View Full Version : Are you a Swiss Army Knife owner?
Swiss Army Knives (SAK) and the outdoors seem to go hand-in-hand. So, the question is simple - do you own a original (Victorinox) SAK
bushwacker bob
05-03-2004, 23:19
yea, I always carry a victorinox on my belt in an original vict. pouch.It used to be a classic but for the past 3 years it has been a jelly light which is small like the classic but has a red torch beam and mini biro as well as knife,nailfile and scissors.
Yes I carry a SAK
The model is the one shown below
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_g7KcbMxmLEU/Rwnqas3SQUI/AAAAAAAAB3c/jzM8n3aQhOo/s400/swiss+army+knife.gif
I aquired it when I was a countryside ranger, there was a demo of a swiss lawnmower at work by a company called "BUCHER" that specialised in heavy duty reciprocating mowers...... http://www.groundcaremachinery.co.uk/images/cutter100/1.jpg
At the end of the demo we all got the above SAK and it has the word "BUCHER" inlaid into the handle. That was 15 years back and it's still used almost every day :-)
Yep - I've got the Victorinox Campflame. Same as the Camper model, but also gives you FIRE!!!
my genuine one is the classic i have another similar thing but doesn't get used anymore. sometimes borrow my dads locking SAK
i had a Blue Fishermans SAK over 20 yrs old. i snapped the main blade and had reground the file profile. to sum up it was in a really poor way. i paid £4.95 registered post to Victorinox for a quote to repair 2 weeks later i get a call to say my new knife has arrived. Victorinox had replaced it FOC with the latest version. That's what i call top class service
My SAK (yes, I own one :-D ) has been back and forth a few times over the years to Burton McCall for repair (always because of enormous amount of use, not any fault) and the service I've had has always been amazing!
My SAK (yes, I own one :-D )
only one??? :shock:
yes have had several, lost a few, still have several, well, enough to keep me going for a while!
cheers, and.
Well, one that I actually call my own! The SOS Survival. But over the years I've had a few and they are all around and about!
My SAK (yes, I own one :-D )
only one??? :shock:
yes have had several, lost a few, still have several, well, enough to keep me going for a while!
cheers, and.
Wenger makes the "Genuine Swiss Army Knife." Victorinox makes the "Original Swiss Army Knife." They are both correct. Victorinox was first ("original") but Wenger also contracts to the Swiss Gov't for knives for the army. I prefer the Vic's for their can-opener. Lots of Wengers are appearing on the market at deep discounts (> 50%) because they have (gasp!) lock-blade primary blades.
did you know that most of the steel they use comes from sheffield
Wenger makes the "Genuine Swiss Army Knife." Victorinox makes the "Original Swiss Army Knife." They are both correct. Victorinox was first ("original") but Wenger also contracts to the Swiss Gov't for knives for the army. I prefer the Vic's for their can-opener. Lots of Wengers are appearing on the market at deep discounts (> 50%) because they have (gasp!) lock-blade primary blades.
Yep i have had a Victorinox Rucksack model for over 10 yrs now
(thats one of the range wit ha locking primary blade :lol: )
its also has longet main blade and saw than most other models
Excellent knife I have replaced the Tooth pick with a spark rod (as its easy enough to make a tooth pick :wink: ) the 2-3mm dia one you get in a BCB fire kit.
the main blade as getting a little thin year or so ago and the Main spring snapped
Took it to my local dealer and they sent it back as i asked to get it repaired
Back came a brand new one No charge replaced under warranty
:lol: :lol: :lol:
ATB
Duncan
I have one of the small Victorinox knives on my keys (looks somewhat the worse for wear. Lost the toothpick and tweezers, and the scales are started to break!) and I carry a swiss card with my wallet most of the time.
When I was younger I used to have the same model as maddave (without "Bucher" on it though) but I lost it. Then I got given a LM Wave and haven't had any desire to get a new SAK.
In fact, I've been thinking of swapping the SAK on my keys for a LM micra or similar.
gurushaun
07-03-2004, 14:27
Yup I've had a Rucsack for about ten years and I've just aquired a Huntsman of ebay for £16 ( this is the blade I lend to people, or if I'm in a more *sensative* area, SAK's seem to raise less hackles than even a multitool) :roll: .
Cheers
Shaun
Yup tend to keep one in the fishing box and another in the rucksack, although it rarely gets used now, prefer my Leathermans. Slightly off subject anyone know where to send a leathermans to for repair, the locking mechanism on the blades knackered.
Yup tend to keep one in the fishing box and another in the rucksack, although it rarely gets used now, prefer my Leathermans. Slightly off subject anyone know where to send a leathermans to for repair, the locking mechanism on the blades knackered.
Whitby knives are the UK leatherman repair centre.
Send it here
Leatherman Warranty (UK)
Whitby & Co
Aynam Mills
Canal Head North
Kendal
Cumbria
LA9 7BY
I sent mine off with a broken blade and they sent me a brand new one back !! Fantastic service :-)
sure do! same model as maddave put up. Been everywhere with me and is carried most days (depending on what I am doing) in a pocket attached via a mini karabiner and large fishing swivel (to stop twisting) to my beltloop. Gets used a lot for everything to cutting fruit to eat to helping dissect animals in marine practicals at college to opening tins... endless as I am sure you all know. Its years old, even persuaded little sis to get one last year, matching her handbag of course :mrgreen:
Oh yeah, it does get cleaned between .most of these things! :shock:
I also have a gerber fisherman thingy, this sees a lot less use as it is to bulky (for me) for every day carry. Though the fiskars scissors are the best I have ever seen on a multi tool type knife.
Paul
Broken/damaged Victorinox SAKs can be sent to this address for free repair:
Burton McCall
Victorinox House
163 Parker Drive
Leicester
LE4 0JP
Phone: 0116 234 4600
Fax: 0116 235 0069
Yes I have a forester. Lost teh pen and corkscrew screwdriver years ago.
Miz :lol: (MacGuyver-girl!)
woodsitter
07-03-2004, 23:25
Yep I have a Rucksack too. It's got everything you need in a pocket knife and nothing more. The blade is big enough and it lock's! Non-locking knifes should be banned in my opinion (I understand that in Britain somehow it's the other way around :-| )
I have mine with me always and everywhere (except under the shower) and somehow I find a use for it several times a day. I got my first pocket knife when I was 10 of 11, I lost one, broke one, replaced several that got worn down to much, and i cut myself only once! (due to stupidity, I regard it as a 'learning experience' :wink: )
out on trail or in the woods I usually also have something heavier, like a machete, but my Victorinox goes where I go.
I've been really lucky over the years ... misplaced my SAK many times, but, touch wood, it has always resurfaced after a few days tops! :-D
I usually keep a small repair kit of replacement bits ... just in case!
I struck really lucky a few years ago and bought a swiss champ including the double pouch complete with survival kit for £25 in a closing down sale, and what a tool, only problem is that it is a bit too chunky, but very handy to have around.
I then bought the Hunter like the forester but with a razor sharp gutting hook, 4" locking blade that sharpens beautilully.
I now see that they have a bigger version of the champ I think its called the carlosfandango champ 12" wide with 27,000 tools, what the hell are you going to do with that?
:yikes:
MartiniDave
08-03-2004, 08:18
Of course!
I've had an Astronaut for about 20 years, bit big for the pocket.
Most days I carry either a Huntsman or an old Cadet (mini Soldier)
Also got an economy Spartan with busted scales, planning to make new ones from a bit of Bog Oak when I get time.
Only pocket knives I've used more are Opinels, but the lock means they aren't legit for everyday carry.
Dave
I've got the Mauser (green one) great knife. Skinned many a rabbit not to mention a couple of deer with the skinning blade.
Also the tin opener is great - i'm left handed and find most other knife tin openers a real pain to use.
Hmmm, yes. A lot of the tools on Victorinox SAKs are designed for right-handers. And considering that about 1 in 9 people are south-paws, I'm surprised that there's no left-handed version.
Also the tin opener is great - i'm left handed and find most other knife tin openers a real pain to use.
first was a rucksack, still my favourite,
second was a classic, handy for the keyring,
third, a present, was a huntsman, four layers and quite handy.
for those who have lost tweezers etc, try your local cutlers, they often stock replacements, i bought the glasses screwdriver that fits in the corkscrew the other day, i was quite happy, not bad for a quid.
also anyone tried the back of the wood saw for throwing sparks? its quite good, you just have to watch the teeth!!!
first was a rucksack, still my favourite,
second was a classic, handy for the keyring,
third, a present, was a huntsman, four layers and quite handy.
for those who have lost tweezers etc, try your local cutlers, they often stock replacements, i bought the glasses screwdriver that fits in the corkscrew the other day, i was quite happy, not bad for a quid.
also anyone tried the back of the wood saw for throwing sparks? its quite good, you just have to watch the teeth!!!
i just sharpened the back of the main blade with a Diamond hone to give sharp sqaure corners works fine can even be use wit hte blade still folded
ATB
Duncan
A lot of the tools on Victorinox SAKs are designed for right-handers. And considering that about 1 in 9 people are south-paws, I'm surprised that there's no left-handed version.
yeah but all their liner locks are left handed! 8-) 8-) 8-)
cheers, and.
Really? By design? Or is that so that they can't be closed one handed?
A lot of the tools on Victorinox SAKs are designed for right-handers. And considering that about 1 in 9 people are south-paws, I'm surprised that there's no left-handed version.
yeah but all their liner locks are left handed! 8-) 8-) 8-)
cheers, and.
