other bits over. :chill:
I have been asked many times by parents if I teach children, they think it will be good for them.
The last time I was airgun hunting, a couple of weeks ago, a couple of young teenagers weandered into our camp attracted by the smell of frying pigeon. They were obviously a little surprised to find two twenty year olds in a mix of swannies and combats sitting round a fire carving spoons. They were however absolutely fascinated by what we were up to, so much so, that on the following day they actually brought their friends along! I don't know quite how much of this was entertainment in the manner of a freak show or an actual interest on their part, but we had quite an audience for a while, rather annoying when you see the woodies go hurtling from their roosts!
Similarly at University I often find people interested in what it is I do out in the woods, I literally can no longer count how many times I have heard, 'Can I come?' Although I must admit, rarely do people actually make good on that - though summer is on the way, so you never know. :wink:
We are quite open about what we do, and whilst I think there is a temptation for bushcrafters to be a bit secretive to avoid censure, I think that in my case at least, this would only lead to greater suspicion! In my experience people are a lot more receptive than I would have imagined although I wonder whether its just more acceptable for me to be interested in this, before I've settled down and got career plans. :lol:
Some things though people are never going to accept, picking up road kill I find to be the limit of a lot of people's palate, but then at the end of the day, in our society we are conditioned in such a way that we frown on these things. To borrow from Gary's post on rabbits - 'if its not in cellophane, its not real meat' is the mentality that I feel that I have been brought up in, and its a mentality that I feel I have to challenge every time I kill an animal for food.
Although I have come to expect it from some, it does annoy me that even my family, who know I am serious about bushcraft, find amusement at some of the things I do. Then again we all need a sense of humour :-D But it's my opinion that working in an office nine 'til five is much more of a joke than bushcraft! :-)
Although I too often get 'the look' but hey, as with any minority thing I guess you just gotta learn to live with it.
Yep, I agree Gary ... now I'm proud to be in the minority!
It now staggers me how far down the road of urbanization we humans are and how far we are willing to push what seems to me like an unsustainable way of living ... :cry:
Most become more understanding and interested once they realise that you can learn quite a lot from your surroundings, and make things and eat things.
A good example though is from last week. I had a lifelong friend come and visit my family with his family. I've known him since I was 2 years old, and there is only 3 days age difference between us, but haven't seen him for a couple of years.
We went for a walk in the woods with the families and I found some cramp balls on a tree. I took a couple and he asked what for. I explained and he had fits of laughter, asking if I thought I was Ray Mears or something. Anyway, we laughed it off, but when we got home, he found my mushroom pocket guide in the magazine rack. He soon got started on taking the mickey about this too, andf then when he found the tree guide in there, that was it, I was an official tree hugger.
He asked if the ones I found in the woods were in the book. I showed him, and he read the text, then he read some more, then he looked up some of the other types as he flicked through, then he found that many could be eaten, then he realised he'd seen some like that in woodland near him, then he asked where I got the book from as he may get one too!!!
What a conversion!!
When he and I were kids, we spent nearly every day in the woods, in our den, doing many of the things I do now with bushcrafting. It was with him I lit my first fires, ate my first wild leaves, grass and nuts, drank spring water, built my first shelters. We knew all the trees, the bushes, the local animals. The pace of life just means he had forgotten that he too is a bushcrafter, he just hasn't practised for about 28 years.
I think it may be the same with Joe Public. Memory loss and fear of looking daft. When you're a kid you don't really care what others think. If you enjoy doing it you do it.
They just need to reach in and find that inner child man!! :-D
SquirrelBoy
27-04-2004, 10:35
Its funny, mention Bushcraft and they think its something rude :oops: mention Survival and they think its about eating grubs/worms or worse stocking up arms :roll:
....but mention Mr Mears and they get all excited :-D and IMO he is the best advert for our fascinating past time.
BTW, I got my SquirrelBoy title from a friend I told about me eating said rodent on a course. Guess it must just seem odd to those who buy their food in wrapped plastic - but to us it couldn`t be more natural...
....but mention Mr Mears and they get all excited and IMO he is the best advert for our fascinating past time.
I agree. More people are comming to understand what bushcraft is about from watching his programmes on tv and reading his accompanying books. The public are slowly changing their opinions and do see us in a more favorable light than say 'survivalists'. This can only be a good thing.
