Post-apocalypse Bushcrafting and Scavenging to rebuild the world

[BigShot]

Right - this is not a survivalist thread - the title is just a bit of a laugh.
I expect this could be a rather fun thread, but I'm not after just joking answers - these are things I really want to know. If the things I'm asking could be done post apocalypse, maybe some could be done now too.

Let's say the zombies came, killed nearly everyone and then died of starvation. The world is safe to travel in and there's a group of people who aren't just trying to kill eachother for food.
The nuclear powerstations went into safe mode so they didn't melt down either!


How many of the things we take for granted could we replicate in an essentially bushcraft/non-industrial farming world?

Let's assume we can use all the farm machinery, cars power tools - anything at all...
...but there's no fuel in the petrol stations. We'll need to grow/mine/refine our own. Ditto with lubricants.
We could generate power locally, or even centrally and distribute it, but the power stations won't be running and we won't have the man power to get them up again.

Can we make something like Gore-Tex?
Is there a way we can get phones to work? Maybe starting from scratch if we need to.
Could we even get the internet running again? (again, starting from scratch if needed).
Can we make "proper" shoes so we don't have to wear moccasin type footwear?
Can we replicate some modern medicines with natural resources?
How about effective painkillers, antibiotics and other medicines that allow us to keep those people alive who would usually have died (diabetics for example). [This one might be a bit much for those of us using this forum - maybe we'll have to hope some hot-shot doctors and pharmecologists survive too]

Don't limit it to this list of questions either... I want to get the world back to the current ease and comfort of living, current life expectancy (or better) and so on - anything you can think of us needing or being able to get back in a more natural environment.


This thought was sparked by a Joe Rogan stand-up routine where he said "If I left you alone in the woods with a hatchet - how long until you could send me an email?"
Warning... if you're offended by bad language, and a touch of crude humour - don't watch this!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sf8R5ZlDiJg
Hilarious routine - feel free to watch it and then come back to give some input here.


I'm really interested to hear the responses here.

Have fun with it folks.

 

[gzornenplat]

Did you see Garbage Warrior back in October? Fascinating programme. If you are
interested, I'll put a Flash version of it up somewhere and send you a link.

The description is:

Filmmaker Oliver Hodge tells the story of maverick architect Michael
Reynolds and his fight to introduce sustainable housing in the Nevada desert. For 30
years, Reynolds and his allies have devoted their time to building self-sufficient
communities from sustainable raw materials such as beer cans, car tires and water
bottles, often in defiance of state building laws.

 

[Husky]

For a comedian claiming to be an idiot that is the most thoughtprovoking stuff I have heard in a long time!
I was actually thinking about this when I was reading the "too much kit" thread. For me bushcrafting is partly about improvising stuff that I want but dont have. I will build shelters untill I can find a piece of plastic big enough to use as a tarp and so on but if I didn´t have a cutting tool and wanted to make a stone knife, where should I go looking for flint?
I kan make a muzzelloading rifle from scrap and even make blackpowder of charcoal, but where to find sulphur and saltpeter?
What we could recreate in your scenario would depend heavily on what inhereted knowledge we have. We could make shoes if one of the survivors was a cobbler but he would have to specialize in that while we get food for him. I know where to get leather (its on animals) but how to tan it?
I hope the librarys werent burned by the zombies...

 

[Shambling Shaman]

I'm lucky I would stay where i am

 

[MartinK9]

"Guard the caves with sharp pointy sticks"

 

[Husky]

Reminded me of this...
http://http://www.open2.net/roughscience/

 

[burning]

I kan make a muzzelloading rifle from scrap and even make blackpowder of charcoal, but where to find sulphur and saltpeter?
What we could recreate in your scenario would depend heavily on what inhereted knowledge we have. We could make shoes if one of the survivors was a cobbler but he would have to specialize in that while we get food for him. I know where to get leather (its on animals) but how to tan it?
I hope the librarys werent burned by the zombies...

Easy answer, saltpeter = ebay, you could easily find cheaper if you looked around.
How to tan leather? use the search function on this site there are tutorials, use someone elses brains for the tanning

edit::: there is a thread on here with a link to site with info on every type of animal+plant growing skills, just can't remember it I'm sure someone will

 

[BigShot]

gzornenplat - No, I've not seen that. Sounds interesting.