Sorry guys, I went off them completely after getting one wet in salt water which rotted the alluminium spacers to bits. On top of the perennial problems of grit in the pivots and the insecurity of the slipjoint - I ditched it for a small spyderco and have never looked back.
I have just one SAK nowadays - a promo item by my old firm, with blue scales and company logo. I keep it as a curiousity but never carried.
Cheers
but if you carried the sak you wouldn't have needed to abuse a woodlore knife opening cans on derwent water! :nana: :tw: :-D
cheers, and.
A tin can is not match for 01 tool steel!!! :-D :-D
I hate opening tins with my swiss army knife. Never got the knack of it. (That's Adi's job! :wink:)
For opening cans nothing beats the p-38 can opener ...
Apparantly, P stands for puncture while 38 is how may cuts it took to go around a C-ration can (also called a "John Wayne").
P38 - what you drive over them in a Range Rover?
Are these the small folding ones - a git to use left handed.
Yep, that's the one ...
Yeah, I suppose that it would be difficult for a left hander to use that ...
Are these the small folding ones - a git to use left handed.
i find that the swiss army knife can opener is one of the better ones about, about ten years ago now i was on a camping holiday and the cooks had bought a cheap pressed metal opener from the supermarket, it broke after about two catering size cans of beans, so i lent them my knife and that was used to open all the cans of food for the whole week. mind you that was my rucksack, i think the extra length of handle makes the opener easier to use.
i dunno about the single handed opening/closing of liner locks on saks. as far as i know they just are left handed.
i've can't remember having a problem with opening cans with a sak, even though i'm a lefty meself. i think i just learnt to do it right handed. i know many of my scouts have a hard time with 'em.
still versatility for weight wise, they can't be beaten. 8-)
cheers, and.
I agree absolutely!
still versatility for weight wise, they can't be beaten. 8-)
Our kids were used to having their nails trimmed with the SAK scissors from when they were very tiny babies. Once we walked past a climbing shop window which had a two foot high model of a SAK with motor operated blades that opened and closed, and our youngest, who was about a year old, recognized it and stuck her hands out to have her nails cut! :-D
but if you carried the sak you wouldn't have needed to abuse a woodlore knife opening cans on derwent water! :nana: :tw: :-D
cheers, and.
:rolmao: :biggthump
Roving Rich
12-03-2004, 09:46
They're great I have had the same knife for 16 years now. Lost it umpteen times and found it again...(touch wood)
Its seen some serious abuse, snapped the tip off the small blade, and there is just a stump of the awl left. The scales got attacked with a soldering iron when i was at college. So these got heavily carved/engraved. And the main blade got a light engraving when i was practising for a locket for my good lady. I would love to get it repaired.
Lots of sentimental history that knife i suppose. I certainly would not want a replacement. Mainly just the awl fixed (used to work well on locks :roll: )
The can opener is one of the best i have come across, and i have learnt to use it well as a left hander.
Cheers
Rich
Yes.
Always in my PSK is my Farmer SAK as a backup tool.
I have convex the edge it cut like a demon.
I use the back saw blade for scrap firesteel, very good.
I use the awl to make perfect holes in wood with no effort and faster and less energy comsuption than using my knife.
And you have canopener+tap opener+"drivers"+aluminium slabs that you can use as matches strike.
I must say that this SAK can do all my knifes can do expect batoming anyway you can use the saw to make cuts to split branches.
The only lack is corkscrew but you can use this trick, take the bottel and put a cloth in its botton, them hit the botton with the cloth against a wall in an horizontal hit so the wine :twisted: repeat the process and the hits will take cork out of bottel.
Enjoy
the naughty boy
19-03-2004, 21:37
i have a rucksack,a champ,a mini champ,a spartan,an executive and a couple of mini promotional ones.
the champ and rucksack come with me no bush weekends,the spartan and mini to work and the others are in various kit bags somewhere. the locking blade on the rucksack is a good blade,good steel.was going to hang a door with my champ to see how long it would take me..... not very long!
TheViking
04-07-2004, 21:30
Hi
Yes... 2... both Victorinox! A huntsman and an Outrider! When I buy one it just got to have a saw in it! :-D 8-) ;)
rapidboy
04-07-2004, 22:15
At least 10 at the moment ,i love em :lol:
http://img25.photobucket.com/albums/v76/rapidboy1/391_9120_1.jpg
http://img25.photobucket.com/albums/v76/rapidboy1/391_9129_1.jpg
http://img25.photobucket.com/albums/v76/rapidboy1/389_8950_1.jpg
Swiss champ is one of my EDC's.
The German army version is my latest ,it's larger blades are very useful especially the saw.
Blade has a liner lock but I'm not very keen on the serrated edge.
RB
does the swiss tool count as a SAK?
very nice though the handle isn't the best when using the knife under pressure
RovingArcher
04-07-2004, 23:37
It's a Victorinox, but I have absolutely no clue what model it is. Perhaps someone here knows. Oh, no tweezers or pick. It's seen a lot of use over the years. Since this photo was taken, I've exchanged the attached Boy Scouts Hotspark ferro rod for a Scout Firesteel distributed by Kershaw.
http://www.hunt101.com/img/192807.jpg
RovingArcher
04-07-2004, 23:44
I carry one of the older German utility blades w/saw in one of my kits. I like it and the Victoxinox replacement looks like it just might be my next one.
I have the champ and the Swiss Army Tool. I looked long and hard at Leatherman, before deciding on the SA Tool. I got the one with the corkscrew and screwdriver bits. Liked the locking of ALL blades/tools feature which the Leatherman Wave lacks. Solidly built. Love my SAK and SA Tool. I don't leave home without one :)
ChrisKavanaugh
05-07-2004, 00:32
Knife pundits seem to either look like Terminators or Grizzly Adams. I like SAKS because they fit nicely into both the old and new worlds. There is nothing more satisfying than opening a can or bottle, or even decanting a corked wine with a SAK while Rambo stands there slack jawed and gently bewildered with his MREs eviscerated by some Klingon dagger. Many people get along nicely with just a SAK for their outdoor knife. My 4" sheath knives to them are as overkill as the folks with big battle choppers to me. Few products become classic with worldwide recognition. SAK's, with all their shortcomings are one of those.
I currently have two of them. One little one with two blades, saw, scissors, tin and bottle oppener and a bigger locking blade one, the workchamp. I also lost one two years ago at the school outing (rest in peace)...at least it was up on a mountain where they belong...it was a little one, quite wide, with "camping" written on the side, I had go it for my 9th birthday with a pouch and chain, and it followed me everywhere....anyway, my Workchamp is better.
Workchamp:
http://www.victorinox.com/newsite/images/produkte/0-9064.jpg
Little one (Huntsman it seems)
http://www.victorinox.com/newsite/images/produkte/1-3713.jpg
One I lost (Ranger)
http://www.victorinox.com/newsite/images/produkte/1-3763-71.jpg
The Huntsman is quite good, it's got all I *used* to need, two blades (one for food, one for other stuff) etc. But the blade doesn't lock, and two weeks ago I tried whittling after having read Hoodoo's site, and the blade closed itself on my finger when I was breaking a block of wood out...I'd used the small blade for more security but still cut myself...it was quite deep so it's still healing now (two weeks after).
I used to use the ranger for everything, the metal saw didn't get much use, but the chizzle and tiny screwdriver came in usefull sometimes. It also oppened quite a few tins, and one night that I was helping at the bar for a play my parents were in, there was no bottle oppener at that bar, so we (three of us at that bar) got out our penknives and oppened all the bear with them...quit alot of bottles, and it worked just as well as the "normal" bottle oppeners. It gave me quite a scar though, four stitches on my left index. Never cut a notch in wood when you're holding it in your hand.
The name of the Workchamp says it all, it's got a locking blade, a file/metal saw, pliars, a BIG saw, two "crosshead" screwdrivers, plus the other normal stuff (and a mini screwdriver in the corkscrew). The blade can do lots more than the little blade of the smaller versions, and it locks. The saw is much better than the smaller ones. The file never gets used. The bottle oppener, tin oppener and corkscrew work great (and the bigger handle improves them). The pliars have oppened doors (broken handle, person locked in, etc.), folded things back in place, lifted tins of ravioli off the fire, and done lots of other usefull things I can't even remember...The mini screwdriver has been used to repair a watch, glasses, and also a few electronic things. The tweezels are also regularly used...I use it everyday, and it's always in my pocket. It might seem a bit big, but since I've always got it with me I don't even notice it anymore. Oh yeah, we're aloud to bring them to school.
And picnics in the Alps aren't the same if the salami and cheese isn't cut with a swiss army knife :D
There's just something that gets me, why does Victorinox, a SWISS compagny, make knifes that are ILLEGAL IN SWITZELAND??? (it's illegal to carry a one hand oppening blade, and the blade on the biggies are just about to long)
Yes, I've cut my finger whittling with a SAK as well. Still got the scar. My old Champ model was used a great deal, and I agree with Sargey's comments.
One thing I would like to see is the spine of the saw rounded of. I press down with my index finger on it while in use and have had some nasty lacerations from it. Nothing deep, but not unlike paper cuts.
When I travel, so does my Swiss Champ.