:-)
Ed
very true
the quickest way to get people to understand what your doing is say
"Bushcraft..... You know like that guy ray mears on TV"
ditchfield
27-04-2004, 21:14
It seems like we all get the same thing. When I'm out and about, I try to avoid people as much as possible. The other day, I came wandering onto the road off a track and met a dog walker. The site of me in my boots, army lightweights and ventile smock with a stout staff in my hand made her look like she'd seen a ghost and she increased her speed. When i'm walking with friend's, I like to point out the different edible plants to people in the hope of teaching them something. They all seem pretty interested! Like Maddave, I often find myself grabbing and munching on a handful of beech or hawthorn leaves when walking down the street, only to realise what i'm doing.
Sorry for the rambling post.
Buckshot
28-04-2004, 09:07
At the weekend I went out early on Saturday morning on the farm where I 'keeper. As I was meeting some other people there at 10 I took some breakfast with me.
When I was in mid flow with the kelly kettle the farmer came past on a tractor, I could see him smirking as he came closer. As soon as he turned off the engine I offered him a brew, hoping to stop any witty comment. He said "No thanks. Bloody hell, you're like that bloke off the telly"
I wish ...
Remember this reaction is from a farmer that tries (and likes to be seen) to be conservationally minded, planting belts of trees etc. Basically someone who should have a sympathetic ear to Bushcraft - but no.
Cheers
Mark
stuart f
28-04-2004, 10:54
After reading these posts i began to think that most people who are not familiar with bushcraft and mock us for what we do,maybe they don,t deserve an explanation about it. Maybe we as bushcrafters should just keep it to ourselves and not let on to joe public about its therapeutic value,the stress relief that it brings,the way in which i somehow feel cleansed when i get back from a few nights spent out under the stars.
So why feel ridiculed when we know better,maybe we should just keep the woods,the stars and the limitless fresh air to ourselves.
sorry i,ll get of my :soapbox: now.
CHEERS
STUART F.
"Bushcraft..... You know like that guy ray mears on TV"
And isn't his new TV series going to be called Bushcraft? It can only help!
...loads snipped... Crazy! how many people do you know that would be prepared to joint there own chicken?
A few... :-D I'll quite happily buy a couple of large chickens and dismember them into requisite portions, then make a couple of gallons of stock with the carcasses. Takes time, yes, but I'd rather do that than pay over the odds for the stuff - it is pretty tasteless as it is. I also make my own sausages now - takes flipping ages, but the results are worth it. I'm not convinced it saves me much financially, but that isn't entirely the point.
My work colleagues think I'm quite mad - an image I'm happy to encourage them in (it is a far more harmless/affable image than rambo wannabe). They know that I will happily shoot for food, enjoy blacksmithing (usually small projects), make knives, use said knives and can build or repair almost anything that it comes up my back to do. A few of them have queried the fact that some of my kit is issue; for those who don't know my misspent youth, I can explain that it is practically disposable at the price. I've an interest in "forgotten" skills and crafts, and my primary justifications are a) because I can and b) because so few other people are keeping them alive. The fact that it doesn't tally with most people's image of what a software engineer is suits me fine.
Ray Mears takes a lot of stick from some quarters, I know, but has done more to raise the profile of what we are interested in than anyone else I can think of. Well, possibly excluding The Good Life for some areas... (!) I doubt that the bushcrafty courses around the country would be as well attended without his efforts.
the naughty boy
28-04-2004, 16:07
the question shoul be asked ..what do bushcrafters think of joe public.
i often judge people by their usefullness if we were stranded on a desert island.i gotta say i meet an awful lot of meat every day and some of them dont even qualify for that.! :twisted:
I'm quite alarmed by everyone's stories. I've never encountered anything like this. I can only presume that it's different to here in Wales, where there are plenty of people still practicing country ways.
(Although this does change a bit in the summer months when the tourists arrive and they do sometimes stare or make comments, but it's just something you have to live with along with sarcy comments about the Welsh language and local placenames. :roll: Gah! If I hear that line from Blackadder one more time about never asking for directions in Wales or you'll be combing spit out of your hair for a month ... like no one's ever said it before I swear I'll ... :banghead: !! Yawn! :wink:)
Could it be perhaps that Joe Public's alarm at bushcrafters practicing their skills has more to do with bushcrafters themselves feeling conspicuous and uncomfortable with what are doing? Just a thought ...