Husky - he's a funny guy but way off base on a lot of his stuff. I'm not getting into it here but he actually IS kinda dumb - haha.
That said, even though I disagree with a lot of his subjects, there's no denying his material is first rate. He's got wicked wit, is frighteningly good at handling hecklers and speaks his mind, which is something I usually like.
10 pyramid blocs a day is conservative to say the least.
The folk on the documentaries don't know how the pyramids were made - but ask any brickie worth his salt (it helps if he's a bit smart too) how they did it and they'll have 2 things to say.
1> Plumb bob.
2> HUGE manpower.
He's wrong on a few other points too but not getting into that in this thread as it's a whole other discussion!


We can assume the libraries survived.
Division of labour and specialisation is perfectly ok too, in fact, I believe it would be essential for the kind of lifestyle I'm after.

I just want to get all natural alternatives to the high tec products we have.
I'm especially interested in medicine, waterproofs, explosives (including firearms) and the likes.

Sourcing the raw materials would probably be one of the hardest parts!


Again, not wanting to make this about survivalism, the post-apocalyptic was just a scenario - I'd actually like to know about this stuff for real life too! (Not that I'll be making explosives or guns - I'm in no way qualified or licenced for that sort of thing) but the idea of being able to make high quality products without relying on the traditional chains of supply the modern world is built on is one that kinda fascinates me.


Burning - saltpeter on ebay is grand now, but what if you wanted to start completely from scratch?
Joe Rogan left you alone in the woods with a hatchet and wants that email. Haha.


One of the great things about mankind is that we "stand on the shoulders of giants". We owe pretty much everything we have now, including the computers we use to communicate, to everyone who ever invented something new or solved a new problem in the thousands of years of our history.

I want to see where we can go with that knowledge, but in a really small-scale and independent way, so natural medicines, tanning, making properly waterproof fabrics from scratch and so on.


Some cool posts here so far.
I'm hoping people can have some fun with this and really get creative over the weekend and into next week.

 

[gzornenplat]

gzornenplat - No, I've not seen that. Sounds interesting.

OK, I'll convert it, upload it somewhere and send you a link.

 

[Shambling Shaman]

Did you see Garbage Warrior back in October? Fascinating programme. If you are
interested, I'll put a Flash version of it up somewhere and send you a link.

The description is:

Filmmaker Oliver Hodge tells the story of maverick architect Michael
Reynolds and his fight to introduce sustainable housing in the Nevada desert. For 30
years, Reynolds and his allies have devoted their time to building self-sufficient
communities from sustainable raw materials such as beer cans, car tires and water
bottles, often in defiance of state building laws.

I remember watching that is was very good.

 

[gunslinger]

I'm especially interested in medicine, waterproofs, explosives (including firearms) and the likes.

I know its a question,but why would you need firearms and explosives ?

GS

 

[korvin karbon]

I know its a question,but why would you need firearms and explosives ?

GS

hunting and the explosives would be handy for getting construction materials and demolition.

That being said, i reckon i could live in world quite happily without the two of them.

 

[BigShot]

Gunpoweder and explosives - as has been suggested already - for DIY firearms and blasting (quarrying raw materials)

I'd be quite happy to leave that part out of the dicussion from this point on though...
...I know that if I really wanted to find out how to do that from scratch I could find out elsewhere online and I know it is REALLY not appropriate discussion for this forum.


If we stick to things like first aid supplies, medicines, hi-tech fabrics, communication and the likes it'd probably be better and is actually closer to what I relly wanted to know by postig this.

 

[wingstoo]

Can we make something like Gore-Tex?
Is there a way we can get phones to work? Maybe starting from scratch if we need to.
Could we even get the internet running again? (again, starting from scratch if needed).
Can we make "proper" shoes so we don't have to wear moccasin type footwear?
Can we replicate some modern medicines with natural resources?
How about effective painkillers, antibiotics and other medicines that allow us to keep those people alive who would usually have died (diabetics for example). [This one might be a bit much for those of us using this forum - maybe we'll have to hope some hot-shot doctors and pharmecologists survive too]

In the first few episodes of the original survivors the school teacher said the following :-

