If you owned some land, what trees would you plant? [Archive]

demographic

03-09-2006, 20:20

A rather hypothetical question really as I don't have a pot to P*** in let alone a window to chuck it out of but I think it's worth asking anyway.

I have a mate who's parents planted about 7000 trees on their land, they planted stuff that was native to the British isles (there was a grant avaliable for this at the time so they got half of it paid for) but even though their place is a good habitat for the local deer, badger and red squirrel I think I would have gone for more trees that produce edible fruits/nuts.
That would include...

Ash (I like the wood).

Cherry (the fruits nice and the woods OK I suppose, also)

Crab Apple tree ( crab apple jelly is good and they produce a lot of pectin for jam and so on).

Damson trees (again they grew on our land when I was a nipper but we used to pick em and make damson gin, damson wine and I might be wrong as ait was a long time ago but I think even damson jam)

Hazel (the woods very flexible and hazelnuts make god eating)

Mountain ash (Rowenberry jelly and rowenbery wine reminds me of my childhood as my mother used to make it).

Wallnut (hey the woods really nice to work with and I like wallnuts).
There are a lot of others so post em up.

What would you plant?

sxmolloy

03-09-2006, 20:25

Sweet Chestnut for a little Autumn roasting of the nuts and Birch (the ones with the paper like bark) for getting the fire going that I would roast the Sweet Chestnuts on. :D

I think you covered the rest in the above post....ATB....Stu

Bisamratte

03-09-2006, 20:26

Oak - for my great great grand kids to play in and use :)

JonnyP

03-09-2006, 20:35

Mixed native woodland for me, smaller species round the perimmeter, to provide fruit and nuts, going to big oaks and ash etc in the middle.
Non of it would be planted in lines (hate that).
Also, I would have to have at least 1000 acres, we are talking hypotheticaly here.
Thing is though, I can't wait for it to grow up, so I will just have to go and buy a wood and make do.........

Toddy

03-09-2006, 20:38

Trees that would coppice well, too. Oak, willow, hazel, and the like. Holly just 'cos it belongs :) elm because we miss them. Hornbeam, hawthorn, elder, honeysuckle and briar rose. Wych elm, sycamore and rowan. Beech and birch though I'm told that beech is now considered to shading of other trees, I've got a beech hedge and it seems happy enough so it could be kept from becoming massive.

Cheers,
Toddy

demographic

03-09-2006, 20:55

Theres already a load of trees I realise I forgot about :o

Snufkin

03-09-2006, 21:00

I'd add yew to the list and also some domestic apple varieties and some pears.

dtalbot

03-09-2006, 21:08

Pretty much all of the above plus some blackthorn to keep me in sloe gin/vodka

British Red

03-09-2006, 21:24

Was just going to go for blackthorn

Okay

Spindle (beautiful flowers and seed pods)
Wayfaring (amazing fruit)
Mulberry....cos we can go round it and the fruit is awesome!

Red

Toddy

03-09-2006, 21:32

I've never seen those three Red, and would never have thought of them though they sound excellent.

Cheers,
Toddy

dommyracer

03-09-2006, 21:43

Have to be some elm in there.

led

03-09-2006, 21:49

Amongst some great suggestions above, I'd look at a small coppice of small leafed lime (for excellent carving wood and bark).

rich59

03-09-2006, 22:36

Pine for the resin, the tea, the fast growth, the commercial bit and the evergreen appearance in winter.

But, is there any tree you would leave out?

Draven

03-09-2006, 22:41

hmmmmmmm...
I'd want a bit of pine, oak, willow, birch, cherry, chestnut, probably a couple more I'm not thinking of...
The pine would be a "disposable" tree for me though, I'd probably use it mostly for firewood. I LOVE the smell of burning pine! :D

Toddy

03-09-2006, 22:42

Pine for the resin, the tea, the fast growth, the commercial bit and the evergreen appearance in winter.

But, is there any tree you would leave out?

Good point :)
Leylandii, maybe?

Cheers,
Toddy

Snufkin

03-09-2006, 23:40

I'll second leylandii, evil stuff.
Also add elder and alder to the good tree list.

British Red

04-09-2006, 21:26

I've never seen those three Red, and would never have thought of them though they sound excellent.