TheViking
05-07-2004, 19:27
Hi
I tried to cut the last '' of 2 fingers so the fingertips was hanging in the skin under.... ;) When i was 7... This was with a razor blade ;)
RovingArcher
10-07-2004, 22:44
Ok, ok, where can I pick up one of the new German issue SAKs? They are made by Victorinox, right? Thanks.
rapidboy
11-07-2004, 00:04
Ok, ok, where can I pick up one of the new German issue SAKs? They are made by Victorinox, right? Thanks.
Yes ,made by Victorinox.
I got mine on evilbay but i checked and the seller does not have any at the moment.
Try here http://www.alscher.ch/e/knives/knives2.html ,ear the bottom of the page.
There is also a civilian version of this knife and it has tooth pick and tweezers.
I got the army one simply because i collect military issue SAK's.
Cheers
RB
RovingArcher
11-07-2004, 00:36
Thanks for the info. :-)
BorderReiver
11-07-2004, 19:28
Yes.Never leave home without it. :-)
I've had it over 20 years and can't remember what type it is :roll:
YES!!
The Hunter by Victorinox. The main reason that I carry that particular blade is that it has the longest (and sharpest) sawblade in a folding knife on the market that I know of. It can easily cut through a 4" diameter trunk in just a minute or two.
-Soarn
i have three swiss army knives:
i have one with just a large and small blade, quite an old one with a small blade and file, and a newly aquired voyager, with loads of things inc a clock.
Colin KC
01-08-2004, 22:47
1 Huntsman, 1 Champ & a Swiss card.
Colin KC
01-08-2004, 22:49
Oh, & a Cybertool
I stopped counting them about 10 years ago. All I know is that if I listed them all in a spreadsheet, it would take me a good long while. :o): It would take me even longer to find them as they are squirreled away in glove compartments, tool boxes, trunks, tackle boxes, desk drawers at work, and backpacks. I keep one beside every computer I use which is roughly four.
I would feel buck naked without a SAK of one sort or another on me. As it is, I carry two every day, a minichamp and a ranger.
Here's some of mine, not shown in the pic is the one I use most and have had for 20 odd years, I replaced the scales on it out of neccesity after it turned up in the washing machine, the plastic ones melted, the liners are corroded awl is broken but its still the one I reach for. Wouldnt go anywhere without it at one time, rarely carry one now.
http://www.jasonbhall.freeserve.co.uk/sak.jpg
Sorry if Ive posted this b4!
tenbears10
02-08-2004, 17:25
Here's some of mine, not shown in the pic is the one I use most and have had for 20 odd years, I replaced the scales on it out of neccesity after it turned up in the washing machine, the plastic ones melted, the liners are corroded awl is broken but its still the one I reach for. Wouldnt go anywhere without it at one time, rarely carry one now.
Jason do you do the scales yourself? If yes then do you do any for other people?
Thanks
Bill
Hi Bill
I did the scales myself, its not practical for me to do them commercially, particularly with the harder woods shown above (Boxwood, African Blackwood, Lignum Vitae, Cocobolo) the cost in terms of time makes it totally prohibitive, but I dont mind doing the odd one as a favour ;)
Drop me a pm and let me know what you had in mind.
Jason
How do scales attach onto a SAK? I've wondered this for a long time. Each time mine get loose I just send it back for re-scaling.
How do scales attach onto a SAK? I've wondered this for a long time. Each time mine get loose I just send it back for re-scaling.
Seem to remember a similar discussion over at BB called somthing like custom SAK. I think the scales clip over a stud, a soak in very hot water will remove them.
Cheers
David
TheViking
03-08-2004, 09:10
Hi...
Have a look at this site. Click "How to change handles?". :wink: :biggthump
TheViking
03-08-2004, 12:37
Hi...
Sorry, I always forget the link! :?: :wink: :roll:
Here it is: http://www.swiss-knife.com/EN/SK/handles/handles_index.html
Click 'how to change handles'
:-)
BIG-TARGET
22-01-2005, 02:32
Lets be honest guys!
Any bushcrafti worth his/her salt has cut their teeth with an SAK :biggthump :naughty:
I have one. Cut my teeth... and my fingers on it :biggthump
BIG-TARGET
22-01-2005, 14:10
I have one. Cut my teeth... and my fingers on it :biggthump
Thank you for making my point! :wave: :You_Rock_ :biggthump
PurpleHeath
22-01-2005, 14:10
i have two Huntmans and the saw on them is great i once lost my first one for 2 months i had no idea that i would miss a knife so much! the one down side to the Huntsman is that if you use it too much it will give you blisters!
Rhapsody
22-01-2005, 16:36
Surely everyone's had one of these at some point! For ages I've made a point of not leaving home without a handy tool of some kind, but in the last few years the classic penknife has been well and truly replaced by what is in my view the far superior Leatherman tool.
SquirrelBoy
22-01-2005, 16:49
Broken/damaged Victorinox SAKs can be sent to this address for free repair:
Burton McCall
Victorinox House
163 Parker Drive
Leicester
LE4 0JP
Phone: 0116 234 4600
Fax: 0116 235 0069
I was given a SAK years ago but it has some damage to the tip of the main blade - seems to have been used as a screwdriver at some point and is twisted :roll: :nono: oh the tweezers and toothpick is missing.
I was wondering if it would be ok to send it to these chaps, as im not the original owner?! Also am prob being dumb (in need of sleep!) but why do they offer a free repair service?
Cheers :biggthump
Walkabout
24-01-2005, 17:47
When I was ikkle I wanted a SAK a lot but my dad had a pathological dislike so i started out with an opinel and a p-38. (Which is named after the american ww2 p-38 fighter because the both work very fast)
I'd like to think i turned out vaguely normal. :roll:
I've had a couple of Swiss Army Knives. My current knife is a farmer model just like the Soldier model but with a lanyard ring and saw blade. I use the heck out of it. I believe one of my first knives was a SAK with a multitude of blades that my grandmother gave me as a gift. :cry: I don't remember the model number but I carried it for quite awhile. The perfect knife for a kid that liked to take things apart and sometimes put them back together. :o):
i found mine virtually covered in mud and horse s**t on a bridleway who knows how long it had been there but i was a happy chap it is still rust free and in my pocket.
p.s. that was about 15 years ago so its not yours, ok
bambodoggy
25-01-2005, 10:12
Never owned one of those natty little red ones with the hundreds of attachments and things on it but have and still do own the Officers all metal one and to be honest I think it's fantastic!!! Very sharpe out the box, stays sharpe ages and easy to resharpen when needed.....it does have a rather nasty chink out of the blade now though!
I didn't really rate the red ones and found the handles to be a bit slippy in the wet or with greasy hands but I know many people swear by them, the all metal one is perfect for me :-P
No, I own a Nepali Kukri - not much in the compact stakes, but much better for bush whacking when necessary!! Also I've got a native american hunting knife which is smaller and neater, hand made.
Gerard :biggthump
Danceswithhelicopters
25-01-2005, 11:45
I have at least a dozen dotted around the house/work/first aid kits/car etc. My favourite is the locking blade Wegners and I found a little cracker in Zurich this year-A single blade, blunt tip version with safe tin opener for kids. I'll be giving it to my eldest this year when he turns seven to teach him how to take responsibility.
The new Bundeswehr Victorinox has one handed opening and chequered gren grips.
tenbears10
25-01-2005, 12:06
Have you got a link to that new victorinox DWH?
i am now a proud sak owner, today i bought the victorinox climber and it has already been put to use
leon
I bought that one for Son1 several years ago and it's had a lot of use. Good bit of kit.
HWMBLT has killed his Swisscard (three years kicking about in his hip pocket has shattered the plastic :rolleyes: ) does anyone need replacement bits for theirs? All of the accessories are fine.
Cheers,
Toddy
RovingArcher
07-08-2006, 22:33
Yep, I did get the new German issue SAK and yep, it's my fav.........for now. :D
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d9/RovingArcher/Gear/GermanSAK007.jpg
I bought a Driver on Thursday or Friday last week. Stashed away somewhere in this house is a Bantam that I've had since I was six years old, another Driver that I retired for sentimental reasons, a Huntsman and a Compact. I also had a Climber at one point in time, but it was stolen.
Adam
Same as Rapidboy, about 10 and I have one of those OD one handed ones also, love that one, locking blade, saw, all the right stuff! I carry a little "Rambler" in my pocket each and every day also.
hi I have abot 15 SAK´s and collection increasing.
Best for outdoors activities is alox Farmer, strong and with balde+saw+cap openner+can openner+awl the best to mke holes I have ever tried.
Try it and you will not come back.
This is my last DIY based on one KL89 soldier.
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g17/faca_photos/kl92melted.jpg
Bye
2blackcat
08-08-2006, 20:28
I've got a Huntsman. Acquired it from work about fifteen years ago .... also managed to get two of the small two-bladed ones at the same time :)
Womble_Lancs
09-08-2006, 18:43
I bought my SAK 'Waiter' (how appropriate :rolleyes: ) in the duty-free shop at Vienna Airport in 1998, before they got stupid about taking pointy things on planes. It used to live on my keyring, but it got confiscated by security at Granada TV and I had to argue like hell to get it back. I still occasionally carry it about, but I never got round to putting it back on my keyring.
http://www.swiss-army-tools.com/ekmps/shops/swiss/images/swiss_army_tools_waiter.jpg
Shambling Shaman
09-08-2006, 19:20
My SAK lives in my FAK :D
woodchuck
10-08-2006, 11:05
Yes.
