Gory pics warning

[Countryman]

Won't stop me enjoying a rare steak. How about you?

Rereading your post the CDC talk about the blood of an infected animal. The key words here are "infected" and "zoonotic disease" (Zoonoses)

Blood of a healthy animal is treated as sterile. Otherwise we would not consume it.

When we stalk a deer and at the Gralloch we should be looking for signs of it being in good health both internally and externally. I think we have hijacked this thread enough. Im not going to go through looking for abnormalities here. Needless to say we discard animals that are sick or that have infected external wounds. Certain illnesses we are watchful for must be notified to the Divisional Veterinary Manager at Animal Health. The carcass of healthy animals goes forward for consumption with its Pluck which can also help to verify the health of an animal. So in this we are avoiding contact and sick animals entering the foodchain at all. I don't know how this works in your part of the world?

Diseases are thankfully difficult to pass between species. I was always taught that the less human an animal is then the safer it is to eat. Think of recent history, Birdflu, Ebola and perhaps HIV are all publicised as making that jump. It makes news!

Here is a complete list from public health England of Zoonoses.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/list-of-zoonotic-diseases/list-of-zoonotic-diseases

Its not many and it is still quite species specific.

I wouldn't get too fretful about such illnesses.






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[santaman2000]

Won't stop me enjoying a rare steak. How about you?

Rereading your post the CDC talk about the blood of an infected animal. The key words here are "infected" and "zoonotic disease" (Zoonoses)

Blood of a healthy animal is treated as sterile. Otherwise we would not consume it......

Oh absolutely I like rare steak, even raw on occasion. But those come from domestic animals.

Agreed, only infected animals are a danger. That's why military installations require a veterinary inspection of ALL raw meat before it gets to the chow halls.

On your third comment I partially agree: blood of a healthy animal is treated as sterile unless it's sat out any length of time. However it's still required to be cooked.

 

[santaman2000]

........When we stalk a deer and at the Gralloch we should be looking for signs of it being in good health both internally and externally............

.............Im not going to go through looking for abnormalities here. Needless to say we discard animals that are sick or that have infected external wounds. Certain illnesses we are watchful for must be notified to the Divisional Veterinary Manager at Animal Health. The carcass of healthy animals goes forward for consumption with its Pluck which can also help to verify the health of an animal. So in this we are avoiding contact and sick animals entering the foodchain at all. I don't know how this works in your part of the world?........

Pretty much the same here except that a private hunter isn't required to notify anybody (although we usually do notify the state's Department of Fish & Wildlife. No wild game is allowed into the commercial food chain at all (fish are another matter) Only for private consumption by the hunter, his family, guests, and anyone gifted the meat. An exception is made for wild game dinners for large consenting groups.

 

[santaman2000]

........Here is a complete list from public health England of Zoonoses.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/list-of-zoonotic-diseases/list-of-zoonotic-diseases

Its not many and it is still quite species specific.

I wouldn't get too fretful about such illnesses........

Focusing back on the first paragraph from link and excerpt from the CDC (again, bold emphasis mine):

"A zoonotic disease is a disease that can be passed between animals and humans. Zoonotic diseases can be caused by viruses, bacteria, parasites, and fungi. These diseases are very common. Scientists estimate that more than 6 out of every 10 infectious diseases in humans are spread from animals."


Even your "species specific" list on the link from the UK site lists pretty much every species we'd come in contact with: Wild birds, poultry, ducks, cattle, sheep, pigs, rabbits, rodents, wild animals & wildlife (yep, more than one disease list the whole category) dogs, cats, pets, fleas, horses, donkeys, many mammals (that's awful vague and inclusive) ruminants (again a large group) goats, etc.

 

[mrcharly]

Blood is almost never sterile, it can carry viruses, bacteria and parasites.