Cheers,
Toddy

Here's a spindle tree Toddy...hope you agree its a lovely look when its in flower and seed...I love them as they were one of the first trees that had me rushing to buy a tree book

http://img112.imageshack.us/img112/4783/spindletree2sd.jpg

Red

JonnyP

04-09-2006, 21:36

I found one of those spindles last winter and got it identified by the good folk on here and some info on it too........
http://www.bushcraftuk.com/community/showthread.php?t=9413

Toddy

04-09-2006, 21:36

I see what you mean BR, that is lovely. Are the fruits edible?
And *spindle*, is that what the tree was best used for? I use a drop spindle all the time.
cheers,
Toddy

Tony

04-09-2006, 21:58

Cor, I read the first post on here and thought 'Ahh, I’ve got a few' then I read down and you lot have got well stuck in! There's trees for food, bark, sap, looks, fires, fast growing, slow growing, construction, tools....all sorts. I think it would be the perfect forest!

Oh, and I'd leave out Sycamore, it will find it's own way there anyway :lmao:

rich59

04-09-2006, 22:38

In my local wood grow some imports. Not sure whether they would find a place, but maybe -

The Cherry Laurel - nice evergreen hedge and edible fruit. Could make almond flavour if one is ultra careful about the cyanide levels! It does seem to out compete the lower levels, so one might have to keep it in check.

The Rhododendron - very pretty, but choose the wrong one and it will take over the lower levels. I think on balance it would be out, not in.

Depends if you are a purist for native species or more cosmopolitan I suppose.

By the way I found a good piece on the history of Leylandii. Quite a young tree. Maybe we just haven't explored its uses enough. See http://www.floridata.com/ref/C/cupr_ley.cfm Perhaps it could find a role in creating a fast screen or wind break in the early years of the planted wood allowing others to thrive. Then I could eventually burn it to make way for others.

troyka

04-09-2006, 23:25

you know you could always plant a tree on land u dont own.. kind of guerilla gardening
:)

British Red

05-09-2006, 07:28

Toddy, pretty but poisonous I'm afraid....they are indeed used for making spindles and other fine grained items. Not the worlds most useful tree but I hope theres room in our wood for a few just to give a nice variety!

Red

Ralph

05-09-2006, 09:59

Lets see, everything that has been said, with the addition of sweet chestnut, a couple of willows, birch(I'm surprised that not many people have said this yet :eek: ), beech(It would be lined with a line of copper beech), a small patch of various fruit trees, a a single Ebony that marks the exact centre of the wood ;).

al21

05-09-2006, 10:26

I'd have Medlar on my list too. I think you've already covered other varieties I'd plant. Maybe some lower growing species like Osier and Dogwood, Dog Rose, Honey Suckle, Old Mans Beard etc.

Oh and for no other reason than being a Python fan. A Larch! :)

falling rain

05-09-2006, 12:41

definately some fruit trees, especially apple , and Pine. Green and a friend all year round

locum76

07-09-2006, 19:31

definately some fruit trees, especially apple , and Pine. Green and a friend all year round

i agree, lots of apples, plums, cherrys etc for fruit. and pine because it makes me feel nice and safe. also blackthorn because ther aint enough in my bit to make gin with.

rich59

07-09-2006, 23:25

I would plant a tree from Narnia. Then it had grown full I could cut it down and make a wardrobe......

I would not necessarily choose England to make my wood. I might choose..... The Seychelles and grow palms of various sorts - the sort with the biggest fruit in the world, ordinary coconuts, palms for oil, palms for wine. Rattan might make it too. Oooooohh and huge bamboos from Japan too and maybe the Baobab tree from Africa.

Where would you want your wood to grow?

Montivagus

07-09-2006, 23:51

I wouldn’t plant anything! Assuming my land wasn’t miles from the nearest trees I think I’d just fence it off and wait…..
Natural selection is what should dictate what grows and where. For the long term health of woodland I believe the nursery rearing and transplanting of trees should end. Trees that have fought from seed for a place in the ecosystem will more often than not be healthy and strong. Trees that have been grown in a plastic tube in an artificial environment must be second best. Indeed many is the tube tree I’ve seen bent double and broken within a very short space of time due to its bolting in the tube and reliance on artificial support!
Let nature get on with it and then manage what springs up, if you must, that way you’ll have a better chance at rearing a fuller ecosystem including fungi, insects, birds,…..