As you might know I'm into geocaching, which is also something people feel uncomfortable doing to begin with, but eventually you just learn to ignore what others might be thinking and get on with it! :wink:
larry the spark
28-04-2004, 17:06
I've never had a problem and more to the point couldn't give a monkeys what joe public thinks of me, whether I'm fully geared up for trip somewhere or merely picking plants or whatever on a dander up the hill. Most people are used to seeing DoE groups, hikers, ramblers etc so why are we any different? Some of my mates, especially downhill bikers, take the mick but to me they're just big kids in power ranger costumes (no offence bikers out there) ... take a bit of stick but give it back! I guess the firelighting and blade using side of things needs a degree of discretion but as for rest... fugeddaboutit!
people just seam to see me as a paranoid Rambo type TEOTWAKI survivalist, wich i'm definatly NOT. People also seam to stare at me wenn i'm doing stuff. I'm not wearing mine green and brown clothing and stuff most of the time either. Finding you flint and stell kit in your backpack during lunch break and playing with it seams to be enough... ok, ok i have worn mine green clothing at school wenn i didn't had enough clothing to seperate normal and bushcraft clothing. And i have worn mine DPM parka ONCE wenn it was raining cats and dogs.
Finding you flint and stell kit in your backpack during lunch break and playing with it seams to be enough...
I took some flint & steels into work and had everyone trying them out :-D
Didn't actually go as far as getting them to light anything, but got them making sparks.
the naughty boy
28-04-2004, 23:00
[quote="larry the spark"]I've never had a problem and more to the point couldn't give a monkeys what joe public thinks of me,
lol i was going to say exactly the same thing m8.
ps caught a couple of lovely trout tonight 8-) ]
bushwacker bob
29-04-2004, 00:28
lol i was going to say exactly the same thing m8.
ps caught a couple of lovely trout tonight 8-) ]legally? and how? blowpipe or dynamite? :0:
It’s very interesting to note the various replies. I know from my own personal experience I have received the odd comment by wearing the more subdued/military clothing while out and about in the woods. I have also experienced extreme hostility from trespassers whilst out shooting, who just didn’t like people shooting, and would not/could not accept that they did not have a legal right to be on the land.
I think especially where knives and axes etc are concerned, if you’re encountered in the woods by “Joe Public” it is likely as not to cause some alarm, unless you are obviously a forestry worker. Unfortunately, all too often the media has portrayed anyone who would have use of the type of knife (let alone an axe) as used by a Bushcrafter as a potential threat to society. I hope very much though that attitudes are starting to change with the exposure people are getting to Mr Mears and the like.
MagiKelly
29-04-2004, 15:54
I took up wildlife photography partly to give me a legitimate excuse for being in the woods. It was not as bad when I was still shooting or had a dog to walk but a man on his own wandering about the woods would always get strange looks.
Of course now I look really strange. Setting of into the woods at 4am carrying a pack full of kit in camo from head to toe.
It's so different to see a man's point of view about being in the woods. I don't feel any of this when I go into the woods ... but then as a female, I'm ultra careful to not be seen in the first place because you just don't know who might be around. :wink:
MagiKelly
29-04-2004, 16:40
It's funny. My wife is always concerned about me getting attacked in the woods. I have always thought of this as being a female point of view. To me it is generally an unfounded concern. As I point out to her a mugger is more likely to hang about the streets to find prey rather than a remote woodland. The people you meet outdoors are generally friendly with the odd gang of teanagers out for a drink but they are generally boisterous rather than dangerous. I am of course talking here about a woodland that is fairly remote as opposed to a tree lined alley or the like where I would be more concerned.
Still there is no harm in staying out of sight.
Given that we are talking about the publics perceptions of people that are interested in Bushcraft - something that has always amazed me (I can’t categorically vouch for this) is that I’ve been told that the item that has generated the most ever public complaints to the television regulator, was when Hugh Ferrnly-Whittingstall shot, cooked and ate a squirrel!