It´s mine
http://www.swissknifeshop.co.uk/images/stay_glow_climber.jpg
Wonderful
I have the Victorinox Forester. At the moment it is my primary knife as i don't own a fixed blade knife. The 'Forester' has a very sturdy blade considering it is a folding blade. I also find the saw quite handy.
Jacknife
10-08-2006, 20:33
I have over 40 at the last count :eek:
I have multiples of the models I like most.
4 Huntsman 3 in Stayglow
4 Climber 2 in Stayglow 2 Black
4 Camper
4 Spartan 2 White 1 Black 1 Blue
3 Tinker 3 in Stayglow
4 Wenger SI ( Soldier )
2 Wenger Basic 8
2 Farmer
4 Solo
I also have
Hunter
Safari
Pioneer Red Alox
Classic SD
Manager
Mini Champ
Waiter
Alox Cadet
Sportsman
Wenger Securit'e
Lumberjack
Guess you could say I like SAK's :)
:)
I have two. A green Mauser bought recently and a Officer Suisse that I have had for twenty odd years. Both pouch carried.
Tutchi
:cool:
I have the swiss champ, which I hardly ever use, its too bulky...........
Sure the Swiss Champ's big, but does size really matter? :D
Graham_S
11-08-2006, 00:23
i have several. i've got a mauser kicking about somewhere, and an executive that lives in my pocket as my edc. it does everything i need day to day.
Nathan Sturgess
15-08-2006, 20:43
Yep I have a solo
BIG-TARGET
16-08-2006, 11:50
If you are an OH-SAK freak-a-zoid. Here's a review for you!!!
http://www.jerzeedevil.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9760
:D
I have one similar to the Trekker in the link above but it is red and has no loop on the knife blade oh and a lock. So its quite different I suppose, lol.
sxmolloy
08-05-2007, 19:27
I own 2 at the moment. An EDC Victorinox Tinker Deluxe and a locking Trailmaster. Love em both :rolleyes:
Huntsman here, xmas present from my parent's when i started scout's, but had a sailing version of unknown origin from the age of 5 or so :)
Lost the huntsman in some rapids while i was in the south of france a few years ago, the other one still in my sock draw at my dad's, much better blade on it than the Victorinox, but must have been made out of lead as it weighed almost twice the amount as the huntsman :D
I tend to prefer the really simple SAKs so I have a Soldier and a recently acquired Farmer - both superb and both Victorinox because they make the best tin openers in the world! :D :D
Outdoorsman
09-05-2007, 12:39
At the moment I have a Hunter, Soldier, Spartan and a Bantam. Iv'e owned others when I was younger but they were all lost doing one thing or another. here's some pics:
http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i21/valleyofthedamned/VictorinoxHunterSmall.jpg
http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i21/valleyofthedamned/VictorinoxSoldierSmall.jpg
http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i21/valleyofthedamned/VictorinoxSpartanSmall.jpg
http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i21/valleyofthedamned/VictorinoxBantomSmall.jpg
love SAKs!!!
Have a Soldier as my edc (sitting in my pocket right now)
Plus have loads others. Huntsman, Compact, Manager, Rogue, couple of proper Mausers and a couple of others I can't remember!
Steve27752
09-05-2007, 15:08
I have had a Swiss army knife since I was about 10 years old. I do not know the model of me current one.
Steve :)
I have a hunstman which I managed to get for £10 a few years ago and gave my old one to my son.
He managed to break the scissors which I now try and get fixed with the onfo from this thread.
I recently was given my first SAK (thanks Andrew :)) and now I see what all the fuss is about. Its so dam useful!
i've got about 4 or 5 but must of had at least 20 over the years, i currently have 3 classics and a huntsman with a thuya handle, gets used every day
Bisamratte
09-05-2007, 20:52
The last time I read this thread I ended up buying my second sak. I bought a small classic one with black scales which I then re scaled with beech. I also have an old Huntsman (I think) that was my first ever real knife (I got a cheap copy sak before that and never used it because......well it looked like it would fall apart every time the blades where open :eek: )
Anyway they both live in my pockets and are used on a daily basis.
I'm going to buy another one now.......but which one :confused: ;)
Gailainne
09-05-2007, 21:14
I have a Victorinox Champ, my second, the first I misplaced in Oz about 25 yrs ago, I bought my second when I returned and realised I'd lost it. Great tool, even better since GrahamS sharpened the prime and secondary blades to hair popping sharpness at Delamere :D.
Since seeing some posts on changing the scales, I think thats a project I will consider, thickening the scales in a nice wood, and losing the toothpick in favour of a small firesteel.
Stephen
w00dsmoke
10-05-2007, 08:33
;My first working knife was a sak and I treasured it well for over 20 years (ok the big blade snapped) until I was given my first leatherman. I then gave the sak away and realised very soon that compared to a leatherman tool for work, a SAK was not even worth having.
Now I own a wave and to be honest I'm not interested in a SAK. I'm amazed at the popularity of them on the forum especially regarding their limitations. My wife has one for her handbag as she likes the tweezers and wee scissors, they are handy for her eyebrows and nails ;) but she always uses a leatherman when away on camp with me!
John Fenna
10-05-2007, 08:50
I have had many SAKs in my time and until I discovered Leatherman tools I thought they were the best knives in the world. Now I find them limitted and prefer to carry my Wave.
The only thing I miss is the corkscrew.......
John
Dr Onion
10-05-2007, 08:59
I've had a few SAK's over the years but I have to admit I replaced them all with my Leatherman Charge a while back - I agree with Woodsmoke above, they are just far more handy to carry IMHO
Dr O
:)
Gailainne
10-05-2007, 10:48
I had both my SAK and a leatherman with me on our Loch Lomond trip wOOdsmoke, the leatherman never came out the bag, and you know the SAK was in use the whole weekend. Agreed the SAK has its limitations, but it can handle a multitude of camp tasks with no worries.
Stephen
Bisamratte
10-05-2007, 11:23
when I need a good multi tool then I take my wave with me, my sak is always in my pocket so that comes along too. It all depends on what I'm doing and where
w00dsmoke
10-05-2007, 11:31
I had both my SAK and a leatherman with me on our Loch Lomond trip wOOdsmoke, the leatherman never came out the bag, and you know the SAK was in use the whole weekend. Agreed the SAK has its limitations, but it can handle a multitude of camp tasks with no worries.
Stephen
All I'm saying bud is that a leatherman is more useful because of it's strength and functionality compared to a SAK in my experience. And when I'm out and about I want that strength and functionality that a SAK cannot provide for certain tasks. I think depending on what folk want them for, experience usually will advise on this!
I personally think it's a bit like the debate on the canoeing forums on the virtues of canvas bags for gear storage . Everyone knows they are crap for keeping your gear dry but still use them, but they have a certain appeal to them that some say gives them an authenticity about their hobby that say a dry bag won't!
Squidders
10-05-2007, 11:40
I did own a SAK for a while... I took it out and about and found that the only part of it I had a use for was the knife. I never used the corkscrew or scissors etc.
Maybe in boating or gamekeeping or even golf you come across situations where these other things are needed but I just never came across it when I was in the woods.
Based on that, I went back to carrying a regular folding knife as there's less mechanically to go wrong.
As woodsmoke says though, it's horses for courses, people swear by them and leatherman and gerber and all sorts.
Gailainne
10-05-2007, 20:44
You could both be right, I think at the end of the day, its what feels comfortable, I've had my Champ for well over 20 years, the Leatherman shrug I got it when they came out, however long that was, the only thing I have'nt used on the SAK is the little hook thing, I found out its good for pulling out pegs at Delamere :D (Nice one Wayland).
I certainly would'nt want to saw thru any decent sized branches with my SAK :rolleyes:, but it would do it.
One other point, its legal, I don't have to justify why I'm carrying it, argue as you may its easy to justify carrying a multitool like the wave, I dont have to argue at all about my SAK.
Stephen
Bootstrap Bob
10-05-2007, 21:49
I've never owned a Victorinox but I do own a Mauser and have done since I was 10 years old.
http://www.bushcraftuk.com/gallery/data/507/Mauser_005s.jpg
The handle has been changed since new but otherwise it just gets sharpened every now and again. And yes the saw really is that sharp that it needs a protective shield, I have a scar to prove it :o
I havent really used the hook on my SAK much either but one thing it is good at doing is putting the chain back on a bike if you dont want to get your hands covered in oil
leon
Using it pretty much every day. Next to the trowel, a note book and penn a SAK is the Field Archaeologists best friend! Everything from sharpening your penncill to change batteries in our toughnote field computors! :D
I've never owned a Victorinox but I do own a Mauser and have done since I was 10 years old.
http://www.bushcraftuk.com/gallery/data/507/Mauser_005s.jpg
The handle has been changed since new but otherwise it just gets sharpened every now and again. And yes the saw really is that sharp that it needs a protective shield, I have a scar to prove it :o
I have a Mauser and I have to say that I think the saw on a normal SAK is better. The Mauser one is pull only, the SAK cuts both ways.
Additionally, the Mauser you have is the proper Mauser and is therefore made by Victorinox. They're worth quite a bit these days - proper collectors items
Bootstrap Bob
11-05-2007, 16:25
Well I never knew that :) I thought it was just an alternative make.