Toddy

08-09-2006, 09:05

D'you know I never gave nursery plants a thought; we transplant trees all the time. My garden is surrounded by trees and they seed.........prolifically :eek: If I don't remove them and the seedlings I wouldn't get out the front door in a year or so. In a normal year I plant out elsewhere (someone called it guerilla gardening :rolleyes: :D ) maybe 50 tree seedlings, and I give away about the same potted up. Everything from apple to rowan, oak to hornbeam.

The only problem with doing it the natural way is that you'll get pioneer species like birch almost to the exclusion of anything else. Over time that will change, but it'd be a very limited habitat for an awful long time.

Cheers,
Toddy

Wayland

08-09-2006, 09:36

I like the idea of a central tree, ebony was mentioned, but a redwood could be interesting.

Mulberry is a great fruit too, there was a big established tree on a site I used to do LH events at. We could provide pudding for the whole camp from that.

FeralSheryl

08-09-2006, 13:13

swyn

08-09-2006, 14:43

I like Troyka's idea of guerilla planting. Although you would be surprised, Jon Pickett, at the rate young trees do grow especially on a site that has not had trees on before or you are doing a species change (simliar to crop rotation although on a much greater timescale) I have planted several small mixed stands, some on council land near me guerilla style, others on places where farming is no longer viable (in corners of fields to round them off) The patch on council land is now a wood where you could sling a hammock or several! I planted this 15 years ago (in a curve). The trees are 25'+ tall and 9" diameter, it is really quite dark in there in the summer and the wildlife is thriving within. The species are mainly Beech with some Birch, Pine and Cypress with underplanting of Holly. This has been backed up with Oak and Field Maple at a later date. There are two naturaly seeded Ash which I am sending up and up with pruning and last but not least a single 30 meter tall Scots pine left from the turn of the century. There used to be two more Scots pine but the '89 and '90 gales took care of those and the smallest was left all on it's own. I also like the 'central tree' idea.
Consequently the alternative to buying a wood is to buy a field and do what you are suggesting.... create your own. Seriously, I have seen this done in Norfolk over the last twenty years and the results are really quite staggering. Norfolk prarie to superb mixed woodland and still creating. The wildlife is thriving and the farmland is not being blown away!
I hope I haven't bored you all with my passion :D Swyn.

PS. My biggest threat is squirells so watch out for those. Getting certain trees beyond 25 years old is very very hard indeed... My dad thinks impossible! :eek: S
PPS. Did you know Wayland, that Redwood(sequoia) coppices?

Mad Mike

08-09-2006, 15:12

PPS. Did you know Wayland, that Redwood(sequoia) coppices?
:eek: Wow :eek:

how long between harvests ?

swyn

08-09-2006, 18:34

Haven't really found a use for it yet apart from an idea to form a hide and watch wildlife. It is very very bushy!
Suggestions welcome?
Swyn

British Red

08-09-2006, 18:42

I give away about the same potted up. Everything .....to hornbeam.

Cheers,
Toddy

Lickle puppy eyes for the next hornbeam :( :( :( :D

Or a mulberry each for me and Wayland (except you haven't seen one :( ...200lb of soft yummy fruit a year :eek: )

Floyd Soul

08-09-2006, 22:11

Yeah redwood is the only conifer I believe that coppices. I'd love to experiment with it. I have a couple of seedlings I grew so maybe I'll get a chance to in the future.

For me I'd plant all native. I'm buying about 500 saplings over the winter in the hope that I'll someday have land to plant it on. Guerrila style might be something to consider tho!

I'd have the outskirt boundaries consisting of fruiting hedgerow plants - hawthorn, elder, cherry, damson and apple. They get the most light here and are most accessible. Then many stands of coppice stools - hazel, and sweet chestnut I reckon. Then in the centre, loads of oak, ash, scots pine, and birch I reckon. That can all grow nice and high and be selectively harvested at a sustainable pace.

Oh and a nice understory of holly and yew I reckon.

One can wish eh!

Edit: I do say reckon alot!

demographic

08-09-2006, 22:44

pierre girard

09-09-2006, 08:05

Red pine. I like red pine, and you have some chance of seeing the growth in your life time. In the early 1960s we planted 75,000 on our land. About 25,000 made it to maturity and are of a beautiful size now, 8 to 12 inch through the butt, and from 50 to 75 feet high. Loggers keep approaching us about cutting them, but they are there to stay. They are now reseeding naturally. As they were planted in mature forest, they are very tall and straight. They like a sandy soil.