... was when Hugh Ferrnly-Whittingstall shot, cooked and ate a squirrel!
You would have thought that he was the first and only person to ever do it ... :roll:
It's funny. My wife is always concerned about me getting attacked in the woods. I have always thought of this as being a female point of view. To me it is generally an unfounded concern. As I point out to her a mugger is more likely to hang about the streets to find prey rather than a remote woodland. The people you meet outdoors are generally friendly with the odd gang of teanagers out for a drink but they are generally boisterous rather than dangerous. I am of course talking here about a woodland that is fairly remote as opposed to a tree lined alley or the like where I would be more concerned.
Still there is no harm in staying out of sight.Well it's easier to just stay out of sight, keep still and quiet and let people go on their way. Most people are harmless certainly, but I can't really imagine a situation where I was on my own somewhere remote and would start to chat with someone (unless it was a woman of course) to find out whether they were friendly or not. A female point of view definitely. Most women don't go out alone or just plain don't go out ... :-( I guess it boils down to our individual perceptions of safety and security.
was when Hugh Ferrnly-Whittingstall shot, cooked and ate a squirrel!I think the placenta episode got pretty high number of complaints too. Not surprising really ... :hurra:
Unfortunately, most of the general public don't even know what the term 'bushcraft' means. Once you try and define it, they immediately either start asking about guns and knives or want to know if your a 'survivalist'. If they've seen Ray Mears or Bushtucker man, there's normally a comment to the effect that 'Oh, you're one of them. What's wrong with McDonalds, then?' or 'Do you camp in your back garden and eat slugs, then? Hur-hur!' (cue sound of knuckles dragging along ground....)
I think that, as a minority interest - and, lets face it, that's what it is - we will suffer from the same attitude as many other minority interests. Mind you, sometimes we don't do ourselves any favours - read the kit stuff and there is an out-of-proportion obsession with knives and bladed tools. Stand back a moment and have a look - we do go on a bit about knives, don't we? To most people, this is quite an unhealthy pasttime, even thoiugh the whole point is using a knife as a tool and not a weapon. Try explaining that to someone, though....
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In my experience so far, I have come across two types of people, those who are of an open mind and those who have preconcieved misconceptions (or a closed mind).
Despite the industry that I work in most of my friends and colleagues appear to have an open mind on bushcraft, some will ask if a weekend went well and what we did and others ask that the next time I go out could they go along.
The others (with closed minds) tend to hide in thier own technological frightened world, sneer about something that they have little knowledge about, with less understanding of how to do things for themselves in the wilds and no idea why you would wish to do it.
Some people cannot appreciate the majestic beauty of the great outdoors and with that they also cannot appreciate that it can be a potentially dangerous place.
They would never be able to fathom the pleasure taken in turning out your first good spoon, being able to complete a task using manual tools and of course starting a fire without a gallon of petrol and a lighter.
I am afraid that this is symptomatic of todays society, this is really due to the lack of understanding/education on this subject, because these values are no longer taught. They can go theyre way, I will go mine.
I'm not sure about the public in general but my work colleagues seem to think I'm some sort of special forces wannabe, which I have to say almost annoys me when the mickey taking gets out of hand.
Alas, some people will never quite get the point.
Matt
I have the very same problem , I put it down to my use of X mil gear coz I aint got a lot of spare cash.......I am trying to move into the olive world though...I recently purchase a field shirt from extreme its goooooood....
:lol:
I have heard about people getting attacked in the woods. If I'm out and about on our local common I stay away from groups as much as possible. As for what my mates think, a few are ex scouts who like the idea mst seem to like knives (then get cheap ones that are rubbish) so I don'rt getmuch trouble from them, they get me to get BBQs going when it's raining
I find peoples perception of bushcraft quite amusing. I'm 15 and attend a secondary school. Most students have never eaten anything that hasn't come out of packet from safeway. Most seem to find the idea of killing a rabbit in the field and then eating it disgusting!
I find there is two main responses when people find out what im reading about on BCUK. Most find it sad and fail to see why it's so interesting and some are very interested.
The school has a combined cadet force and we are thinking of running a survival weekend. I can't wait to see the reaction of some of my fellow pupils when I show them how to kill and skin rabits lol.