You're right the saw is just a pull type but I like it that way for safety, I have tried other saw blades which cut in both directions but if they are non locking and the teeth get caught on the forward stroke there's the potential for folding the thing around your fingers :aargh4:
Collectors item you say? Well there's no way I'm getting rid of it, probably have it until the day I die! An original Mauser I can believe, I saw one for sale in Anchor supplies at a show last year and was very tempted to buy it as a spare but when I inspected it it was no where near as good quality.
Well I never knew that :) I thought it was just an alternative make.
You're right the saw is just a pull type but I like it that way for safety, I have tried other saw blades which cut in both directions but if they are non locking and the teeth get caught on the forward stroke there's the potential for folding the thing around your fingers :aargh4:
Collectors item you say? Well there's no way I'm getting rid of it, probably have it until the day I die! An original Mauser I can believe, I saw one for sale in Anchor supplies at a show last year and was very tempted to buy it as a spare but when I inspected it it was no where near as good quality.
That clip point blade with the writing on? That's what makes it special and why its made by Victorinox. If i'm brutally honest I don't think you'd get full collector value for it cos you don't have the original scales but if you're not going to get rid of it then its all good. Its a really good knife - big, solid and trusty. The quality on them is amazing
Graywolf
11-05-2007, 16:34
I am in the minority here as I have never liked them,any sort of pocket knife that did not lock always appeared unsafe
well im sorry i dont agree. i think that any sort of lock gives a false sense of security. ive never had a folding knife close on me but im carefull how i use it!! had a mauser in the past and i loved it. am thinking of buying a simple solo to replace it....cant afford the prices they seem to fetch know. anyone any experience of the solo ?
edispilff
13-05-2007, 00:02
Have had several of those. Can't remember the last time i needed a corkscrew though.
There was an old wenger.. and... damn! Going to rummage for that thing... right now!
Greenpete
13-05-2007, 15:32
I didn't life was possible without one!??
Do you mean to tell me that there are people out there that don't have one?
I swear I've had one since birth! :lmao:
I have two. An Outrider that I carry all the time when camping and outdoors and a smaller one that I carry all the rest of the time, When I'm not likely to get arrested anyway.
MartiniDave
14-05-2007, 08:00
Jura,
I have a Solo. Good knife with a very positive snap as th blead opens and closes.
The blade can look surprisingly large, even though it is sub - 3 inches.
The handle is quite thin, but pretty comfortable to use. The blade will take a great edge, as with any Victorinox I've tried.
Dave
Silver Fox
14-05-2007, 08:21
Have had a Masuer for around 25 years...love it dearly & used it the other day to punch an extra hole in our pups new collar.
Recieved an All Black Climber [my first SAK] recently...v nice also and a cherished addition to my list of precious things ;)
That said...*whisper on* I do sometimes wonder how on earth I ever got by without tweezers and wire strippers *whisper off* :o
Yorkshire Boy
14-05-2007, 14:29
Now then fellas,
I have 2 SAK's.
A waiter and a Climber.
The waiter goes everywhere with me.
The Climber because of the locking blade, is a special purpose activity tool for me.
I don't think Japanese law would have a problem with it though, unlike the UK.
The Climber has a long blade, good for slicing a big block of cheese. :)
The corkscrew is much easier to use compared to the Waiter because of the longer, bigger handle. Much more force can be applied. :)
I find the saw to be pretty good as well.
All the best, Yorkshire Boy.
I carried a Victorinox Champion for a long time (the predecessor to the Swiss Champ), and a Swiss Champ for years after that.
Nowadays I carry a Leatherman Charge Ti and the Swiss Champ is kept as a spare tool, but I'll often have a small Victorinox Classic with me in a pocket, and when I'm out in the bush I always have the Classic.
I have several SAKs, I even got my daughter a Hunter for her 8th Birthday. I usually have a couple on me as well as a Leatherman Wave and Browning or Buck lock blade. I find them at yard sales for 2-3 dollars each and put them in kits for a cheap backup blade or to give away when someone asks to borrow my knife which I never loan.
Ogri the trog
18-07-2007, 23:23
Erm, yup, more than my fair share I suppose,
SwisstoolX, Swiss Champ, GAK (if it counts) Rucksack knife and a Huntsman - both daughters have a Huntsman each and third will get one when she's old enough.
Those are the ones I can remember.
Ogri the trog
I don't own one, but the missus does. Dunno which one, but it seems to have the everyday normal things plus some other bits and bobs. Quite handy if she'd only put the tweezers back in once she'd finished with them instead of losing them all the time!:rolleyes:
BIG-TARGET
18-07-2007, 23:28
Not only do I own SAK's, but I happen to be a member of SOSAK(Secret Order of the Swiss Army Knife)
http://www.sosakonline.com/index.php?option=com_frontpage&Itemid=1
woodstock
19-07-2007, 19:50
I have owned a S/A camper for the last 10 years and still use it nearly every day
Living in Switzerland and not owning a SAK?
That would be close to treason!!
Of course I have a SAK. In fact, several...
/ Karl
BIG-TARGET
19-07-2007, 23:23
Living in Switzerland and not owning a SAK?
That would be close to treason!!
Of course I have a SAK. In fact, several...
/ Karl
SPANKING TIME!!!!!:cussing:
I'm a member of SOSAK as well, and I happen to own seven SAK's. :)
I've never owned a Victorinox but I do own a Mauser and have done since I was 10 years old.
http://www.bushcraftuk.com/gallery/data/507/Mauser_005s.jpg
The handle has been changed since new but otherwise it just gets sharpened every now and again. And yes the saw really is that sharp that it needs a protective shield, I have a scar to prove it :o
I think that looks cracking, does anyone know where still sells them, iv looked on loadsa site with no luck.
I have a few classics, and a non genuine champ. i prefer my letherman though.
BIG-TARGET
20-07-2007, 23:38
I've never owned a Victorinox but I do own a Mauser and have done since I was 10 years old.
http://www.bushcraftuk.com/gallery/data/507/Mauser_005s.jpg
The handle has been changed since new but otherwise it just gets sharpened every now and again. And yes the saw really is that sharp that it needs a protective shield, I have a scar to prove it :o
Mauser, made by Victorinox!!!!;)
crazyclimber
21-07-2007, 23:07
I've had a Wenger classic 13 for a couple of years. Comes in very useful - stays on a keyring with my keys and a small torch (amongst other things). Have tried a leatherman but found that it was just a touch too big to carry comfortably, for example at work. Tools came in useful, but the SAK does the trick most of the time.
Would much prefer it to have a locking blade - with that it would be about perfect for me. However with the law being how it is (whatever my opinion on that), would have it confiscated in no time so I guess non-locking it is...
Yep... I've got one too, a Rucksack, well its my second one, coz my first was pinched right out of my pocket :eek: by some theaving little :censored: . They cut the lanyard it was on and legged it! :cussing: :censored: :censored: :censored: :censored: !!!!!
So anyway Yes I have but I had my first Vict. Ruc. for over 10 years with no damage, and it copt some great abuse too!
Yonderer
22-07-2007, 17:34
I always carry a Victorinox Recruit in my pants pocket.
I also own a Camper and a Rucksack. The Rucksack resides in my rucksack, oddly enough :D, and the Camper stays in the pocket of my hunting jacket.
I've used the saw blade on the Camper many times to split the pelvic bone and brisket of deer.
woodstock
23-07-2007, 23:08
David S here is a link to the knife in question
http://www.smartknives.com/Victorinox-Knives/Victorinox-Mauser-Knife.htm
I came accross that site the other day, althought i just noticed it says at the bottom "coming soon - order your vintage mauser" so ill keep and eye out.
Im also watching one on ebay but i think its gonna finish quite high. theres another few although without the clip point blade.
Silverback
23-07-2007, 23:40
Yup got me one of them rare ones :D and about 6 others. I couldn't imagine life without one and have purchased and been given SAK's for both of my young sons - I should give a big shout out at this stage to DOUGSTER who sent my little lad a lovely handmade leather pouch free of charge for a SAK I purchased from him a little while back :You_Rock_
Jedadiah
24-07-2007, 08:48
I had an imitation SAK when i was a boy (many years ago) and, probably through mis-use, found the blade had a habit of folding onto my fingers. Just a good job i did'nt know how to sharpen it really or it could have been really nasty.
I'm a Leatherman user through and through. I've got a 'Micra' in my grab bag, 'Wave' on my belt and my original 'PST' in the kitchen draw for when i need a tool, but not enough to go out to the garage:o . I used to have a 'Bucktool' which was Buck Knives take on the multitool idea. Rather than pulling the two halves apart Leatherman stylee, it twisted. Hard to explain and great novelty value watching Leatherman and Gerber users trying to get it open, but it was too springy at the hinge and this compromised my faith in it.
Saying that though, i always prefer to use my EKA Masur birch for small cutting tasks.
In summary, no, i'm not down with the SAK.
SPANKING TIME!!!!!:cussing:
Aawwwwww, c'mon!
You're just jealous I'm closer to the source. :nana:
/ Karl
Oh SAK's, how I love thee. Let me count thy ways......:D
I have an old one which was given to me by my Father years ago but it is still a nice little knife although the spring has gone to pot on the scissors!:red:
MartiniDave
31-07-2007, 12:52
Greg,
You can get a spare spring from almost any outdoor shop for about £1. A bit fiddly to fit but no big deal. Take your knife when you go to buy the spring as there are several dofferent sizes.