A few years ago I planted siberian spruce on the land where I live. Beautiful tree, quick growing, and very hardy. My uncle, who owned a greenhouse, keeps telling me I planted them too close together. I want woods, not a tree here and there.

I also like planting apple trees, but the deer like them so much, their survival is always problematic. They need a lot of sun.

PG

Montivagus

09-09-2006, 09:05

You must really like alder and birch then ;)

:confused: I’m not quite sure where all this primary succession worry comes from? We’re not immediately post glacial or anything near it in most of the UK. I’ve already done this on some land in Wales; simply fenced it off to prevent the sheep etc. eating all that grows and hey-presto nothing but oak, ash, beech, sycamore etc.etc. from local trees.
The greatest problem actually came from brambles – I’ve had to spend many an hour with the scythe cutting them back..but hey, I did say you could manage your wood.
:)

demographic

09-09-2006, 11:09

:confused: I’m not quite sure where all this primary succession worry comes from? We’re not immediately post glacial or anything near it in most of the UK. I’ve already done this on some land in Wales; simply fenced it off to prevent the sheep etc. eating all that grows and hey-presto nothing but oak, ash, beech, sycamore etc.etc. from local trees.
The greatest problem actually came from brambles – I’ve had to spend many an hour with the scythe cutting them back..but hey, I did say you could manage your wood.
:)

Fair nuff, just that in the 12 or so years since some people I know planted their woodland (all british trees and helped paid for by a grant) it has come on a long way and provided a decent habitat for deer, badger, red squirrel and all sorts of other animals.

A lot faster than just leaving it would have.

IMO like :)

Montivagus

09-09-2006, 12:33

Well maybe I am being a bit treelitist; quite simply the more trees planted the better! And I guess we may well be in the position of having to take shortcuts to offset/catch-up-on the damage already done.

WRT guerrilla planting…I’d not thought of that but it’s such a good idea I may well not be seen doing it one of these nights soon!
:bandit:

redflex

09-09-2006, 12:49

The problem with brambles etc is due to lack of larger browsers, put pigs in a forest or woodland and the bramble problem disappears.

For the long term health of woodland I believe the nursery rearing and transplanting of trees should end. Trees that have fought from seed for a place in the ecosystem will more often than not be healthy and strong. Trees that have been grown in a plastic tube in an artificial environment must be second best.

Why should it end firstly a good tree nursery will supply only trees of correct provence and these will be of improved quality and health. Trees will be hard of with better roots systme therefore these days the use of tree guards have been reduce in most case no longer used.

Indeed many is the tube tree I’ve seen bent double and broken within a very short space of time due to its bolting in the tube and reliance on artificial support

This is not fault of tree nursery but lack of management and mainatence by the land owner or agent.

malcolmc

09-09-2006, 19:33

Well on my little patch of mud I’ve planted up about ½ acre of trees. I planted for utility and to encourage wildlife.

Planting list

Oak - - - - - - - - - - - wildlife
Western Red Cedar utility/nurse
Hazel - - - - - - - - - - utility/wildlife
Ash - - - - - - - - - - - utility
Rowan - - - - - - - - - wildlife

Sycamore - - - - - - - sacrificial
Box - - - - - - - - - - - - wildlife
Birch - - - - - - - - - - - utility/wildlife
Laurel - - - - - - - - - - utility/wildlife
Wayfaring - - - - - - - wildlife

Crack willow - - - - - utility/wildlife

And one Brewer’s weeping Spruce to lift my soul (it's my favourite tree). :) More info at
http://www.magick.net/casteran/brewer.html and a picture at
http://www.jacksonsnurseries.co.uk/Conifers-PiceaBreweriana.htm .

A book I found very helpful was Collins ‘Tree Planting and Cultivation’ by H L Edlin (ISBN 0 00 212002 X) See http://www.amazon.co.uk/Guide-Tree-Planting-Cultivation/dp/000212002X/sr=1-1/qid=1157825894/ref=sr_1_1/202-2782937-7735836?ie=UTF8&s=books

Mooney

09-09-2006, 19:36

just to put in another word for the beech tree, theres the nuts, edible leaves and the beech leaf noyau you can make with them.
They are a beautiful tree when planted solo and in forests, besides they can grow huge (1-1.5m diameter) in 60-70 years if the soil is good.

Theres alot to be said about huge areas with nothing much else but beech as there is not much fungi it can support (correct me if im wrong on this) and with a carpet of beech leaves they can seem quite like a desert to diversity of wildlife. but they are nice :)