Will
The General
21-06-2004, 02:14
About the most that anyone has said to me was when walking back from some nice camping in the hills over Rohan in N Wales a farmer spotted me. Now I was loaded up after a weekend camping and my Army issue poncho was covering everything as it was pouring with rain. He was stood by a gate watching me approach and as I passed he asked me what I was doing. I explained I had been camping for a few days in the fields and woods to get away from the rat race. He offered me a cup of tea and we chatted for about 15 mins about nature and the kit I carried. I went about my business with a handful of boiled sweets from the farmer. I think it helped that I spoke a bit of Welsh and his dogs loved me!
I am very much a dog person, never had any bother with a dog. My parents have two Tibbetin Terriers and they go wild when I visit. Most people they say hello to at best or just plain ignore.
In Wales, going camping is the answer to what you are doing. You mention bushcraft and you may as well say getting ready for WW3... :shock:
Lots of people 'go camping' round here, so it is not an issue. I am cautious though that a lot of my kit is not 'Millets' issue kit and may frighten some people.
ChrisKavanaugh
21-06-2004, 03:02
Nos Da from California where the fruits and nuts drive BMWs with a latte' in one hand and cellphone in the other. First and formost, everyone of you is an ambassador for bushcraft. Like it or not, you have to be positive with even the most negative reaction. Case in point: during our last election I came upon a train derailment. I was one of only 2 vehicles that stopped to help. I had just attended a NADER rally and wore a political button. The train was full of Republican party members returning from some big fund raiser. They were almost embarressed until I assured them we were both supporting the American political process. That, and being a 'survivalist' in the philosophy of our website with two cases of individual water, first aid kit and a few blankets made me very popular with crew,passengers and emergency crews. Do you think those people will be more receptive to some hippie Green party member in the future? Everything in our societies is a product; religon, mouthwash, Bushcraft. Be good salepersons and make eye contact with a smile.
Chris,
What does the word 'Survivalist' portray in the US? I think from what we've seen on the TV in the UK, they are perceived as anti-government people who live in the mountains, armed to the teeth, and - more often as not - seem to be Christian fundamentalists.
Is this the case? Does it carry negative connotations? How are people into 'bushcraft' generally viewed in the US? Is it seen more as something quite sensible and useful there because of the great expanses of wilderness and the more extreme weather?
In fact, I'd be interested in answers to the last question from anyone not based in the UK.
ChrisKavanaugh
23-06-2004, 20:19
Mike, the www.equipped.org homepage has a link "We are not survivalists" that Doug wrote as an early disclaimer and explanation. It was an 'interesting' social phenomenon aside from the violence. In the post 60s there was a 'Homestead' movement with many people building log cabins, creating self sufficient farms or incomes through beekeeping etc. and generally emulating the Amish community. There were some marvelous books published, mainly by Rodale press and several magazines. There was the publication of various books, ie The Anarchist Cookbook and the infamous titles of Paladin Press. Ironically, some of these efforts came from the left political sphere as much as the right. The militia or survivalist movement was fueled by the old standby agendas of the american nazi party,KKK and their many cameleon incarnations. I always thought a real survivalist would keep his mouth shut and maintain a low profile. Their 'bible' is a piece of literary trash called The Turner Diaries. A racist blueprint for WASP males with assault rifles defeating evil negro communists. The militias pretty much got stepped on with various confrontations and have lost considerable numbers. Like any doomsday cult, when the mother ship doesn't arrive from the Pliedies as promised members leave. The media fuel this and any other social phenomenon for their own altuistic, detached, neutral journalistic purposes. In other words, when an ex marine goes berserk, kills his family and runs into the woods hes a "Marine Corps trained survivalist." Fortuitously, there is an almost equal amount of attention to accepted outdoor pursuits; camping,hunting,hiking etc. It can all get pretty muddled. My nightmare is hiking blindly into a civil war battle re enactment arguing with satanists over camping spots. :shock:
Thanks for the explanation. I suppose, like any of these things, we get a 'media-tainted' view over here of what's happening over there!
I have to say, I think you are lucky in the States to still have enough room to get away from it all properly. Our wilderness in the UK is rapidly diminishing and increasingly crowded.
I like your civil war re-enactment horror - regardless of the outcome, it would make an interesting book/film.....