Dave
mr dazzler
31-07-2007, 13:15
I had a genuine sak many years ago, the saw was useful to cut rod rest's and catapult's, and two different sized blades were good. But overall it felt flimsy and gadgety, That is all I remember using out of 7 or 8 blades was it?? I mean corkscrew's, toothpick's?. I never took chablis and chicken with me when I went out to fish :lmao: As with jaedadaih I too was not much good at sharpening then (never thought to bother well you dont when your little do you :lmao: ) I never have had the desire to get another since then. I recently retired a sheffield lamb foot knife that has been with me since about 1986, it was basically worn out. I replced it with an opinel, but again it too has a slightly flimsy feel. I like solidity and strudyness;)
I have had a champ since I was 9 and have proably used it most days. The old fella has never let me down and is now 21 years old.
Oh the adventures we have had.....
Cheers
Andy.
I have ahd mine sine age nine and the old fella has never let me down.
Its now 21 years old.
Oh the adventures.
TyroTarper
03-08-2007, 16:05
I have 3 Vics: one called a Camper which I have had for at least 20 years and is still going strong and in very good nick & sharp. The Camper has the usual 2 blades, bottle & can openers and a saw. Nice and light, does the job for me as a knife to carry all the time and on short trips in the field.
I have another, no idea of the name as I was given it along with all the rest of the kit for a Survival kit (big holster, whistle, maglite, compass, thermometer, etc etc etc ) , which is larger but has a wood & metal saws, wood & metal files, magnifying glass, chisel, grab hook, etc which again is going great guns after about 6 years. With the exception of the metal file & saw I've used all the tools at one time or another. A tad heavy but my choice for longer trips.
Finally a Swiss Army Card complete with a small led light, blade, screwdrivers, scissors,magnifying glass, pen, etc. This lives in my wallet and is just really useful on a day to day basis.
I've flirted with Leathermans of various shapes and sizes but I always find them a bit heavy and not so nice to use although the Micra is a nice light piece of kit for lightweight backpacking where the main uses are opening packs of sealed food, minor repairs to thermarests & tents.
But I always come back to a SAK!!
tim wakefield
09-08-2007, 01:52
I recently returned to S.A.K. after years away and have been surprised at how many times a day I use it's various tools the only one I haven't used is the can opener. until a few years ago I used the hunter but this time I opted for the climber mainly because I didn't realise it didn't have a saw.Anyway that just means I need another knife.
BIG-TARGET
09-08-2007, 01:56
I've been carrying my SAK's alot more. Especially since I'm 44, and don't forsee being involved in any bloodsoaked meelees, or hacking an airfield out of the amazon, in the likely future.
Yonderer
09-08-2007, 02:09
My daughter turned 10 today and received her first SAK. A Victorinox "Driver", which, except for a textured handle, is the same as my Recruit. She's absolutely thrilled with it.
Hey, that's pretty cool. I use a Driver/Recruit as my EDC and have been doing so for years. It's a great little knife and I use mine every single day. I hope your daughter likes it as much as I enjoyed getting a Bantam from my Father when I was about six or seven years old. And come to think of it, I still it tucked away somewhere.
Adam
I have carried a SAK for many years and have had and lost several different models. I think my favourites have been the spartan, the aluminium-handled farmer and the climber. I tend to prefer the knives with no more than three layers as the larger models seem too awkward to handle effectively. I find all the tools useful apart from the hook thingy which I don't think I have ever used!
They are handy items for carrying for use every day and don't frighten folk. On our family holiday this year we canoed down the Ardeche river in France, we flew from Aberdeen Airport and my daughter had forgotten about a Spartan SAK which was in the rucksak she was using as cabin luggage :rolleyes: Given the media hysteria this sort of thing has generated recently, I thought that we would be in some trouble :o Luckily the security staff were wonderful and provided a jiffy bag for us to post the offending article home without any fuss :D
Cheers,
Doug.
Osprey,
The "hook thingy" makes a very useful tool when its forty below zero in the middle of winter and you're on a bivoac on a mountain summit trying to tie your frozen climbing boots to your frozen feet.
Oh, and it also makes for an excellent parcel-carrier, provided of course that your postman/woman/person still wraps packages in twine. :)
Adam
Thanks Adam, so that's what it is for ! I'll try and remember that, but given global warming I think I might wait a long time to experience 40 below in Scotland:)
Cheers,
Doug
Hey, come on over to the Frigid Icy North of Canada and join me for an escapade up a mountain. Peaks here are a dime a dozen. Heck, I've got one that overlooks my city. I can look out the windows at work and get quite the eyeful!
I have carried a champ for the last 25 years and it has never let me down. It lives in my bag at work and my bergan in the woods - I have used EVERY gadget on it over and over again. I have lost the mini screwdriver which is a shame as I use it to to tighten the arms of my sprcs frequently and the little compass on the ruler in the pouch is now black.
Couldnt live without it
Cheers
Nick
British Red
27-08-2007, 23:33
Plenty of spares places will do you a new one Nick - and tweezers, toothpicks and all the other bits
For the record I use a weirs model - The Huntsman Lite - it has abuild in little LED torch which is a nice touch as is the tiny biro. I've used almost all the tools on it although blade, saw, scissors and awl (okay and the bottle opener) are the most used.
Best thing about it is the pouch (cheers topknot) - worn every day I'm not in the office (when the knife in my pocket is my Trevor Ablett)
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/182/473344250_429025c83c_m.jpg
Tell me thats not the nicest SAK pouch you've ever seen?
Red
I have quite a few SAK's...mostly Camper's which I used to get free from a Science supply house, but varying from the tiny Classic up to the large Safari and Mauser.
I carry the Farmer daily now though....near perfect in my view for size and tool diversity.
http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/6941/swissperfection7992jv8.jpg
This knife is always my pocket knife of choice. I bet I have used the bottle opener the most, but the awl, saw and main blade all run a close second, the can opener handy at work for soup cans. Really a grand knife design, it is not too thick with good grippy alox scales and good overall snap.
The other bits are part of my Swiss Perfection set.....
The Sigg stainless steel 600mL flask with stainless cup, a nicely made flask/cup.
And the Caran D’Ache (Wenger Swiss Army branded) ballpoint. It has about the only ballpoint filler that I can stand to use…smooth, no blob line. The shape is good and comfortable, the metal body durable. The nice red color is also a winner.
appletree_man
01-09-2007, 01:28
I have four genuine SAKs at the moment.
2 Victorinox Spartans, a Victorinox Hiker, a Victorinox Rambler, and a couple of junk cheapo copies (they were freebies).
I'd like to get a Wenger or two soon, just to compare.
I took the scales off one of the Spartans, I was surprised how comfortable and natural it feels with just the metal sides to grip.
I'm smoothing off some of the hard edges, so it should feel even better in use.
I have a couple the officers model is my EDC
Ian
One of my favorites is a sak rucksack, but I find the saw one of the most useful things on sak's and most of em are not exactly brilliant. So I shelved my otherwise much loved rucksack in favor of a Wenger ranger scout which has a much, much better saw blade...
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i273/Martyn_s30v/sak/sak004.jpg
As you can see, the ranger has a much bigger saw and while not exactly a Bacho Laplander, it is very useable. Much better than the saws on the victorinox. The only problem with the wenger is I'm not very keen on the rest of the knife. But the saw wins the day.
However, much to my delight, wenger have just updated their ranger series to what looks like a much better design, while keeping the good saw. So I have just ordered a new ranger 55....
http://www.wenger-knife.ch/htdocs/Attachments/Pictures/200744_1784424594.jpg
Now that looks perfect to me, like a hybrid between the rucksack and the ranger with the best bits of both.
See the rest of the new ranger series...
http://www.wenger-knife.ch/knife/Sport_Knives_Ranger/NewRanger.html
appletree_man
02-10-2007, 06:37
I was going to replace the rather pointless toothpick on my Victorinox Spartan, with a Victorinox pen. Will it slot right into the toothpick space, or does the pen only fit on certain models ?
I can't get a reply from Victorinox about this.
Appletree_man - ISTR that the pen, being wider and thicker than a toothpick, has a slightly different plastic bit at the top (grey?) which is a different size and as such won't fit in the slot.
Chris
BIG-TARGET
04-10-2007, 00:53
If you wonder which SAK is for you. Talk to the "experts" at http://www.sosakonline.com ;)
http://edcforums.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topi c=5767.0;attach=10400;image
I've got a real Victorinox that was a promo gift, and another look-alike. Both are shown in this thread:
http://www.bushcraftuk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=25049
One stays in my toolkit at work, and the other is in my carry-about FAK.
G
appletree_man
08-10-2007, 09:00
Appletree_man - ISTR that the pen, being wider and thicker than a toothpick, has a slightly different plastic bit at the top (grey?) which is a different size and as such won't fit in the slot.
Chris
Ah.
Ok many thanks.
I have a Swiss Army knife very similar to the Picnicker (except mine has the addition of a saw). It's really useful and I've used everything on it, I especially like the addition of tweezers and toothpick which are really handy. I take it to work with me even though this is probably illegal as its a lock kinfe, but I really do need it for my job. The only thing I don't like about it is the reamer as it's really difficult to get out.
http://www.thisnext.com/media/230x230/Victorinox-Swiss-Army_BEBBA3E7.jpg
http://www.swissarmy.com/MultiTools/Product.htm?category=outdoor&product=53652&
Just bought three of the Sportsman model for $7 each.
Have a half dozen or so of others including a small one I keep on me any time I'm wearing clothes. :lmao:
That's like me, whenever I put on pants (trousers for you English folk) I slip my SAK into my pocket.