The impatient sound of a teacher halted in mid lecture by a question he considered foolish.
'Of course there would be enough for many, many years. Though, incidentally, I'm not
convinced that the food would last all that long. But the point is, that while we live on
the debris of civilisation, we would simply be scavenging. And scavenging from a
constantly diminishing supply. The only real future is in learning again. Learn the old
crafts and skills. Teach them to the children so that they can tell the next generation.
Learning is what is important.'
He glanced around quickly. His eye settled on the still burning candle. His finger
jabbed towards it. 'Could you make that?' he demanded. 'What's it made from? Where
do you get the raw material?'
Her voice showed her uncertainty. 'It's an oil product isn't
it? Paraffin wax? And before that tallow. Animal fat.'
'But could you make it?' His finger was jabbing towards her
now. 'Something as simple as a candle. Make it from scratch?'
'I could find how to. It will be in a book somewhere.'​

'That's right. You'll have to learn it.'

He moved quickly to a work bench and
picked up a glass test tube. 'Look at that. We've been making things of glass for
thousands of years. But could you make it? It's silica, potash, high temperature and a
great deal of skill. Don't you see, our civilisation has the benefit of knowledge that has
been accumulated since the beginning of time and yet most of us are less practical than
Iron Age man.'

So from a personal level the answers are.

No
Yes, limited to "local" calls though, about 10 miles good quality
No
No
No
No

 

[gzornenplat]

Hi BigShot,

Here's a link to a flash version of the Garbage Warrior programme.

http://roughian.com/GarbageWarrior/

Currently there is only a very low quality version there, there are other's uploading right now and I'll change the initial page to give a choice when they upload. The current one is watchable - just.

This bloke wouldn't notice any difference if the world's infrastructure failed other than his TV, phone and the internet wouldn't work.

 

[wingstoo]

The only real future is in learning again. Learn the old
crafts and skills. Teach them to the children so that they can tell the next generation.
Learning is what is important.'

Just to add that this is the part that brings me to places like BcUK

 

[wanderingblade]

...but there's no fuel in the petrol stations. We'll need to grow/mine/refine our own. Ditto with lubricants.

Could I ask why one of the very first things we must learn to manufacture would be lubricants? ;-)

I think one of the most interesting things about post-apocolyptic plans is the discovery of how much infrastructure and how many everyday items you just don't really need.

That, and the creeping grin that appears when you realise you are actually looking forward to it happening!

 

[Sniper]

We would require lubricants for wheels, and simple machines just as much as the more complicated machinery we have now except the more primitive an simple machine would only need simpler forms of lubricant instead of the hi-teck stuff sold in the shops. An example would be oil, which can be rendered from birch bark, in a similar way to making char cloth. Ray Mears did a demo of this in the episode about the Russian Jewish resistance fighters of WW2, who also refined it for use in their weapons. To be honest most folks are pretty well educated these days and would most likely come up with many ingenious methods of doing things when they found themselves in those kind of situations, as has been shown many times in history, it just takes the right event to bring it out. Because our lives do not depend on it we tend not to think about it cos we don't have to do it, that of course would change, should the apocolypse happen tomorrow. Firearms would be a must in my opinion, both for hunting and protection for I believe there would be many without the knowledge to survive by any other means apart from scavenging, and when supplies run short and you have a nice little comfortable life with veggies and livestock etc you would become a target of these at some stage, I honestly do believe this.

 

[lee22]

how about taking a car alternator, batteries and whatever else you can lay your hand on and put together a wind turbine or water wheel to power it up, you could set it up for lighting , cb radios etc. might not churn out the same amount of current as it would on an engine but it would deffinately give you more than nothing. or a simpler way wopuld be to hook car batteries up to some solar tricle chargers to do the same job.... add an inverter into the mmix and youd have a low level 240 supply to play with. this idea 'should' allow the continuation of such things as power tool, mobile phones maybe eventually the internet ( although i doubt it)
lee

 

[wingstoo]

I can get TV's working for use with DVD players and Video, I can get Lap tops and desk tops to work as well as most 220, 230 or 240v appliances up to a certain level of wattage, but net work kit like Mobile phones and internet take a whole lot more knowledge and input, even getting a good 3Kw supply for a welder would be quite difficult.

It needs a 1 or 2 Farad capacitor, a car alternator, a 300watt invertor and a TV and DVD/VCR player for watching pre-recorded stuff

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hiWwXp95doY