 

[Joonsy]

It will be interesting to see what animals take advantage of the huge resource the carcase has to offer them, especially at a time when foxes and badgers are having cubs and birds are starting to nest. I wouldn’t at all be surprised if a badger eats from it, I have myself seen a badger eating from a deer carcase. Foxes are prime candidates of course, as are the various scavenging birds, crows magpies and buzzards etc. Tommy The Cat has posted threads about owl pellets so it would be interesting to see if the owls (and which type) feed off the carcase. As the breeding season is underway for birds I guess some will use the deer hair for nesting material. Carcases soon get covered in blowfly eggs, depending on temperature of course, the anal area and around the nose/mouth soon get covered in the stuff, the larvae/maggots develop slower if it’s cold and faster if it’s warm. I guess the myriad of insect life will have a feast too.

 

[Countryman]

Blood is almost never sterile, it can carry viruses, bacteria and parasites.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bacteremia

Sorry to wheel out Wikipedia.

 

[Countryman]

Oh absolutely I like rare steak, even raw on occasion. But those come from domestic animals.

Agreed, only infected animals are a danger. That's why military installations require a veterinary inspection of ALL raw meat before it gets to the chow halls.

On your third comment I partially agree: blood of a healthy animal is treated as sterile unless it's sat out any length of time. However it's still required to be cooked.

I would personally much rather eat the meat of any healthy animal reared wild or as close to that condition as is possible than anything bought up through intensive "domestic" agriculture. I practice what I preach as I rear much of my own in a low intensity environment free from drugs and chemical drenches.

Contaminants enter sterile blood after death often from the carcass itself but my point was using a source of local water ( for instance washing in a stream) to wash blood from a carcass is more likely to introduce bacteria than not.

The deer in this thread is sitting in a rich soup of bacteria.

Blood in itself is not some dirty, virus riddled poison! There are cultures that drink blood as a part of their diet.

I'm leaving it there because I feel I'm not getting through. Ultimately you can believe what you want. If you ever have to prep and cook wild food then how on earth will you manage? How do you think our forebears managed without nitrile gloves and modern apparatus?



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[Robson Valley]

countryman, you would love the bison here. I shoot Canada geese in a big field next to the bison enclosure. Plenty of time to watch them.
They eat grass & nibble on bushes and drink water. When the wind is right, I can hear them talking to eachother. Nonstop "whoosh-whoosh" sounds.
As meat animals, truely superlative. A side per year since maybe 2002 gives me the hindsight to say that!
The other good thing about buying a side of bison is that I'm in a position to barter for game such as moose/elk and so on.

Very nice venison Farmer's Sausage last night (6 left), bag of venison pepperoni sticks for snack and a good piece of black bear ham (had that before).
Got it all for donating a 14" loaded, home made pizza to my hunter neighbor & pals around his firepit Friday night.

I want to shave that ham, get some rye bread, sauerkraut and good mustard to be washed down with a good dark ale (local).

 

[santaman2000]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bacteremia

Sorry to wheel out Wikipedia.

So you believe wiki over the CDC?

I would personally much rather eat the meat of any healthy animal reared wild or as close to that condition as is possible than anything bought up through intensive "domestic" agriculture. I practice what I preach as I rear much of my own in a low intensity environment free from drugs and chemical drenches.

Contaminants enter sterile blood after death often from the carcass itself but my point was using a source of local water ( for instance washing in a stream) to wash blood from a carcass is more likely to introduce bacteria than not.....

The difference being that domestic stock is inspected.

I agree about the contamination from an unclean stream.

 

[santaman2000]

.....Blood in itself is not some dirty, virus riddled poison! There are cultures that drink blood as a part of their diet.......

Yes. And there are cultures that eat half developed bird embryos that have putrefied. And we eat blue cheeses riddled with bacteria. What's your point? Blood is a body fluid, just like semen, mucus, sweat, and feces. As such it's always a carrier for disease. Or do the blood services reject donations from questionable donors for no reason?

 

[santaman2000]

......Ultimately you can believe what you want. If you ever have to prep and cook wild food then how on earth will you manage? How do you think our forebears managed without nitrile gloves and modern apparatus?......

I've been managing for about 45 years. Like you, I've been lucky. As to our forebears, they all died young.

 

[Countryman]

It's your reading of the CDC info that is faulty.