Adam
RobertRogers
11-10-2007, 21:17
I prefer a multi-tool like the leathermans
My first and still my only real knife.
scottishwolf
12-10-2007, 22:08
I've had a SAK farmer for nearly a year and it is the best EDC i've had. More solid than the standard ones plus the blade is thicker and a wee bit longer :D
Just found out that mine is called a Rucksack and not a Picnicker as I earlier said.
BIG-TARGET
15-10-2007, 12:29
Just found out that mine is called a Rucksack and not a Picnicker as I earlier said.
Wait til you get an OHT!!
Nightwalker
15-10-2007, 12:35
I own two swiss army knives, one genuine, one not. I purchased neither; they were both gifts and unfortunately I must say I never carry either and they don't get used. I tried carrying the genuine one in my pack for a few trips but it still got forgotten about and not used. :o
mentalnurse
03-11-2007, 23:51
i must have 10 or so but this is my best one and one of my EDC.
http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s86/mentalnurse/DSCN1262.jpg
I’ve just acquired a Huntsman and it’s great. Had the original small one for years, its now in my FAK.
Matt Weir
21-11-2007, 18:09
Repost from the Chrimbo wishlist thread but as it's my SAK owning cherry pop day, what the hell...
I've just bought myself this...
http://www.itchyfeet.com/images/camper.jpg
...to go in this...
http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb268/SOAR_2007/100_4796.jpg
http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb268/SOAR_2007/100_4798.jpg
:D
TallMikeM
22-11-2007, 12:51
I've had my trusty SAK (camper I think) since for ever (well, 1986), got it when I joined up. Been a trusty bit of kit eversince, been all round the world with me. Sadly the scissors broke the other week and I was quite concerned that I'd have to retire it (I'm a sentimental old sod:D ), but thanks to this thread I've realised I may be able to get it repaired!!!:You_Rock_
Hi, nice thread :)
Mine is the Huntsman 1.3713.
I own it for about 15 years now and only once had to change the scales.
On the saw my name is engraved :o :rolleyes: (I had that done when I was about 16)
I ALWAYS have it with me, except when flying :cussing: Stupid regulations.
Mike
On the topic of SAK, does anybody know where I can get, wooden scales for my SAK?
Sorry if this going slightly off-topic.
BIG-TARGET
22-11-2007, 14:40
My source for SAKs is Felinevet Tim(SOSAK-online)
http://felinevet.sosakonline.com/index.php?option=com_frontpage&Itemid=1
I would buy one tomorrow if they'd come up with a one-handed, non-locking, non-serrated one.
Scruff showed me a couple of his SAK's the other day, the one I really liked was the metal gripped painted metallic red one, that had just a spear point and a saw blade. What more do you really need for a quick jaunt in the woods?
Swiss Army Knives (SAK) and the outdoors seem to go hand-in-hand. So, the question is simple - do you own a original (Victorinox) SAK
NO I´m owner or 45 SAK´s:D
Waiter model for urban use
Farmer model for outdoors use
BushTucker
25-11-2007, 19:25
I answered as yes used to own one but I have just found one in my old knife box, well I think its one, it has loads of things in it but has a sheild on the outside with a X and a crown not a sweedish +??:confused:
Its like a sheild with a crown on the top and inside the sheild a diagonal cross in it
Don
I have had a huntsman for years and have just bought a Black Trailmaster in Germany which appears to be the forester over here.
I love the 4 inch locking blade on it much more solid than the 3 inch.
appletree_man
02-12-2007, 04:42
Got my first Wenger SAK today, the little nail clipper model. I was just curious to see the differences between them and Victorinox.
Quite a marked difference in quality imho, (Wenger has better tweezers perhaps), so I don't think I will be buying any of the larger Wenger knives, Victorinox is always first class.
Hi
I've had a Huntsman as my EDC for a year now. Managed to misplace it for a few days the other week and I was lost without it. It's amazing how much you come to rely on them :p
Andy
Had some early Christmas prezzies so I have readjusted my carry.
The Classic SAK has come off my key chain and been relaced by a Wenger Nailclip (OK bulkier but I really wanted the clippers and the scissors are a vast improvement).
For EDC theres a Victorinox one hand Trecker on a paracord lanyard (shame about the black scales but no biggy) (£12 from Amazon in the US, a mate forwarded it airmail for about $7, not that I paid, the nice man!)
And for EDC when theres any chance of being stopped a Victorinox Soldier also on a lanyard..
ATB
Tom
qweeg500
03-01-2008, 06:15
I have a Victorinox Handyman from 1994 which I actually brought in Switzerland when inter-railing around europe in my student days. Engraved with my name too.
I prefer my Leatherman Supertool tho'. More robust you see.
I've got four. Acquired them all along the lines of:
"what can we get that awkward old b****r for Christmas? I know, he's always out in that b****y tent of his..."
Not complaining though. Always keep one in the car and one in my first aid kit (the one with the scissors).
Just bought myself a new Trekker as my old SAK as gone AWOL
stu1979uk
05-01-2008, 20:42
just got a victorinox craftsman for crimbo
I bought a SAK, partly to see if they were up to the hype and partly to comply with UK carry.
Gotta say that my initial thought that they were a crap multitool disguised as a crap knife were confirmed.
Much rather have a decent Leatherman and a proper knife in my pocket rather than something which tries to be both and fails.
Warrigal
13-01-2008, 21:49
Without digging them all out there must be at least a dozen SAKs.
At least four classics including
one with glow in the dark scales
One with Edelweiss one the scales
one with a small red LED instead of the tooth pick
one with Qantas printed on one side. (also a Wenger with clear scales)
micro champ
Swiss champ.
OHO Trailmaster is often EDC
a couple Swiss cards including the lite ones ( one of those in my wallet)
rucksaks
there is a first pocket knife in the kitchen with the can opener constantly deployed ( I've given up on fancey can openers.)
Both types of Swiss tool. Which is my prefered multitool.
There is a huntsman in one of the dashboard hidy holes of my car.
and a traveller Leather belt pouch with huntsman, Maglite solitaire and the compass,thermometer,magnifying glass,ruler thing from the SOSchamp.
Our eating cutlery is Victorinox and two of the butchers knives in the kitchen are Vics.
Carl
P.S.Ready for an opinion?
I think the Leatherman range of multitools are over rated. Tim Leatherman deserves a Noble peace prize for the concept but his design team needs six months in a North Korean gaol for constantly trying to re-invent the damm things. I spent 12years in the security industry basicly six as a doorman and six as a Mobile patrolman. If it hadn't been for my multitool there are jobs I would probably still be stuck on.
The charge series rrp was $AUD250 part of the justification was the cost of the Titanium scales the titanium has been dropped in favour of Aluminium but he price hasn't changed. The current top of the line XTi has three inter changable screwdriver pieces one micro for your glasses. and two that are exactly the same ( each takes an interchangable bit) at the expense of the scissors.
You loose some of the plier surface for very neat crimper. 18years since I brought my first tool I would call them indipensable but I have only once had to crimp an electrical fitting. The tool at the time didn't have that crimping surface but the pliers worked just fine. And the job was done.
IN MY OPINION the purpose of these tools is to get you out of trouble or to save you walking back to the toolbox. Not as the be all end all.
I do like the leather sheath system. However.
It has taken till last years model releases to get a cutlery grade steel on the primary knife blade untill then ( and still now if you don't get one of the premium models) the plain blade won't hold an edge worth a damm.( yes I can sharpen Look at my Avatar I can take a fillet out of a piece of photocopy paper with any of my general use knives)
No you don't get the one hand opening blade pioneered on the Wave series that most brands have copied but I don't care because I normaly have a one hand opening folder with me any way.
I have used Leatherman, SOG, Gerber, Kershaw and the Victoriox multitools and for a good spread of tools good solid lock up and value for money
IN MY OPINION The Victoriox mutitool wins hands down.
I've had a SAK (only ever a Victorinox) in my pocket pretty much every day for the last 25 years (back then it wasn’t such an issue for a kid to carry a knife in school, in fact my CDT teacher taught me the value of stropping the blade – using the palm of the land was his recommendation, a little dodgey perhapse, but it works) they have been part of my everyday apparel for so long now I feel undressed without the familiar weight in my pocket.
If memory serves the first was an 'officers knife' - lasted a few years before it got lost. Since then it’s always been a 'champ' – I did have the survival kit for a while, but the pouches back then were not that good, and it fell apart pretty quickly, so the knife went back in the pocket, and the pouch in the loft (where I think it may still languish)
A couple of years ago I added a spirit multitool to my belt and that has become a pretty permanent fixture as well. The ratchet has proved very useful and tougher than its size may imply.
Combining the both there aren’t that many jobs that ‘pop-up’ that can’t be performed with a little ingenuity and patience: I’ve taken the tops out of trees, and built tree houses, and as time has moved on, repaired cars, built model helicopters, repaired fishing rods, built computers, cleaned and skinned small game and gutted fish - Hell I've even sharpened a few pencils :D
Granted the blades don't hold an edge that well, but there is something rather therapeutic about putting a decent edge on a blade, so for me doing it regularly is hardly a negative.
Scots_Charles_River
19-01-2008, 18:38
Used mine today to -
cut small kindling for a kelly kettle
stir my tea
cut an apple up
pick a tooth after some apple skin got stuck
clean a nail of dirt
write down grid refs of path/track junctions (scoping for MTbing)
Nick
British Red
31-01-2008, 19:13
Shouldn't they be banned though SCR? Surely you should lead the way?