Look at your example of blood transfusions. If they were all infectious then nobody would risk it. You think perhaps they sterilise all transfusions? No they avoid blood from people in high risk groups.

Healthy blood is not infectious. It's sterile! Not based on a WiKi, nor Google but based on experience, medical training, and qualification as well as qualification in large animal meat hygiene covering the introduction of food to the human food chain.

Santaman do you for one second think that I have offered advice on dead forage for your personal approval?

Seriously buddy how many people have I watched you fight like this?


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[OurAmericanCousin]

That deer was pretty healthy until it died. If you've had a cold winter it would also serve to cull weak or sick animals.

My guess is, providing the animal hasn't been disturbed postmortem, that it may have suffered a non lethal injury to its rear end, probably ended up in some boggy area, thrashed a bit unable to free itself from the quagmire (the coat is fairly intact above the waterline), contemplated its fate and willed itself to die.

I've seen animals ripped nearly in two fight to live and win, while some with apparently survivable injuries just give up the ghost. Almost choosing death.

The bent back head and neck I've seen enough times when an animal has enough time to look around before going. This doesn't look like an especially violent death. The ears were lost post-mortem, I'd say. Corpses don't bleed too much since the heart stops pumping.

Very sad to see this. Hopefully, plenty can feed off the loss.

And Countryman, I'll share a hunting camp with you any day, and unhesitatingly eat whatever meat comes from it. It only took two threads for me to catch on to the baited debates around here, and exactly who the "masters of this baiting" are. Arguing for argument's sake has bupkus to do with outdoorsmanship, but seems to find it's way into threads around here.

 

[Robson Valley]

OAC = I'll be at that fire, also.

 

[santaman2000]

It's your reading of the CDC info that is faulty.

Look at your example of blood transfusions. If they were all infectious then nobody would risk it. You think perhaps they sterilise all transfusions? No they avoid blood from people in high risk groups.

Healthy blood is not infectious. It's sterile! Not based on a WiKi, nor Google but based on experience, medical training, and qualification as well as qualification in large animal meat hygiene covering the introduction of food to the human food chain.

Santaman do you for one second think that I have offered advice on dead forage for your personal approval?

Seriously buddy how many people have I watched you fight like this?.....

As I said, I agree with you on every single point but one: your comment that blood is sterile. And I've agreed with you in most threads we've shared.

 

[mrcharly]

I think maybe you don't understand what 'sterile' means.
I agree with you that there is relatively little risk in coming into contact with blood from a healthy animal. That has a lot to do with our body's ability to cope with unwanted organisms.

 

[Countryman]

Duplicate post.

 

[Countryman]

countryman, you would love the bison here. I shoot Canada geese in a big field next to the bison enclosure. Plenty of time to watch them.
They eat grass & nibble on bushes and drink water. When the wind is right, I can hear them talking to eachother. Nonstop "whoosh-whoosh" sounds.
As meat animals, truely superlative. A side per year since maybe 2002 gives me the hindsight to say that!
The other good thing about buying a side of bison is that I'm in a position to barter for game such as moose/elk and so on.

Very nice venison Farmer's Sausage last night (6 left), bag of venison pepperoni sticks for snack and a good piece of black bear ham (had that before).
Got it all for donating a 14" loaded, home made pizza to my hunter neighbor & pals around his firepit Friday night.

I want to shave that ham, get some rye bread, sauerkraut and good mustard to be washed down with a good dark ale (local).

That sounds superb.

I'm out in Ontario in August and will catch the first week of the hunting season. Outfitter is booked and tags are underway.

We do the barter thing in my part of the world and I love it. I keep sheep, my buddy keeps pigs. Swapsies see us both kept in Lamb and Pork. Bartered an old .410 shotgun once for sorting out a computer. etc. etc.

Black bear ham! Wow. I would be up for that.

 

[Countryman]

And Countryman, I'll share a hunting camp with you any day, and unhesitatingly eat whatever meat comes from it. It only took two threads for me to catch on to the baited debates around here, and exactly who the "masters of this baiting" are. Arguing for argument's sake has bupkus to do with outdoorsmanship, but seems to find it's way into threads around here.

Thank you.