Bernie Garland
31-01-2008, 19:23
Shouldn't they be banned though SCR? Surely you should lead the way?
no doubt he'll try :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao:
bernie
phaserrifle
23-07-2008, 17:16
I used a cheapy copy for a while, but the joints loosened up to the point where I could open the blade by holding the knife vertical. then I used my leatherman clone, which is still going. when that needs replacing I'm looking at getting a proper SAK (either vitrinox or wenger)
rapidboy
23-07-2008, 19:16
I carry a swisschamp to work but for the last couple of weeks on holiday it's been replaced with a farmer.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v76/rapidboy1/knives%20vol%202/DSC00198.jpg
JonathanD
23-07-2008, 19:57
RB, that sheath is sweeeeet!! Please tell me you'll be making more, please please please :)
I like that sheath Rapidboy I will make one like that for myself I think.:D
Indoorsout
24-07-2008, 20:28
I got a Victorinox Pocket Pal a couple of weeks ago as a whittling knife. I've already reprofiled the small blade :D for better whittling. It's the first ever SAK of any sort I've had. I like the fact it only has the 2 blades, not a load of miscellaneous junk that just gets in the way when whittling.
Ozhaggishead
25-07-2008, 14:07
Okay this is my one and my daughters age 5.
http://i313.photobucket.com/albums/ll390/Ozhaggishead/Alsbushcraftstuff019.jpg
Gailainne
25-07-2008, 18:21
This is my baby Swiss Champ
http://www.premierhumidors.com/zc1/images/swiss_champ001.jpg
I bought my first one to travel the world, (literally) when I left Saudi, eh 1986, misplaced it at my sisters in Cairns, OZ and bought a new one when I got home, 1987, so this one is 21 years old, and even Graham would be impressed with its shaving capability.
Stephen
PS I liked what some people have done with replacing scales on SAKS with wood, so may do this in the future.
Stephen
I've got two. The first is on my key ring and thats an 'office'. The second is a 'climber' i think and allways in my possibles pouch. I here the 'forrester' is the dogs danglies.
Graham_S
26-07-2008, 11:56
I've got a swisschamp in my manbag :D It sits in the pocket that a phone is meant to go in. It's very very handy, I've used it for all sorts of things.
I have carried a champ for the last 25 years and it has never let me down. It lives in my bag at work and my bergan in the woods - I have used EVERY gadget on it over and over again. I have lost the mini screwdriver which is a shame as I use it to to tighten the arms of my sprcs frequently and the little compass on the ruler in the pouch is now black.
Couldnt live without it
Cheers
Nick
since this post I lost the knife when the bungee holding my work bag on the back of my bike snapped. Lost it and a brand new titanium cookpot, but the loss of the knife nearly had me in tears when I found out. SWMBO, bless her, bought me a brand new champ with the double pouch survival kit for my birthday which I love.
Also just inherited a camper from clearing out my dads house after he passed away recently, which I'm contemplating re scaling with curly birch to match my other bushcraft knives.
Cheers
Nick
kancho74
28-07-2008, 18:52
"Lost" one of my SAKs recently too. Had it for about 15 years, been to many countries and through many customs except the last time.... I was travelling to England via Oslo airport and they pulled me on the length of the blade, it was never a problem before but they gave me two options, throw it or put it storage(costing about 10 quid a day) so I went back and hid it (can't say where) but my eternal optimism tells me it will still be there the next time, waiting for me......
i'm bound to lose mine after a couple of years. that's why i haven't got one yet
A little question: where is the best place to order a Victorinox Soldier or Pioneer?
Celtic Eagle
04-08-2008, 16:30
I have the one i was bought by my missus bout 10 years ago great little knife
mick miller
04-08-2008, 16:50
A little question: where is the best place to order a Victorinox Soldier or Pioneer?
try www.7dayshop.co.uk
try www.7dayshop.co.uk
They don't send items to Portugal :(
But thanks!
First post, here goes....We have four SAKs.
I bought the wife a little handbag pink little one, blade, scissors and nail file. I was bought one for my 21st birthday,Mountaineer I think it's called and found another two.
The first one I found was a simple 6 blade affair, unknown model about 16 years ago. This was at about 33 metres at the bottom of a Norwegian fjord. I guess that a fisherman dropped it off his boat when using it as the blade was open. It was nestled on some rocks and the shiny metal blade that was open stood out against the natural colours that it sat on. It was a bit corroded but nothing that I couldn't sort out. I was chuffed to bits with that find. But to keep the balance of Yin and Yang in order, I lost my diving knife about three days after finding the SAK but over 70 metres of water this time so there it remains....DOH!
The next one that I found was whilst driving towards Kings Lynn on the A47. I was pootling along at about 50mph singing a song with the kids when I saw the tell tale flash of red near a lay-by. My wife thought I was mad but I stopped the car and turned around back to the lay-by and pulled in. I was amazed to see that I was right and there it was on the road, another 6 blade SAK with KATHMANDU set on the side of the knife. I reported it to the police and after a couple of months, I was able to keep it. I gave it to my son as he had just started scouts and he was really chuffed.
I am looking forward to finding my next SAK as they say that things come in threes!
Excellent little tool and I would never be without one in my pocket!
Craeg
mortalmerlin
11-08-2008, 13:51
Have had a bell 'n' whistles victorinox one for 20 years and it's still in daily use. I also have a Swiss tool and swiss card (which gets replaced everytime I forget to remove it from my wallet and go to the airport).
Just picked up one of these. A trekker with a plain edge.
http://www4.gvsu.edu/triert/images23/trekker1b.jpg
Just picked up one of these. A trekker with a plain edge.
http://www4.gvsu.edu/triert/images23/trekker1b.jpgNow that is the kind of Knife I've been looking for, shame that they don't seem to be sold in the UK, I for one don't really want to pay $26 for shipping when the knife only costs $29
stevec038
11-08-2008, 15:23
Yes I carry a SAK but a slightly different verson however. It was made by Wenger in conjunction with the American company Buck Knives. It has clip style point blade instead of the traditional spear point and all the other usual attachments. I definite prefer the better point, but that is my personal opinion. They are not made any more as far as I know but old stocks of new knives show up at knife shows and swap meets.
Hi all,
Off course I own several victorinox knives, can't imagine live without one in my pocket. For every day use I always have an victorinox outrider in my pocket. I keep a spare work champ in my car. And somewhere around the house there should be one or two dutch army issue new victorinox knives lying around.
I think I will have a problem if I want to come to the uk though for all the victorinox knives have are equipped with a locking blade.
Do you guyd think it would be acceptable in the UK if I carry it with a jammed locking mechanism (simply bij putting some piece of wood between the switch and the scale ?
Grtz,
Niels
I carry a swisschamp to work but for the last couple of weeks on holiday it's been replaced with a farmer.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v76/rapidboy1/knives%20vol%202/DSC00198.jpg
What are your opinions on the Farmer?
I've always been a Huntsman type through and through, but spotted the farmer in their catalogue the other day. Like the soldier but with a wood saw. Nice & simple.
I'm thinking of getting one, but not sure if it would replace the Huntsman.
JonathanD
28-08-2008, 23:09
IMO the Farmer is possibly THE best SAK there is. Great for EDC, small, safe and reliable. Much better built than it's plastic scaled cousins.
I carry a Victorinox Rucksack, it's a bit bigger than the classic sak so it fits a bit better in my hand imo. The knife locks and it has all the basics I often need and no useless stuff I'd never use... Very happy with it and basically lives in my pocket :)
http://www.discountcutlery.net/media/vn53661.gif
JonathanD
29-08-2008, 16:37
Here's some vintage SAKs, the top one is private purchase and the bottom two are Swiss military issue....
http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a77/darkcrown_1969/DSC00004.jpg
http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a77/darkcrown_1969/DSC00003.jpg
http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a77/darkcrown_1969/DSC00002.jpg
http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a77/darkcrown_1969/DSC00001.jpg
I've got four .The Swiss champ on the right was my eighteenth birthday present.
That means it's twenty two years old :eek: .
http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk274/PossiblesPete/DSC01390.jpg
Pete.
I've got a new 'best SAK ever'.
One of these:
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/31ATC271A0L._SL500_AA275_.jpg
All of the useful tools and none of the guff, the awl is better at the end IMHO and there is even a version of this + a saw.
For some reason it's called the 'electrician', which might put some people off.
Got one, at last! Funnily enough, I've poted for the same one as The Ratbag, a complete coincidence as I didn't know he carried one.
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y94/Spamel/sak/0809140033.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y94/Spamel/sak/0809140035.jpg
Alox Farmer. Didn't look in this thread beofre choosing neither, although it seems to be a popular choice.
Ive got the Camper. Rearly like the Farmer but just wanted the extra shorter knife for whittleling, and the corkscrew for the odd time I buy decent wine. Thinking of rehandleing in wood though.
Rothley Bill
29-09-2008, 22:47
Same one as mad dave the spartan, usually in my pocket at all times but I have to be careful as I fly alot !!
I have used it for about 8 years, replaced the scales when they broke and keep it scarily sharp, it seems to keep a good edge.
mick spain
30-09-2008, 14:29
I have 4 a Wenger evo, swiss card,and 2 Vic non locking ones
I think I need another one!
:D